MARTIANS 2014 thread 12: the one where we do nowt but eat.

[prambo2thereturn]

Oooh, double Corrie tonight!

Great to know you're no longer in pain, hope it stays that way.

Fingers crossed you get the all clear soon.

Lyra, I'll bet you can't wait to get home. Hope you're seen to soon x

Thanks for sharing about weight gain, ladies.

Moosey, tell me more about why you would ingest your placenta. I'm not being facetious; genuinely curious.

I can't wait for The Omen to go home. I'm sorry, I know you all expect more of me but I don't want to tolerate four shit-filled nappies from an otherwise normal eight year-old (in fact, I don't tolerate them; DH does all that). I don't want these meal-time battles. There is no warmth in Oliver whatsoever. He has impeccable manners (please and thank you) but will not obey instructions or do as he is told in lots of circumstances. He makes life so difficult for himself and for me and I honestly do not think DH has enjoyed him being here this last 24 hours. Yes, he loves him and really enjoys their Saturdays together but having him to stay is a whole different ball game.

I know I won't want him staying over when my baby is born. There is nothing easy or relaxed about having Oliver in the room and I don't want to have to cope with these feelings when I have a new baby

How do you think Oliver will be with the baby pram? I'm pretty certain I'm going to be able to trust my two with the baby, they won't pick him up etc without asking, but it doesn't sound as if that will be the case with Oliver?

Lyra I hope they hurry up and see you soon.

I think we will make our first baby purchase after the next scan, a little baby gro for baby's first night.

Pram I know you say that you aren't convinced that Oliver has Autism, but so many of the things you say about him are classic signs of being on the Autistic spectrum. Just for arguments sake, could you accept that he does have Autism? That way you could maybe try some coping strategies designed for children with additional needs.

It can't be easy for any of you. But I can't help thinking that the little boy is the person who will be struggling the most. Especially when the new baby comes along.

A whole weekend sounds like quite a long visit if it's the first time he's been to your house in a while. It also sounds like you've done a very good job entertaining him with minimal resources, and I'm not surprised you're fed up. Maybe another time he could come for just a day rather than a whole weekend? With a definite plan for an activity to occupy him? Nobody can expect more from you than to do your best and it sounds very much like you've done that: moaning at us is totally fine, especially if it stops you moaning at him!

I don't have a lot of experience of children in terms of discipline but I'm not sure it's surprising for them to test the boundaries in any new situation, and if he hasn't stayed with you for a while this would probably count as new. I think a lot of children in this situation would play off the various adults against each other i.e. go home and tell his mother 'I want xxx like I have at pram's/dad's house' - it sounds like he's done that to some extent in the past by taking toys from your house home with him.

In terms of lack of 'warmth' - do I remember you saying he has Asperger's? Is it to do with that? And did I read that right that he's still in nappies??

It sounds like you need a well-deserved rest once he's gone anyway!

I don't think Oliver will have any interest in the baby. He only seems to want to engage with other human beings if there is something in it for him; if he can exert his control over the rules of a game or if he can dictate someone else's behaviour he is happy. I can't see a baby holding his interest whatsoever. I would certainly not trust him to be alone with a baby, even though I have seen no signs of cruelty in him.

I'm free! I feel like I've been let out of prison. And the car didn't have a ticket on it despite me not paying and displaying since Friday night. Got home in time to spend an hour with DP before he went to work.
They're going to bring my 20-week scan forward to tomorrow, so pretty big day for us what with seeing "our" restaurant in the evening.

Pram, it sounds like such hard work having Oliver to stay. You're doing your best (and doing great). Nobody can ask more of you than that. I don't get why nobody is doing anything about the nappy situation.

Grey, I also don't get the placenta-ingesting thing. Why would you want to do that?

Thanks, Hottie & Imeg, everything you say is spot-on. I do try to conduct myself as though Oliver is autistic, otherwise I would be fucking strangling him. I can see, for instance, that it literally pains him when he is faced with the prospect of eating certain foods. His nappy-filling (yes, Imeg, he wears nappies) is a clear sign of autism, I suppose, but it is fucking frustrating for DH, who is clearly sick of it. How can you not feel a giant turd exiting your arse at eight years-old? How can you allow that shit to fester until one of us smells it? I hate it. I hate that we have a (supposedly; probable) autistic child on our hands. I hate that I have to learn to love someone else's child when I soon to be embarking on motherhood for the first time.

