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Infant feeding

Get advice and support with infant feeding from other users here.

Original poster

It WAS very childish of me, but I got a dig in at some Formula companies today......

613 replies

VeniVidiVickiQV · 04/04/2006 16:55

Got sent a market research survey today asking me my opinions on formula milk.

So i gave them.....WinkGrin

OP posts:
koolkat · 05/04/2006 17:58

HRH = what I say NEVER applies to you and your children - agreed !

But it MAY apply to many other people !

HRHQueenOfQuotes · 05/04/2006 18:00

it may apply to other people either

but then I guess you're the expert because you've got one child that you've successfully breastfed..........

noddyholder · 05/04/2006 18:05

God these threads always kick off but you wouldn't be trying to get a dig in if you needed to feed your baby formula because breastfeeding was impossible

koolkat · 05/04/2006 18:22

HRH - actually I think tiktok is the expert on bf around here - but I do recall she was treated rather ungraciously and ended up apologising to someone (rather unnecessarily IMO).

Sparklemagic · 05/04/2006 18:28

noddyh, I agree. I was very glad the formula companies were there when I was very ill after giving birth and, much to my upset and regret, bf was impossible.

BornBerry · 05/04/2006 18:29

QUOTE - oh and it would have been better than breastmilk as his brother was literally attacheed almost 24/7 - which was extremely draining for me. I simply couldn't have coped feeding a hungrier baby than DS1. - END QUOTE

But this is EXACTLY what I mean about accurate information and support. A bf baby shouldnt be attached 24/7, if they are it can be indicative of a few things; a positioning and attachment issue which means baby doesnt effectively drain the fatty hindmilk thus becomes hungry very frequently. Mum who has scheduled/space feeds and thus now has a genuine supply issue or even a growth spurt. I personally found making up bottles frequently harder than popping babe in sling and having hands free for other two whilst feeding.

Quote - dd was one of these - terrible eczema, signs of allergies, bad reflux and all between being born and around 4 months (and fully fed from me). At 4 months, I went back to work, weaned her on to formula and discovered she had a milk (and soya and egg) allergy. She was put on nutramigen and immediately, her eczema improved and although her reflux didn't go away, there was a small improvement.

I had GPs, HVs all telling me I was completely mad (at the time) but there was no doubt in my mind that she was a far happier baby once I stopped feeding her (must have been my diet)! - End Quote

If an infant has a dairy allergy they may well react to dairy in your diet, as you noted the reaction was much more severe when DD was on "neat" dairy ie formula so its more than likely the diluted proteins in your milk caused a milder reaction for several months. I'm quite surprised you were thought bizarre as dairy and wheat are two common allergens.

themuttsnuts · 05/04/2006 18:31

Wouldn't it be sad if we were all the same?

foxinsocks · 05/04/2006 18:32

bornberry, at the time (we're talking many years ago), I don't think there was a massive pool of knowledge about babies reacting to allergens in a mother's milk.

BornBerry · 05/04/2006 18:34

Just a note from the article I mentioned in this months magazine. Quite a few mums say breastfeeding was rammed down their throat during pregnancy yet the government spend only 14 pence per child born promoting reastfeeding. Formula companies spend £30 per child on
marketing, advertising etc for each child born.

Soooo it seems the government need to take a tip from formula manufacturers in the art of promotion, after all mums apparently dont even realise they are being targeted as a highly lucrative market.

BornBerry · 05/04/2006 18:35

bornberry, at the time (we're talking many years ago), I don't think there was a massive pool of knowledge about babies reacting to allergens in a mother's milk.

ah my apologies Fox I didnt realise :)

moondog · 05/04/2006 18:38

BornBerry,who are you?
Have you posted before?
You make such pertinent and intelligent points
(12:30 today for one)

Staggered at oafish comments re Gabrielle Palmer.
'The Politics of B/feeding' is an incredible book.Life changing in fact.
Reading it made me go from being a sort of 'Whatever' person to the person I am literally overnight.
It really is about so much more than an individual's 'choice' hence the title.

Tiktok,I'm glad you collared GDG before someone else did. She's like a fly buzzing around a dirty plate isn't she?
JT,you are free to protect your offspring as long as I am free to protect the English language form apostrophe abuse (3:15)

GDG · 05/04/2006 18:40

How rude

JoolsToo · 05/04/2006 18:41

if you let me off its I'll let you off 'form' Wink

there are few other collars that need feeling too and some tall black hats Wink

moondog · 05/04/2006 18:42

even stevens 9babe in arms so excuse dodgy typing9

moondog · 05/04/2006 18:43

bb 6 34 post
staggering

lockets · 05/04/2006 18:45

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

JoolsToo · 05/04/2006 18:47

Protection of the English language is permitted - your use of it is rather questionable though. Smile

Keep on and you'll he Head Girl soon.

