Olive's 3 year old will not do anything she is told (and I think MIL has had enough today), how do I sort her out? (dd2, not MIL)

[Oliveoil]

refuses to go to the toilet before going out anywhere, so you have 15 mins of ranting

dressing, refuses to wear certain things, wants to go out in fairy costume

gets down off the table and plays with toys

and just general annoyance

MIl has told dh she was 'a handful' this morning so I think that translate as a PITA

how do I get her to do as she is told?

dd1 was a perfect example of compliance so I am at a loss

Some suggestions:

Well, to start with I suggest you pick your battles - so if the end goals is compliance w. X, Y and Z start w. the one that is most important to you and ignore as much of the others as you can.

Decide how you are going to handle non compliance (sanctions/star chart etc)and agree these w. MIL. Its important that you handle stuff exactly the same to avoid confusion. For example, we are trying to cure ds1 of his habit of throwing toys. Each time he does this he gets 1 warning and, if repeated, 2 min on the naughty step. My mum and MIL do this too and its working really well.

Make sure she gets lots of positive attention/praise for doing as she's told - (find things to praise her for, if necessary).

And finally, remember she's only 3 and quite a bit of non-compliance is normal.

Hope this helps

OH hello - welcome to my world!!!!!

However - I have to say DD is 4 now and so much better! SHe has been a handful from age 2 - but she started nursery last September and has improved dramatically.

I hate to say this but your DD's behavour is normal 3 YO stuff! My did was exactly the same. Very stubborn, strong willed, disobedient.

Tell her you are going to the park - or somewhere equally fun, tell her to go to the toilet before you go - if she says no, say OK but we can not go to the park until you have been, take your coat of and sit down. She will throw a fit because she wants to go to the park - tell her you can go when you have been to the toilet - stand firm. It's like setting up the situation I know - but it is better to set up a situation - where you can stand firm - it does not matter to you if you do not go out - but you would not want to do this if you really needed to get somewhere for a specific time. Couple of times doing this - she should get the message. Ranting and raving wont work - it will make her stand her gorund even more - she needs to learn what the consequences of her actions are IE - no toilet - no fun in the park.

The clothes - I wouldn't battle over this - if she wants fairy costume - then let her wear it - as long as she has leggings and jumper underneath to keep her warm. My DD refused to wear Pre school T shirt - I did not fight it - I let her wear what she wanted. Then when it came to going to nursery - I took her shopping for her uniform and explained that all the children wore the uniform and it was school rule so she has no choice - never had a problem with her for nursery - she is older and understands now. But she is 4 now - when she was younger - she did not.

If she gets down from table and does not finish Tea - throw it in the bin. Eplain rule - you do not leave table until an adult says you can - if you do your tea will be thrown away. She will get hungry and get thew message!

Basically - pick your battles - which are important for you to win and which you can afford to compromise on.

And let her suffer consequences so she can learn.

You will get thorugh it

Good luck!!

agree with choosing battles.

Clothes, really doesn't matter a hoot. one of the precious joys of being a child, wearing fairy costume or whatever.

Again, if she gets down to play with toys, then as long as she knows that her adults take that to mean she's finished, fine.

If she won't go to the loo, fine as well. I can't be bothered fighting over this stuff. She will learn by experience that it's inconvenient to have to hold on if there's no loo, and that if you get wet you have to come home and change and miss the park. We have to let kids learn by experience.

I think it is very hard if you have had a compliant first child! But it's honestly, learning to pick battles, and also learning to ask in another way - rather than being straight, some kids respond better to challenges and races etc. Or being in character, eg "oh, no real fairy princess goes out without going to the loo." etc

agree with all the below. choose your battle as there are going to be millions.
wouldn't care about clothes either (dd doesn't care either but for all I care she could go out dressed like Mr Tumble). re loo, I personally never thought of making her go before we are going out except when first potty trained. now she'll hold it till we find a toilet but normally is never a problem. re eating exactly like everyone says - when she starts playing up we take it as she has finished and tell her that if so her food will go to dog and cat - she never leaves a bit, and if she does well her problem tbh - she'll learn by experience.