I don't care how unloving this sounds. How am I supposed to love a child who is that fucking uncompromising when I only see snapshots of him and he is so otherwise spoiled and indulged?

Lyra, so pleased you've been released

Oliver sees some kind of 'shit specialist' every so often, who has, unsurprisingly, done fuck all to develop Oliver's sphincter acknowledgement.

Imeg, I spent two years with an ex-boyfriend coping with his severely autistic daughter whom I loved dearly. She had to wear a crash helmet, such was her self-harming bahaviour. We had a 'soft room' made entirely out of inflatable walls and floor so she could go and freak out in safety. She was entirely mute and doubly incontinent (she was seven at the time). Her rages were terrifying and there was no communicating whatsoever (she didn't know even who her dad was). Still, I loved her and we got much pleasure from one another. Oliver, though, is a different kettle of fish and I don't know where I am with him. I don't spend enough time with him to develop any substantial relationship or even dynamic (me and the ex had Katie for half the week every week) and nor do I wish to. When this baby comes I won't have the energy to deal with him and nor do I wish to. Harsh but true. I'm hoping DH will go and do his fatherly business over at Oliver's.

He does sound difficult to love. I'm sure any of us would struggle in the same situation.

I know some autistic children and none of them have this nappy problem. Sound to me like people are using autism as an excuse not to get it sorted. And the longer is goes on, the bigger a problem it will become. It should not still be ongoing at his age.

Hello everyone! Eventful night for me and DS - went to A&E in an ambulance as DS's wheeze became so bad he struggled to breathe. Very scary. Afterwards, DS (4) said "was I near to dying?"! As soon as they got steroids into him at the hospital he recovered his breathing to a mild darth vadar rattle and they were happy to let us home at 4am. We crashed out and got up at 10.30. Am knackered! I think - once he realised he wasn't dying - it was e best night of DS's life. We have had to phone many people to tell them about it this morning.

Pram actually I don't think you sound harsh and uncaring at all. Uncaring would be "I don't give a shit about this kid and never intend to", whereas what you're expressing is a resentment at having to make an effort to care for and involve him, even to try to love him which does sound like hard work to be honest. You are actually being very forthright about how a strategy needs to come into play with this kid - a proper diagnosis, a treatment plan, a way forward. Currently it seems to you that it will be like this with Oliver forever, so no wonder it seems like a thankless slog! Once he's gone, can you and DH discuss how to embark on a sort of action plan? Obvs his mum would need to be fully on board too. But you can't go on like you are and I think you're being very honest and mature by acknowledging that to be honest.

Lyra so glad you're out! We were only in for 4 hours last night and it drove us crazy! Bet it feels good to be home.

Am off to make a bacon and egg sandwich now!

"very honest to be honest" - too much repetition in that post sorry! Still knackered

Lyra, thank you and thank you, too, Pirate's, for your kindly post. Very understanding, all of you. May I finish this saga and leave you in peace? For the past couple of hours DH and Oliver have been hiking up one of the tors around here and, on there return, produced an injured sparrow from their rucksack. I enquired of th'usband what the fuck I was supposed to do with a limping bird, after all, this isn't Rolf Harris's Animal Hospital. Th'usband shrugged (he had clearly been directed to bring it home by The Omen and was afraid to say no) and so I set the bird free in our garden. Damien began screaming the place down: 'I want to take it home! I want to take it HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOME!!!!' I asked him to stop howling but he launched into a tirade, screaming how he wanted a pet (he has had a jack russell which was returned shortly after Christmas due to Oliver getting bored of it) and that a dog, cat, parrot, mouse, snake would all be SHIT and only a bird that was injured would do.

At this point I told DH to take him home, that I cannot cope and that Oliver does not return for a sleepover until his mother, DH and me sit down together and discuss coping/behaviour strategies for this child (I had this conversation away from Oliver so he could not hear me). Why the fuck should I be subjected to this in my own home when his mother and father are equally as bamboozled and clueless as I? If they showed the slightest signs of having a handle on this boy then I would feel compelled to share their understanding, but, as far as I can tell, they don't. Th'usband doesn't spend time enough with Oliver to be able to know what the answers are and I'm fucked if I'm feeling my way blind. I'm not fucking having it, especially when our baby comes. Fuck it.

*their!

Lyra - really glad to hear you are out, fingers crossed for the scan tomorrow.

