Due in Jan 2009 - Grumps, bumps and heffalumps (the 3rd thread)

[LenniEd]

He he Loved that idea FLF!

Thanks BG!

Given my RL friends' experiences with inductions, C Sections, VBAC etc, in your shoes I would be hoping for the agreement you have arranged. Actually, given the risks of inductions leading to instrumental births, I would love to have your agreement in place myself!

I am actually tempted to change hospitals now. The next nearest one is at least half an hour's drive away in not traffic though, and is much smaller - but does allow hospital tours! And it wouldn't mean a new midwifery team.

Not at all! I am grateful for the advice, definitely worth getting tours of both hospitals one way or another. At my next meeting I will ask about pethidine for a home birth and some detail on the statistics...

It really is dreadful that so many of us are having problems with antenatal care. Upwind you can change your mind on where to give birth right up until you are in labour - so if you aren't happy with either hospital you can keep checking out your options. My nearest hospital is 40 minutes away on a good run and although that might seem like a long time (and it felt like forever on the way there in labour) it was actually really beneficial as I got almost an hour of labour out of the way in the car rather than stuck in the hospital with all their protocols and things - and I had dilated an extra cm in that time when it took me about 3 hours to make any more progress at all in hospital.

I'd take the homebirth comments with a pinch of salt, some midwives say negative things about homebirths to put you off - they would rather you were in hospital for their own benefit. There are loads of stories and advice about arranging homebirths on Home Birth UK reference site I'm not sure about what the guidelines are generally on this but G&A was mentioned as the only pain relief option when I enquiried about a home birth here. My midwife said they preferred not to use pethidine as they weren't properly equipped at home for the potential (but rare) complications it could cause if the baby was delivered shortly after the pethidine was administered.

MrsMagpie I can't believe the person at your work! If I had a pound for the number of 'In my day...' comments I've had since I was first pregnant I'd be rich beyond my wildest dreams. It seems to get worse the older DD gets too - and my MIL and her family are the worst culprits!

Having thought about the pethidine some more - I think that was related to the distance to the hospital from my area as it could be 20 mins for an ambulance to get here and 40 mins to the hospital and they considered it too long. If you are closer to an ambulance station then perhaps it wouldn't apply... although that sounds all very dramatic I think that was part of the reason they didn't offer it as they had to cover themselves for worst case scenarios.

Reading what some of you have had to put up with is making me thankful for the care here - the hospital itself doesn't have a great reputation, but the midwives have been lovely, and they actively promote homebirth, which I'm hoping for this time round.

I don't know what any of the policies are when it comes to g&a and pethidine... With ds I coped ok with g&a as I was in the pool so I'm hoping that with a pool at home, I'll manage just on the g&a... you live in hope, huh??

columboswife i didn't even do those blood tests. they can see some problems at the 18 week scan... which i just had although i am very adamant that i am a week behind what my expected confinement conception date is by the midwife. anyhow. if you would keep the baby no matter what, like me, then there is no point having a possibly damaging test or stressful pregnancy. well, that's what i figured for me anyhow.

upwind i would suggest going up to the hospital on your on accord and cruising around. it should be relatively open. if it was the midwife that said it, i would go ahead and ring the hospital to find out for sure. she may just be talking out her ass.

i agree that some midwives and doctors prefer you to be in the hospital simply because it makes it easier for them. i am very lucky here because not only did i get to interview and choose my midwife, she is also very supportive and encouraging in the home birth department. she has delivered over 2000 home births in 20 years and she said only a small amount of them transfered and most of them weren't for emergencies but for pain relief. she said that you, as the pregnant person, knows when something is not quite right or that you are uncomfortable long before there needs to be ambulance or airlifting to hospital. a taxi is an efficient mode to get to the hospital. i get he feeling that midwives are not trained the same in the UK as in Canada. here they have the travel versions of the equipment you find in a delivery ward and they are trained to nursing/emergency medic quality. mine also practices acupuncture/pressure.

my scan went great... well, as far as i could tell. don't get the full run down till i speak with my midwife. i'm having a girl too. was hoping for a boy, but girls rock too. she was so very active as well, even with my excruciatingly full bladder, doing somersaults. also very photogenic. lots of profiles. the super smiley sonographer explained everything as we went along and when it came time to find the left arm, which we knew was there because we saw it when we first started as she was sucking her thumb... or trying to, all of sudden it came flying out from her back and i swear she flipped the bird. we got a shot of it. very funny. her mother's daughter.

