Considering giving up breastfeeding due to sleep issues - need honest input

[tinierclanger]

DD is 4 months old now and has never really slept well. Until a few weeks ago she occasionally slept 4 hours at the beginning of the night, but now the best she does is 3. She will then wake every 1 or 2 hours and want feeding back to sleep. We spend some of the night cosleeping but not all.

I have no problems feeding her, she is fed entirely on demand in the day and feeds about every 2 hours, sometimes longer, sometimes shorter. I don't want to stop but I am so drawn to the prospect of getting more sleep - some days I cope ok but others I am shattered and a horrible person to be around, affecting my relationship with DH and DS

My fear though is that if I start FF she will wake just as often and then I will have bottles to deal with. In all honesty is this likely or is she more likely to sleep in proper stretches, rather than waking to nibble on me? Obviously the main incentive is that I could get DH to do one night a week and I could just sleep...

There are LOTS of reasons why people can't get enough sleep.

Can you really not see that?

Yes. I can see that. But adults non-sleeping issues should not be imposed onto their babies development.

It's not hampering a babies development to give them a bottle of expressed milk to attempt to get slightly more sleep.

Your totally overreacting. Honestly. No one is suggesting anything outrageous on this thread whatsoever.

I don't have "sleep problems". This is how my brain works and it is also how my dad's and DD's work. There is clearly a genetic component to this.

DS, on the other hand, can just say "I'm a bit tired", curl up on the sofa and go to sleep whenever he likes.

You need to wake up and realise that the entire world isn't like you and your children. It wouldn't hurt to also realise that how other loving parents raise their children is none of your business.

"Why is it OK for a baby to have their sleep pattern forcibly changed by an adult who says they can't change their own? Well, babies tend to have nothing else to do. Mothers tend to have plenty to do. How does your theory work Starlight when there are several children? Should the mother fit her sleep pattern around the baby and ignore the needs of the other children?

Enlighten us, Starlight. How exactly have people here hampered their babies' development?

DD (8) is trilingual and she is in a special school for musically gifted children. DS (4) is also trilingual and has known his alphabet & numbers since the age of 2, and now likes to write & do simple arithmetics. They are both loving and well-loved children full of enthusiasm and laughter.

I would really like to know how exactly you think their development was negatively affected.

"Why is okay for a baby to have their sleep patterned forcibly changed by an adult who says that they can't change their own? "

Because babies do eventually sleep through the night. That is the natural progression of things. Sleep training is only about moving them on this path a bit quicker.

Whereas there is no rule that says all adults can and should be able to nap in the day. There are people like me who can't. There are others who can nap anywhere and anytime. There are many in between. There is no "normal" that people like me need to be sleep trained towards. You are entirely unreasonable and too blinkered to even see that.

In which cultures do everyone get up every night to pray? I'm curious.

StarlightMcKenzie Sat 07-Sep-13 11:39:37

Anyone got anything to say about this point, or are personal attacks as an attempt of defence all you've got?

What point?

Sleep is NOT a cultural construct. It's a biological necessity.

Seriously Starlight, if you were able to get 9 hours sleep in a 24 hour period that's great, but doesn't mean that everyone can do the same. 'Sleep when the baby sleeps' is certainly useful, but some of us have children who sleep fewer than even 9 hours, or others take so long to settle that a nap is ended before the mother can lie down herself. And getting someone else to care for the child while you catch up is not possible for people with partners with tricky schedules, no partners or family close by, and/or no ability to pay for outside help. How would you recommend these people go about getting sleep?

It sounds like you did a great job in a really tricky situation, and that is impressive. Wanting to help others with what you've learnt is great. But coming on here to berate other people currently going through their own really tricky situations without taking into account their individual circumstances is not helping others. What are you looking to achieve?

Genuine question for starlight. Baby no.6 due in 7 weeks, and will be returning to work 4 days a week in Feb (primarily financial reasons but would have been returning at some point anyway). I'll be starting my own thread on the pros/cons/is it even worth trying bf with dc6 but was curious as to where you 'sit' on the total LACK of flexibility for those returning to work to sleep during the day. I'm not trying to add controversy re: working out of the home but this is a very real issue for me and I imagine a great number of other women . I have been fortunate with my ff dcs to have them sleeping through the night by 12 weeks (mainly luck but also gf ) but would like to give bf another go (successfully efb dd1 for 9 mths) .

Christian nuns and monks get up to pray in the night.

Sleep might not be a social construct, but "getting all your sleep in a particular day all in one go" is.

Nuns and monks are not an entire culture and they do other irrational & arguably other unnatural & pointless things like celibacy.

Nuns and monks are not an entire culture and they do other irrational, unnatural, and pointless things like celibacy.

They were the only religious example I could think of. I don't know if very observant Muslims have a night prayer except during Ramadan.

There was a report on the BBC fairly recently about having sleep in two lumps with sex and/or a snack inbetween and how that might be a healthier way to conduct oneself.

Have you considered a cosleeping cot? They go next to the bed so baby has own space and you too. That would let you roll over afterwards?

I understand you can rent them from NCT? They also sell them but renting cheaper www.nctshop.co.uk

Sympathies about the sleep. It is a bastard isn't it?

Nuns and monks have also been known to use other forms of mortification of the flesh - fasting, self-flagellation etc.

I sometimes wonder if the pressure on mothers to put our own needs last comes from a similar place.

No, Muslims don't get up in the middle of the night to pray.

OP your thread's gone a bit mad. Feel free to pm me if you have any questions about Andrea Grace.

I often feel that doing what the baby wants actually works best for me too.

It's weird.

But then I don't have so many other pressures perhaps as other parents. I don't think our society is very well geared to the needs of really young children.

Have pmed you bigkidsdidit. Threads gone a bit crazy. I'll be tuning out posts that reference "whinging" as a bit lacking in empathy.