Breastfeeding in public - annoyed!

[nursie]

I know there is a long thread on breastfeeding in public but I thought I would start a new one as I saw something today that really annoyed me!
I am going shopping tomorrow with a friend and ds, who is 3 months old. We will likely be out for most of the day so I went onto the website for the shopping centre I am going to to find out where the Baby Changing facilites are. There are several, which is good, but I was shocked to read a note that said ' There are Breast Feeding facilites in the public toilets.' Oh great, so if I want to feed my baby I'm expected to go and sit in the toilets on my own for half an hour???
I'm fully intending on feeding ds when my friend and I have our lunch, and although I recognise that some women may not want to feed in public, the note did rather give me the impression that feeding in public is not ' the done thing'.
Can somebody reassure me that attitudes to feeding in public are gradually changing?

I never fed in front of anyone except my dh and my mum (and even then that was with my back to her and a cloth over us). I hated it and found it really sore and tricky. If I have another baby I will try again and would love to be able and happy to feed in a cafe etc. but can't imagine I ever could be that comfortable with it. I know it's a shame. But - the more nice comfy breast-feeding facilities that are around the better - IMO!

ummm... we pee in individual loos because we haven't mastered peeing standing up at urinals yet.

I note that men are happy to use cubicles when anything other than peeing is involved.

strange and fairly unsuccessful point you are trying to make there, dadslib

Agree with katierocket here - we don't breastfeed in public to be controversial, we do it because it's normal. I don't think pandering to the prudish by hiding ourselves away is going to help. The more often it is seen in public, the more normal it will seem.

I can't speak for anyone else but, personally, it wouldn't even occur to me to retire upstairs in my own home just to feed dd.

'Afterall, women don't go around topless (or half topless) as a rule in public.' - breastfeeding women don't go around with one tit hanging out all the time! My point was that women who go topless to tan do it when they feel they need to without any thought of embarrassment. So why shouldn't bf'ing women get one out when they need to without being embarrassed? Especially as it's for something vital, not just to get a tan!

....And women could pee in front of each other but everyone uses separate loos for the other thing so why build 2 sets of loos in womens toilets just to pee in public? Strange idea!

Lots of messages of support - thank you! I was fully intending to use the comfy chairs in the cafe where I had lunch but they were all taken, two of them by mums breastfeeding their babies, hurray! The cafe provided a lovely feeding room though which was comfy, spacious and had plenty of room for my friend and I to have a good chat while I was feeding ds.
I feel encouraged now, so thank you all!

A friend of a friend was bf-ing in John Lewis and someone (a woman I think) told her she was disgraceful and should be ashamed of herself. She was quite upset and mentioned it to a passing member of staff. A few minutes later there was an announcement over the store loudspeakers along the lines of "John Lewis fully supports and welcomes breast feeding mothers in our stores..we will not tolerate any harrassment of bf-ing mothers within our stores and we will ask offenders to leave."

Wicked!

I b-fed both of my boys whenever and wherever they needed feeding and didn't have a single negative comment. Am intrigued to know how anyone does it "provocatively" though

Anyone remember a bf-ing Mum having a bucketful of dirty water thrown over her and her weeks old son by an irate shopkeeper (she wasn't even in his shop, she was sitting on a wall nearby)? Still makes me angry when I think about it.

Wobblymum, you say "My point was that women who go topless to tan do it when they feel they need to without any thought of embarrassment." but topless sunbathing is generally confined to "appropriate places" - the equivalent of having an "appropriate place" to breastfeed. You generally don't get a woman sunbathing topless in, say, a cafe. I don't think a cafe is an inappropriate place to bf but it's certainly an inappropriate place to sunbathe topless

I think the point Dadslib wa trying to make when he talked about being "controversial" was not being controversial about feeding in public but feeding in a "whip-your-tits-out/in-your-face" manner IYSWIM! Yes, as one of the less confident women he mentions, the thought that this was how I was meant to bf in public would have put me off, as I said earler. Knowing that it can be done discretely without anyone noticing was very important to me and meant I could feed in public with confidence, knowing that it wasn't obvious what I was doing.

I did not want to deliberately make anyone feel uncomfortable with my bf-ing so I fed discretely. By the same token, I would expect others to respect my feelings and not to want me feel awkward by complaining about it. I never had any negative comments about my bf in public and if I did, I would have told them to off. Well, I would actually have politely suggested they simply look elsewhere or told them that I found their attitude offensive and could they please take it somewhere I didn't have to witness it

Oh, and my father-in-law was one of the people I felt most uncomfortable feeding in front of. Well, all older males whom I didn't know very. Also my dad made me feel odd, I guess because I still feel like his "little girl".

This is a problem that will go away with time - there is a whole generation of bottle feeders out there for whom bf is a completely alien idea. When our children grow up they will come from a generation where bf is on the increase* and, hopefully, be comfortable with it having seen siblings and friends bf. This awkwardness is not going to go away over night

This is very difficult to put into words without it coming across wrongly! Great reaction by John Lewis though !!

at least I think* it's on the increase... is it?

I relly feel that this thread should be almost unnecessary - women have the right to bf where they like and should do. Finis

I agree Soupdragon - it's good that there are super-confident women amongst us who are happy to blaze the trail for us. But we aren't all quite the same - and we don't all live in the same place!