too bad for all the large breasts out there. i thought i had it tough at 34dd. i won't complain anymore.

i'm actually thinking about new years. a friend is throwing this fab party at Crystal Gardens which is a tropical... ummm.... i don't know what to call it. there's a tropical garden, little monkeys, flamingos, butterflies, birds, that sort of thing. it's tacky but lovely all the same and he has a catering company and know that place would be amazing and it will be a black tie affair. i really really want to go. my due date is Jan 6th (according to me) and i think i could pull it off. i have a dress design in mind to make and everything. DH thinks it would be great too. it'll be a sit down dinner and dancing, live band. oh i want to go but am worried a little about leaky breasts and labour coming early because of the excitement. anyone else due so close after the new year thinking of throwing caution to the wind and go out for new years.

Upwind, I read somewhere that the transfer rate for first time home birthers was about 40% -- and they still do better in terms of outcome (quicker births, less interventions) even when in the hospital than hospital-planned births.

Another thing you could try is calling the patient advisory/ advocacy/ complaints line for your hospital -- I think every hospital has to have one and in my experience they are really helpful since they are set up to help patients overcome obstructions they are facing within the hospital.

Chefswife, your care sounds lovely -- the people I've seen have been absolutely brilliant so far, but the shabby surroundings and hour-long wait for scheduled appts get a bit depressing... and why not plan for New Years but stay flexible so that you won't be disappointed if you just feel too knackered to go.. or maybe even have your baby by then, who knows?!!

MissJackson - I am sure I read that too, but the midwife was talking about the area her team covers. She would not be pinned down to an approximate number. The midwifery team don't have access to email either, which is a shame, because I would love to have this stuff clarified in writing. I did not like or trust the midwife - she also measured my height as two inches shorter than it is, and claimed I was underweight (I am really not - have never been heavier than I am now). I will try the hospital's patient advisory line, but would be really surprised if she was proven wrong about their policy.

Thanks LenniEd As far as the pethidine goes, I would prefer not to use it, but would like it to be there in case I needed it - say before transferring to hospital.

chefswife I wish I'd had your care, I do have matching boobs though and always thought they were massive too! I would plan to celebrate New Year's even if my EDD was as close as yours is. If you are not up for it on the day then take it easy! If it is your first baby they are an average of 8 days late so it should be okay!

Another place good for info on specific hospitals is Birth Choice

I am going to go out on New Years - although not due until the 13th Jan. I went to the supermarket and sale shopping whilst in labour with DD (1 day after my waters had broken and whilst having contractions) so can't see labour stopping me from enjoying a nice meal and some dancing! My previous experience of labour though was quite long really - 3 days from when my waters broke to the actual birth, so I might get more of a shock with this one! I always used to think that labour would come on really suddenly but when it actually happened it was a really slow build up and really not all that dramatic - so if past form is anything to go by I'll be fine... and second babies don't come quicker do they?

by new year i will probably be knee deep in nappies and formula and would love to go out but i am sure i will be awake feeding one of the twins or with toddlers awake because of the fireworks that go off from 10pm to 4am where we live.
i will be thinking about you lovely ladies enjoying yourselves, i hope you have a nice (non alcholic) drink for me.

Lovely, according to your link Lenni, the normal birth rate at my two local hospitals is 50%. thats nice and encouraging.

FourLittleFeet - for me the normal birth rate at my local hospital is 22% and for the alternative it is not given

I am really scared of instrumental delivery so it is not encouraging to see that over 17% of births at that hospital end up being instrumental.

I would be all for a home birth except that I felt little confidence in the only midwife I have met. I am not sure I want her to be the only professional nearby as I give birth. Maybe it would be worth going for it and hiring a doula.

I am now waiting for a call back from my GP. I'm going to ask her what my options really are.

I have a hospital 20 minutes down the road from me with a brand new maternity unit. Trouble is this is in a different county therefore staff at my Maternity unit wouldn't contact them about a ultrasound. Instead I have to travel 40 minutes via a busy city ring road to get to my actual hospital and guess what no tours.

Health care in my area is usually so good and I have never come across these sorts of issues before. I think it is because the type of care needed is very different when pregnant to when ill.

Upwind what a cow!! I had a long chat with my midwife about homebirth options. Basically she explained the lack of pain relief and said that i should be prepared to trnsfer if need be but at the end of the day it was my choice. Stick to your guns, they can't say no.