I've learnt that too many rules and they do not follow any, choose a few which you're firm on and they'll respect them more. also let her 'rule' you in the things that do not matter much.

mind you DD1 is very good (DD2 is due in april and it might be a different kettle of fish.)

you have stolen my daughter!

alert the authorities!

she has been wearing a fairy dress/ Snow White costume for weeks so I know it is her

she must have got out of the house when I was eating lunch and she was running round the house shouting "I don't want soup! I want sugar!"

also agree to 'mask' the rule into some fun and play like 'that's not how princesses eat' and things like that.
In a way I do understand them all these rule only make sense to grown ups and unless they do understand them too there's little chance they'll follow them.

oh she sounds like ds3. He will argue, be disagreeable and difficult all day long. He does a really good line in shouting. He is an angel at pre-school. They look surprised when i mention his stroppyness. There's your answer I think

(ds2 is a perfect model of compliance too).

Don't want to sound mean, but I'm really pleased to hear I'm not the only one fighting these battles. Just returned to work this week after mat leave and my 3yo DD is doing her best to make leaving the house impossible. I get her dressed, go to the loo, she gets herself undressed. Have said she can wear anything she wants, but she refuses all trousers, long sleeves and coats and I don't want her to freeze. I have a 9 mnth old DD too and I wonder if DD1 is jealous. Have tried reward charts, but she doesn't show any interested and peels stickers on and off. I just feel a bit like I'm failing somewhere with her and it's making me sad. Is doing as she wants for a quiet life a bit of a cop out? Help!

lololol at sticker peeling

I went to give dd1 a sticker this morning for good reading, turned away for THREE SECONDS and found dd2 covered in stickers reading 'I was brave' 'Good spelling' and 'Good Boy'

Hmm, I actually think that is perfectly reasonable behaviour. I can't/don't want to pee on command, so I don't expect my dd to either. I think it's fair enought to want to have some control in your life if you are three years old, and deciding on clothes is a good way to exert some control. Sitting at the table once you have finished eating must be very boring for a child of that age. Why not go and play?

oh thanks for all these - was dragged off to do some work, would you believe it? ffs, anyone would think I was paid to be here...

for eg, we need to go to the toilet before I take dd1 to school

dd1 toddles off, great, dd2 has major tantrum

so I can't NOT do the school run and I can't NOT take her to the toilet (excuse grammar)

so I shout

and just generally does not do what she is told

now I am the first to admit I am soft, and the naughty step etc feels a bit urgh, do I have to start being strict?

does she wee as soon as she gets up?

we don't wee again before school

my 3 year old does not eat she just runs off

I refuse to make everyone else's mealtime a nightmare so I just leave her to it

I don't know if this is a good thing but I just think it is setting an example

also I am idle and don't want to eat cold fish pie

I don't know if it would work OO. I'm quite laid back at home (have to be because so much energy is spent making sure ds1 isn't doing something that will kill him- no energy for general strictness). DS3 would do exactly that with me - will refuse to do what I want him to - but not at school. For him competitions work. So for example if he won't go upstairs to the loo I'll shout "Ok I'm going and I'm going to win', then he rushes past me 'nnoooo meeee'. Yesterday he wouldn't take something he'd thrown on the floor to the recycling - so I said 'oh ok 'ds1 will you....' - hadn't finished the sentence before ds3 was doing it.

Meeting him head on and insisting doesn't work with him= he will never back down.

I don't know if it would work OO. I'm quite laid back at home (have to be because so much energy is spent making sure ds1 isn't doing something that will kill him- no energy for general strictness). DS3 would do exactly that with me - will refuse to do what I want him to - but not at school. For him competitions work. So for example if he won't go upstairs to the loo I'll shout "Ok I'm going and I'm going to win', then he rushes past me 'nnoooo meeee'. Yesterday he wouldn't take something he'd thrown on the floor to the recycling - so I said 'oh ok 'ds1 will you....' - hadn't finished the sentence before ds3 was doing it.