I live in a part of the country where breastfeeding is still very much the minority and, while I didn't really care if people approved or not, I wasn't overly keen on them seeing my breasts (I never really mastered doing it without showing them at all). And I certainly never b/f in front of my FIL - we would both have been too embarrassed.

So, for me, seperate feeding rooms were a godsend, particularly in the beginning. I think we need both general acceptance and additional facilities to help all types of women give it a chance.

it's not a private thing!! It's what they eat! I'm absolutely staggered. I would also love to see all these women who feed their babies provocatively and controversially.... erm... I thought the problem was that breastfeeding rates are dismally low party because of the attitude that it is offensive, embarrassing and shameful. It IS something we should see every day, of course it is. And no, I don't give a stuff about bigots. There are a hell of a lot of people in this country who hate mixed race couples or seeing same sex couples holding hands, but that's not a reason for them to stop, it's a bloody good reason for them to get out there, do it and 'normalise' it in society. The confusion between feeding a baby and going to the toilet really horrifies me. What on earth do they have in common? WHY should a woman be 'discreet'? And, as it happens, I have never went 'upstairs' to feed my son. If they are offended by the sight of my son being given not only his dinner but protection against everything from gastroenteris and cancer, well they ain't welcome in my house. BTW none of my friend sneak off in shame to feed either.

Soupie, have you honestly seen anyone breastfeeding 'provocatively?' I certainly haven't! The whole concept is utterly bizarre to me.

Agree about b/fing cheerily in front of just about anyone. Can I just add, as a 40-year-old myself, that my fellow-geriatrics have never turned a hair - comment from BIL was from Young Person - we are, after, all part of an Older More Tolerant Generation, dadslib...

...and in fact, I realise the only time I've felt embarassed about feeding my baby in public was when dd1 was small and I was using a bottle. Truly. I wanted to proclaim loudly to everyone HONESTLY I BREASTFEED HER TWICE A DAY.

Okay, I'll tell you what breastfeeding INDISCRETELY means . ( would not go as far as to call it provocative)
My brother's wife is the same age as me and had her kids in her early 20s. She bf them all and this was my first adult experience of bf .
She used to sit on the sofa in my parents house in front of my old uncles or whoever (or anywhere for that matter) and hike up her top so both breasts and both nipples were on show. I can tell you I was mortified and it seriously put me off breastfeeding, because I am shy about my body, hate communal changing rooms and all that stuff . Years later when mt sister had her kids and they used to just kind of scoop their babies up under their top I was relieved to see it could be done DISCRETELY because if I was ever to have a baby I woudl NOT like my own breasts to be on show while I breastfed and if I had followed my sister in law's lead I would have been less likely to breastfeed at all.

Soupdraggon said
" I think that far more women would breastfeed if they realised it wasn't a "get your tits out" activity and could be done in public without anyone noticing. " Too true.

Incidentally I am sure my elderly uncles did not find breastfeeding offensive, embarrassing or shameful, just that in his generation you were lucky to ever see your wife's breasts, never mind your neice's.t was out of RESPECT for my sister in law that he did not want to see her bare breasts.
What's wrong with being a wee bit considerate of other people?

Considerate, to me, is realising that when someone is feeding their child, particularly in their own home, YOUR feelings don't come in to it. And Motherinferior, I do know exactly what you are talking about. I am genuinely staggered that anyone who has fed their child thinks it should be hidden away.

ks, goodness knows

Are we talking at cross purposes here?
I'm not saying my sil should have hidden away. I am saying that some women (my sil) made others (including me, a potential bfeeder) very uncomfortable by the way she did it. That's a fact .She did not advance the cause of accepting bf Any bl**dy where you like(which I passionately support) by the WAY she did it.

Aloha, I never said anything about women breastfeeding provocatively. As to WHY a woman should be 'discreet', that's easy. Because she wants to

I fed upstairs when my FIL was around not because he was awkward about it but because I was. Ditto for my father.

I never said that bf should be hidden away. If other women are happy to feed like jaspers SIL with everything out, then fine. I was happy to realise that that wasn't how it had to be - I'd never been exposed to bf before having DS1. Maybe exposed is a poor chooice of word

I am the biggest prude out & would never show anything in public (DH moans that he never sees anything in private either ) BUT I fed all 4 of mine wherever we were & whatever we were doing, when they needed it, for 15 months each. I never went "upstairs" out of the way- if someone didn't like it, THEY could leave the room! My father was a bit iffy to start with, but once he realised that I could shove the baby up my shirt without flashing, he was quite happy not to disappear.

My friend who used to always leave the room couldn't go out for more than a couple of hours in case her DD needed feeding & gave up after only a few months.

KS, did you know before starting bf that there was no need to have everything out? I know now that there isn't but I didn't 4.5 years ago. I was really worried about how I was ever going to manage to feed without flaunting everything to all and sundry Obviously with DS2 I was out and about feeding within 4 days... mind you, now I think about it, I still preferred to do it in quiet corners, but that's the sort of person I am.

Soupdraggon my thoughts exactly.
My sil put me off bf when there was no need to, Tallulah like you I ended up being happy to bf almost anwhere, but not thanks to my sil as a role model.