"Too Beautiful for Earth" For Sylvie-Rose and all our Angel Children

[chipmonkey]

For my darling Sylvie-Rose, taken from us just seven weeks after you were born. Too beautiful for this earth but I so wish you could have stayed nonetheless.
And for all the Mums walking this tough path. Let us link arms along the way and not be defeated by the cruel blow life has dealt us.

chip Mr Tumble - well you've got me all excited now

sh77 I've not yet had that experience, and to be honest I dread it! chip is right, just remind them. DD is of course a huge part of the family. My dad often upsets me by forgetting that he has 2 granddaughters, not just one (they're both mine, they have 2 grandsons too, one my DS who's 20, and my DN who is 10). He mainly refers to Tamsin as "the baby", and he's the only other family member, bar me, DH & DD1, who acutally saw her, though he regrets it.

Caz I feel really guilty too. We went three times a week up to Christmas, then twice, now just once a week. I feel a bit as if I've abandoned her. I do like going there mostly, but at other times I don't - I've never told anyone that before, and I guess it makes me a horrible person. I do (at times) think of what might be happening to her... I try so hard not to, but the fact that she was macerated when she was delivered, makes it obvious what the effects of death are.

My bereavement midwife has finally returned my call, but we were going to toddler group, so she will call later. I don't know whether to be brutally honest & tell her everything?

I remember the first time I ever spoke to her - Wednesday 26/10/11, in the evening. She rang to tell me what I could expect to happen when they induced me, to talk about whether to have a post-mortem, and to think about funeral arrangements - burial vs cremation. I was in a daze, I had my hand on her head... she was still inside me ffs! How the hell could you be talking about the burial of your child, that still hadn't been born? I still put my hand where her head was (she was always transverse). Her head was under my rib on the left-hand side. Whenever I visit her, I always put my hand there... stupid eh? I know she's not there, but I want her to be. I wish (this is mad I know) that I could have kept her in me forever, I hate that she came out, and I lost her immediately.

I can't believe that trolls would actually come to a thread like this (if that is what was meant). It is inconceivable to me, that someone would lie about such a thing. I wish I wasn't on this thread, I wish I was on the parenting thread, moaning about looking after two under-twos.

I don't think dh would remember our living childrens' birthdays if I didn't remind him!

I have a huge apology to make to my dad. I phoned up (to speak to mum, but dad answered), and he was moaning about Dsis & Db. Then he told me that he'd been crying about Tamsin (yes, he called her by name). He dreamt about her last night, he was holding & cuddling her. He choked up talking about it. It made me realise that I just don't understand him sometimes.

Mum, on the otherhand, is making me feel bad. She came on the phone to tell me that I should contact PALS. I should complain about this & that. To me it all seems pointless, and right now I definitely don't feel strong enough.

Tamsin is dead, knowing things could/should have been done differently, won't bring her back, and that is the only thing I want. I'm convinced mistakes were made, but I'm not sure how much complaining right now will achieve.

I guess it's different for mum. I have no idea how she feels, none at all. She has all three of her children, alive. I was going to have the same, but now just have two again. I know she's upset about losing a grandchild, but I know she worries more about me. When she was told they cut my uterus up the sides, as Tamsin was so difficult to deliver (she had no muscle tone, so was "slippery), and they wanted to deliver her intact, my mum was upset, because I bled very heavily - it was touch & go for a while. My mum said that they should have got her out any old how, rather than subject me to more danger. I know she means well, but I can't quite believe she truly thinks that.

She's very angry that they induced me for so long that my uterus ruptured, she has contacted our MP about it. I do feel under a bit of pressure.

tami, my MIL was a bit like your Mum after Sylvie-Rose died and in the end SIL had to tell her to back off, that it wasn't helping me or dh and it wasn't bringing Sylvie-Rose back. And in the end, as it turns out, there's nothing anyone could have done and our hospital were not to blame. There may come a time when you feel strong enough to pursue it but only when you're good and ready.
Your poor Dad. I think some men of that generation find it hard to talk about things and then it all comes out later. I'm glad he spoke Tamsin's name, I know you were finding it hard when he called her "the baby'

Sh77 can't add much more than these wise ladies already have. I do think people very much take their lead from you so if you feel you can do say if you are struggling. I don't think by saying to your sister how happy you are to be an aunt but that you wish your dd was here to see her little cousin too that you are taking any joy away. Erin only died 7 months ago but I already dread the day people stop mentioning her. Talk to your dh you might be surprised at how often he thinks of her too xx

Caz thank you for your wise words the other day about fear in this pregnancy. Now I'm back at work I only manage to get to the cemetery once a week. Sometimes I feel guilty too but we shouldn't really. We are doing what every mother does - our best.