Pram - so sorry to hear his visit ended like that, I can hear your frustration at not knowing what to do for the best, it must be really hard. You don't sound unloving, just struggling to deal with his particular needs.
Sitting down together with his mother (and maybe any professional support he has if any?) before any further visits sounds like a very good idea, once you've recovered from this weekend.

Oh pram feel for you. I think Pirate has put it very well. You're trying to do your best in a difficult situationwithno guidance, especially from the two people it that matter the most to. (My 2 pence) I think this is a good time to discuss future plans with your OH.

If he's found this difficult he'll appreciate that you won't be able to support him they way you have this weekend. So when prambino is here something gotta change. E.g. the length of visit or where the visits take place.

Pirate what a scare last night. Glad everything is ok now

lyra so happy you're feeling better.

Thank you, ladies, once again. Whilst DH was on his journey home with Oliver I texted this to the boy's mother: 'Victoria, with regret, Oliver is not able to stay over again until you, [ManPram] and I meet together to discuss boundaries and behavioural strategies for Oliver. The shitty nappies and refusal to eat and general disobedience are very difficult to bear and I will not tolerate it when our baby comes. Please discuss with [ManPram] if and when you would like us all to meet up. Pram.' I received this immediately: 'As soon as possible...'

I followed up with: 'I understand he may be slightly autistic but much of Oliver's behaviour is plain disobedience. He jumps all over the furniture, refuses to make his bed or take his dishes away and thinks he can do whatever he pleases. I understand much about autism but there are aspects of Oliver's behaviour which are nothing to do with this condition and it is these traits which I would like to discuss before future contact. Thank you.'

I think ManPram is going to go fucking nuts when he gets home..

Pirate so glad your DS is ok, what a terrible scare!! What had caused it???

Pram it sounds like you are doing the best you can given the circumstances. Two of my nieces are autistic so I know something about it all (clearly not an expert) but a lot of The Omen's behaviour seems far more to do with a lack of boundaries and consistency rather than any kind of actual disorder. Its unfair on you, but it's also unfair on him - what will happen if this behaviour is allowed to continue, what sort of life will he have as an adult if all he has known is "it's not my fault, it's my autism"?

Lyra so glad you're home! Good luck for tomorrow's scan.

I stopped at my MIL's last night so DH could blitz the house tidy in peace without me or DS getting under his feet. Called in at Primark on the way home and bought an obscene amount of clothes (for all of us, and baby, not just for me) for £40 :)

Pirate Gee whizz, that sounds scary. Glad your DS is okay now

Rock My MIL said that Primark have some lovely little babygrows and things in at the mo. What did you buy?

Hot I just got a few cheap sleepsuits for the baby, nothing too exciting. They aren't really any cheaper than supermarket clothes, but we don't have a local primark so wanted to stock up while I could get there :)

Pirate's! I didn't respond to your hospital rush! I'm so sorry you had to contend with that, poor child and poor you

RockChick, thanks. I was dreading DH coming home but he just arrived and was far more sanguine than I expected. I asked him if we could talk about the weekend and he said 'no, I really don't want to talk about it, I'm going outside to sort my van out'. I followed him out and gently told him that I am feeling miserable about Oliver's stay and a complete failure. He simply replied, 'Me too, Pram. I feel like a failure, too'.

Pram, it must be so difficult for you both. If the ex does want to discuss things it's a very good sign and it might help you all cos I can't imagine she is having a fun time of it either. Maybe this weekend will be a catalyst for things changing.

Lyra - glad you are home and feeling better.

Re weight, I lost 9lbs in the first trimester and haven't put anything on since. Which is a very good thing as I really need to try not to put any weight on during this pregnancy. Although if I keep eating like i have the last couple if days that might be difficult . Still. Not drinking is helping massively. I was such a booze hound before I got pg!

owl i will definitely not be doing it myself if i do!

pram im a sucker for the health benefits hollywood propaganda (don't know if thats from living there) but i know its a bit silly - conflicting stuff on it so just kinda think ah well why not! not a great reason but ill give most things a go haha!

sorry you've had such an eventful weekend but it does seem to be something everyone wants to address?

lyra yayyyyy!!!! god tomorrow will be an exciting one for you - look forward to hearing your news!!! I'm ingesting it in pill form, don't think i could do a smoothie though haha!

hope you and your ds are ok pirates