Meeting him head on and insisting doesn't work with him= he will never back down.

the naughty step is crap, i agree

what i do olive (i have a 3yr old who refuses to go on school run too) is give 10/5/3/2/1 minute warnings.

i say "whoever gets their coat on first is the winner"
"first to the end of the path is the winner"
(i dont offer prizes, i dont think they realise this)
and cringey stuff like "last person to get shoes on is a smelly bottom"

if they dont need told twice to do something they get a penny for their bankie

so I need more patience?

am fcuked then

you are quite right to not make things such a battle, yes, but sometimes at the end of the day you just want to say oh ffs just do it

for eg, she doesn't like climbing the stairs so if I say 'race you' she will sometimes do it

but that takes time and energy

also I don't want to be strict as I do feel like some of you have said that it is normal 3 year old behaviour. I think MIL envisages an ASBO on the horizon

(and I did mean grammer)

she is going through a phase of peeing and sometimes POOING in her pants

so I try to get her to go to the toilet all the time

(had her first playdate yesterday and did it at the woman's house, the SHAME )

Olive, we have very similar children.
My oldest dd is (or was) pretty easy going, easy to chivvy laong, blah blah. (Until she reached about 6)

Dd2 is stubborn, strong willed and very amusing to boot.

We have struggles with the whole geteing out the door/school run scenario. I too shout.
But soemntimes I rememeber to make it a game/competition. Or the reverse psychology game where I state that dd2 won't be able to go to preschool (which she loves) if we don't get dd1 to school. Or she won't see Olivia, Finn or poppy if she doesn't get in the car. Often thisa works.

Today we almost left the house without her shoes as i was so fed up with asking/telling her. The she realsied she wouldn't be able to run around the playground.

i know what you mean about time and energy

god its exhausting isnt it

When alone with DD1 competitions etc do work and she'll do some things to please me, but when I have myself, DD1 and DD2 to get ready and out by 7.45am, with bags etc making a game of it is hard work and her intention is to disrupt as she thinks eventually I'll just stay in 24hrs a day with her. Maybe that's the answer...

oh dear OO!

But I think just working out the way that you can engage them usually takes LESS time and energy, in practice. It's either "Go upstairs now dd" and half an hour of arguments and power struggles, or a simple "Quick - race you!" job done!

I think it will get easier. It just becomes ingrained and a habit. And as they get older they get so much more reasonable and open to listening to reason. DS was like this - he is five now and an absolute delight. There is light at the end of that tunnel!

OO,

Yesterday when I posted on a different thread that when my DD (who is now 8) got down from the table I presumed her meal is finished you quoted me and put WTF.

Strange that you haven't reacted in the same way when 3 out of 4 of the early replies have said the same thing.

Agree with HG. I do the competition thing because I don't have the energy for a full on battle of wills.

I was worried about ds3 being a nightmare at pre-school- but he's been fine (likes being busy).

iirc my WTF was in response to someone - no idea if it was you or not - said that if their children didn't go to the toilet before their meal, then they couldn't go at all

so you can take your and toddle away as I don't think it relevant tbh

"but sometimes at the end of the day you just want to say oh ffs just do it" yup I agree totally. one morning I threw her shoes in the garden as I was sooo fed up with all the faffing around to get dressed (she was quite shocked and me very embarassed and guitly).

if she does that with poo etc I see why you'd want her to do it. however, did she have to leave the friend house once she pooed herself? maybe next time she'll remember that and go.

one thing that helps me sometimes is an advice I got re kittens - when playing with them if they start using their nails stop playing immediatly and do something else. as they want to keep playing next time they'll think twice about using their nails. it's is a bit easy peasy but if you apply the logic it sometimes work.