Tami sorry to hear your dad is feeling low about Tamsin but am glad it's helped you realise how much her little life means to them. Be firm with your mum if you're not ready to pursue PALS. Im not sure I'd have the strength/energy at the moment, you have so much going on. If and when you do feel ready; think what you want to achieve from it to keep you going. Sadly as you say it can't bring Tamsin back but what an amazing legacy it would be to her if there was a procedure/policy change that prevented another women having to go through what you did. Hope you enjoy toddler group and the chat with the bereavement midwife is helpful.

chip whatever it was lovely that dad acknowledged Tamsin.

I've emailed my consultant's secretary, and am waiting to hear back.

My bereavement midwife did call me, and I spoke to her about some things. She recommended a brilliant grief counsellor, called Jenni, but she is in the States, so she gave me the number of the Child Bereavement Trust in Saunderton. I've already got their details, but feel a bit about counselling, though I'm beginning to feel I need it, if only to separate Tamsin, from the other things in my life, and make correct decisions.

I wonder if I could give thanks to the lovely ladies at Stoke Mandeville Hospital, who helped me through it all. They have a special room - The Primrose Room, for women like me. I hope that other hosptials have the same resources, as to be in a regular labour ward would be torture.

sh77 so sorry about your DD, and that she doesn't seem to be acknowledged by your family. There is a beautiful piece of writing which has been posted her before as an OP "Say their names" which I will PM you. It is beautiful, and describes how important acknowledging a child is, even if they are no longer here. I am sure that your family don't mean to hurt you, but at the same time, if you don't tell them, they will never know to change their behaviour. Like most people, they probably feel awkward, and would appreciate your lead on what works best for you. It's tough that you have to do it though...

tami big kudos for you for doing all those things, and being a place where you can see that they could help you.

Hearing your father talk about Tamsin must be a huge relief for you, as I know how hurt you have been about that. I guess that it just shows how people deal with grief and pain differently...

I think it is very evident that your mother also cares for you desperately, hence her suggestions, even if you don't want them. She would do anything to make you feel better, and she is coming from a good place, despite you feeling her ideas are mistimed for the moment.

FWIW, we don't think things were done correctly for Mia, so we are going down that route. Hard but necessary. But we do have a lot of support to help us through. DH has a lot of anger, whereas I want to see real change, and if I have to, I will write to Cameron or whoever to get things changed!!

In remembering our children, DH and I planted a little red oak for Mia at the bottom of the garden, where we can see it from the house. It sounds silly, but we both keep the curtains open enough so we can see it first thing in the morning when we wake. It is very comforting. I suspect I will go down there and talk to Mia a lot, and no doubt water it with quite a few tears too.

miasmummy you write so eloquently; I can picture the little red oak, and can imagine it from the house, and envisage you watering it. It always brings a lump to my throat, when I read what you've been doing - that's how good your writing is - though I doubt it would have the impact it does, if it wasn't borne out of your love. xx

I think you're doing the right thing btw. I know my mum finds this very hard - she's the one on facebook with the teddy bear (winnie the pooh) as her photo. who comments on my posts a lot - it's the one she left on Tamsin's grave. Funny I only just realised that she still has that as her profile pic, so Tamsin made a huge impact.

whatever I just realised I forgot to say that I hope that K gets better soon xx

Tam, I have just read your post. You have been a huge help to me in these few days. I may not personally know you but the kindness you have shown me and Alice's daddy is unbelievable. You are far from selfish or unreasonable xx

Mias, I love the idea of the red oak. And an oak is such a lovely, solid tree and lives so long.

Tami, your Mum does come across on your FB page as being very caring but at the same time you can tell she doesn't really get the level of loss you've suffered. I hope this isn't coming across badly as I know she means well. I just remember a post she made around Christmas about "Enjoying dd1" which I knew you couldn't really do at the time in the same way as I couldn't enjoy my boys. She was trying to console you when you couldn't be consoled. And if your Mum is anything like mine, they don't actually want us to feel the grief, and in fairness, if any of my boys ever lost a child, I would be distraught for them. Mums want to put a plaster on it and kiss it better, they don't want their babies to suffer the grief we have. I have found myself saying "I'm fine" to my Mum and when she says "That's good" I really want to shout, "Oh fgs, do you really think I'm actually fine?" but I don't because I don't want her to feel my pain. I wonder if your Mum thinks that going through PALS, will give you something to focus on? I think a lot of people who know me were delighted when I went back to work even though now, I am back, I have a lot of days when I'd really rather be at home!