HRHQueenOfQuotes · 05/04/2006 18:53

But this is EXACTLY what I mean about accurate information and support. A bf baby shouldnt be attached 24/7, if they are it can be indicative of a few things; a positioning and attachment issue which means baby doesnt effectively drain the fatty hindmilk thus becomes hungry very frequently. Mum who has scheduled/space feeds and thus now has a genuine supply issue or even a growth spurt. I personally found making up bottles frequently harder than popping babe in sling and having hands free for other two whilst feeding.

Schedules/spaced feeds - in my dreams - didn't even do that with DS2 who was bottlefed. DS1 hated a sling - and I found it very hard being a shorty (and not a very strong one at that) - he was a long baby and just wouldn't 'fit' properly. I got a lovely sling for the back - but unfortunately that was only when DS2 came along and he didn't need the sling - was quite happy lying on the floor watching the world go by.

Growth spurt - blinking long one - 4 months!!
I think if he wasn't getting enough hindmilk - surely he wouldn't have thrived as well as he did - he never stopped growing - and never 'dipped' on his chart. If you bothered to read my posts properly you would see that he was attached to my breast 24.7 because he used to fall asleep that way, and I couldn't move him - if I did it meant another feed and an even more grumpy baby. Just be glad you never had such a whingy baby as mine when they were little - he was hellish.

BornBerry · 05/04/2006 19:04

I think if he wasn't getting enough hindmilk - surely he wouldn't have thrived as well as he did - he never stopped growing - and never 'dipped' on his chart. If you bothered to read my posts properly you would see that he was attached to my breast 24.7 because he used to fall asleep that way, and I couldn't move him - if I did it meant another feed and an even more grumpy baby. Just be glad you never had such a whingy baby as mine when they were little - he was hellish.

Hi
If mum doesnt restrict feeds and allows 24/7 access often the babies DO thrive. Foremilk is very sugary which is eventually converted to fat so sometimes they actually appear quite high on the charts. I did read your post properly which is why I wanted to reply. Falling asleep resulting in unsettledness and more feeding is also another common indicator that a positioning and attachment tweak could help. Often babes that aren't reaching the hindmilk are descrimed as grumpy/whingy babes too. My friend was in a similar situation but was lucky enough to know a lactation consultant, at 12 weeks she decided to see her and afterwards said it was the first time she said she had been able to sit and gaze at her contented son without him being attached or crying!

I'm not trying to undermine or judge your position which I sense you think I am from the tone of your post, I wanted to reply to try and illustrate just how little accurate information there is out there to help parents after the 9 months of banging on breast is best (plus the poxy 14p the government spend!) If a mum WANTS to breastfeed she should receive the help and support she needs to do so IMHO.

HRHQueenOfQuotes · 05/04/2006 19:07

well actually I did get a LOT of support from 'expert' NCT, La Leche - as I thought there was a problem - everyone I saw said my positioning, and his latch, was absolutely fine.....

BornBerry · 05/04/2006 20:31

Obviously I wouldn't be in a position to comment on the information provided to a particular mum in a particular situation if it wasnt something I was privy to. All I can say is without having xray vision and being able to see inside a babes mouth when they are feeding, it is very diffcult to conclude latch is good in a situation where info from mum would indicate that perhaps might not be the case. As I say this is only one reason given as an example but if a baby is constantly attached and whingy when not then IMHO there IS an issue somewhere, whether the counsellor has the skill to identify exactly what it is, is of course like any other profession.

Realistically though if the people paid to be helping mums ie midwives and hv's were supporting mums effectively there would be no need for breastfeeding counsellors (or raving militants as some like to call them) to be giving up their own time on a volunteer basis to train for 2-3 years before supporting mums for zero remuneration.

BornBerry · 05/04/2006 20:32

ps also meant to add that nobody knows a baby like its mother. ALL hp's are privy to only snippets of information whereas a mum is with their baby 24/7. IME if mum feels there is a problem there usually is.

koolkat · 05/04/2006 21:00

BB - good point re. SALARIED MW's, HV's and GP's generally being a waste of time.

Bf unfortunatley in most western societies is a dying "art". Grandmothers, mothers, sisters, cousins, etc. no longer have the knowledge or experience to show the younger generation how to bf. We end up having to rely on bf advisers (some like LLL are excellent and thankfully available worldwide) or as in my case the internet Grin

You statistic re. 14 pence per child for bf is shocking and very pertinent. Is it any wonder the bf rates in this country are so bad ?

Rhubarb · 05/04/2006 21:05

Is it just me that has no idea what this thread is really about? Is Berrywhatsit for or against? All I can see from her posts are other people's quotes and it's all very confusing!

koolkat · 05/04/2006 21:13

In fact "Berrywhatsit" is making very intelligent points on this thread, and very politely too !