Morning!

Chefswife your scan sounds fabulous, how great that you feel so well looked after too.
I'd go for it with N Year if I were you, babies are so unpredictable after all!! Like other people are saying, as long as you're flexible, it'll be fine.

Having said that, we've been invited to a wedding 2 weeks before my EDD, a 4 hour drive from home.. and seeing as ds was 2 weeks early (and both my bro and I were 3 weeks early) I'm not sure whether to go! The drive puts me off the most, if it was more local I'd be there (almost) whatever!! ah well, we'll see at the time...

LenniEd ta for the link. Homebirth stats look pretty good in my area, consistently around 8%. At the hospital, the c-section rate is 29%, with no other figures given, which is a bit harsh. But then it is really important to bear in mind the kind of hosp it is - ours is the only one in the area with a PICU, so all high risk mothers in the wider area go there just in case their babies are high dependency, and of course that skews the figures.

I had ds there, and had a pretty good birth (especially the first 3/4 of it!), ended up ventouse + episiotomy but actually that was ok, felt really well looked after and wasn't the nightmare instrumental delivery that NCT classes had led me to expect
Upwind have you had an instrumental before? or other reasons for being worried?

to hire an independant midwife is £1500. Almost thinking its worth taking out a loan for . Just read the rest of the survey. it is enlightening.

I think after all this negativity we should all go out and buy the Ina May book on just how natural child birth is and how we can all do it in field on our own.

Lets beat the trend and be the lowest c-section thread yet!

I actually am tempted to read Ina May or even books on freebirthing! Not because I would consider the latter, I wouldn't, but would like reassurance that my body can do this, and even if the professionals with me are not very good it should still be fine. I don't think I can justify the cost of an independant midwife, but maybe a doula would be worthwhile.

I am scared of inductions really - because everyone I know who had one has wound up with a traumatic instrumental birth. My mother was left with permanent damage (admittedly a long time ago) and a couple of years ago a close friend's induction/instrumental birth left her baby profoundly disabled. I know these stories are not representative and I shouldn't even be posting them on this thread but I would prefer c-section to induction if I was overdue or there was any complications. Hopefully I won't be in that situation anyway. If instruments were needed while I was in the process giving birth, then of course I would hardly object!

8% homebirths sounds really good. Around here it is 2%, not surprising really!

Ina May has a wonderful bit where it describes how contractions work and how to ?enjoy? them . but it was really interesting and helped me through the few I was allowed. Beware though, the book has a few money shots (hairy AND scary).

I also have the hypnobirthing affirmations, if anyone is interested nearer the time, let me know if you are interested and I can try and ftp them.

Upwind, I had an instrumental delivery with ds, ventouse cup. Given that I'd been induced and that I'd spent far too much of my long labour (26.5 hours from first contractions to delivery) strapped to monitoring equipment, I was quite relieved by that point, I think I was just too tired. My stitches were done well and healed quickly.

I keep looking wistfully at the stories of homebirths and birthing pools but I just don't feel optimistic about my chances there. I'd like to be at home and find help and support to establish feeding afterwards, not be kept in on a ward where back in 5 minutes turns into 3 hours.

My real problems were about the few weeks shortly after the birth, when ds was taken back to hospital with dehyrdration, we were kept there for 8 days, I never managed to reestablish breastfeeding and was made to feel like an unfit mother.

I'm booked to see a consultant on Monday because I said yes to a question about PND. Actually, I think my misery after the birth was more about feeling I'd failed. I don't really know where to start that discussion with the hospital, I get angry and cry every time I think or talk or post about it.

I'd like to see an emphasis on a better experience of birth for us all, even if we do have to have interventions/need pain relief, and for better NHS care.

Saying all that, I would prefer not to be induced etc, but I would prefer another induction to a csection. I'm hoping that this time the change in my due date will make it less likely, I still don't believe that ds should really have been born on his EDD or that he was really as late as that made him seem (10 days including the induction time itself which was more than 24 hours).

elkiedee, it sounds like you had a traumatic experience, both with your ds's dehydration and his birth. You did NOT fail, you did the best you could based on the advice you had available at the time.

elkiedee, it sounds like you had a traumatic experience, both with your ds's dehydration and his birth. You did NOT fail, you did the best you could based on the advice you had available at the time.