I am reading another book at the moment, which was recommended by a lady on Mias thread. "Journey of Souls. Case Studies of Life between Lives" by Michael Newton, a hypnotherapist who specialises in past life regression. ( Or he says he does, who really knows!) He says we all have teachers or guides in Heaven and that sometimes they come to us as our children. I am wondering if Sylvie-Rose was my spirit guide and if she came to show me a different path. She did seem to have a million years of wisdom in her eyes. Maybe she was leading me to you ladies......

Morning x

Good lord I watched the troll programme last night. What despicable evil creatures the RIP trollers are. I had no idea that sort of thing happened. It made me quite upset really. Unbelievable.

Good morrning ladies.

Off to the grave soon I hope.

lumps bless you. Thank you for that. How are you doing? I don't see you often on here, but am always's thinking of you xx

whatever How is K today? xx

I haven't watched the programme yet - I've only just got up to date with Corrie (DD1 seems to go to sleep later & later, yet gets up at sparrow'o'clock, leading to an increasingly grumpy mummy

It makes me strangely uneasy Everlong. I do forget sometimes that we are not posting on a 'closed' forum here. Have also just been a double checked my fb privacy settings!

Ah cross posted Tami she is back to her usual self today thank you for asking. Back in school today. I think she's just getting tired and needed a duvet day yesterday - roll on Easter holidays!!

But you have good gut instinct, everlong! In order for me to spot a troll they have to say "Who's that coming over my bridge? I going to eat you all up!"

I used to be exactly the same Chip. Other people on MN would warn me about posters and I used to think 'awww how can they say that about that poster.' Then I was drawn in by a poster a few years ago....and I mean drawn in to the point where I became her social worker, counsellor etc etc. I gave hours and hours to her and then everything came to light.....it will not happen again.

It's hard though isn't it - I can imagine genuine posters in terrible situations have been called a troll and vice versa. I'm useless too Chip but there have been a few times on here I've thought something seems stupidly far fetched or dramatic. I tend to just avoid the threads like that. I usually can't keep up anyway!

I genuinely - and I mean - genuinely can not fathom why anyone would pretend to have lost a child. I understand for attention, but the truth is in RL it's hard to find people who truly understand, so this is the only place where people understand that I'm not 'happy' again, and never truly will be. This has truly been the most traumatic experience of my life, and it doesn't end. I don't turn off the computer & life is wonderful, so anyone who would pretend is sicker than sick. I wouldn't wish this on my worst enemy. The only caveat I will add (if OK) is that my home life is far from ideal, and some of my posts may be perceived, I guess, as 'dramatic', and I guess it seems I don't listen to advice, that's because I'm living in this situation though, and it's hard to see the forest for the trees at times.

My mum has managed to upset me a bit, and I wonder if you'd be kind enough to give your views on her opinion?

She came to look after DD1, whilst we went and gave Tamsin's grave a 'make-over'. She said she thinks that I should only go once a fortnight for a month, then less often. Her opinion is that it "re-opens the wound" every time I go. It's a similar idea to my neighbour who told me that I shouldn't keep looking at her photos, when she'd died just over a week before.

I'm guessing that my mum is trying to protect me (as chip so wisely told me), but I don't feel that not going is going to help me heal quicker. Maybe she's right, and I'm being over-sensitive. I do feel that my mum is now joining in the general concensus (of people I know) that "well it's over 4 months now, get back to reality). Aargh!!! I don't want to just get over it, and I'm now worried that I'm dragging others down, by my inability to talk about anything without mentioning Tamsin.

Funnily enough I'm going through another stage again. It was the disbelief and guilt last few weeks, now it's the quiet acceptance. I know that this stage is seen as more 'gentle', but honestly I find it one of the hardest, as it's 'passive', if that makes sense? I hate this 'passive' state, as it seems hopeless, and I guess I've been clinging to the hope that Tamsin will come back, that this is all a terrible mistake... but in this state I now have to accept my life no longer includes her - physically.

everlong I think the idea that they have been 'victimised, or bullied' is a reason not an excuse iyswim? The idea that everyone who's been sexually abused must be an abuser when they're adults, is frankly insulting. Yes, I realise it happens, but those who do it make a conscious decision to act. I don't understand why anyone would want to extract revenge on innocent people - on those who they feel wronged by, may have some logic, but not against others.