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Highly Able Children

308 replies

saisanne1 · 12/03/2017 07:40

Would like to hear from parents of highly children

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Kleinzeit · 12/03/2017 23:38

I love my child more than anything in the world and I'll fight for him to get everything he deserves and needs in life!

Well that's great for him because whatever his issues turn out to be he'll always have you fighting his corner. Flowers

saisanne1 · 12/03/2017 23:40

zzzz I didn't say it's only about the reading, he has every trait including imagerary friends and I also didn't say all children with high IQs go through what my sons going through. Tired of repeating myself, but what I am saying is there's a difference between bright and gifted, yes kids read at 4, but do they show other traits, no. So they are bright. End of..

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zzzzz · 12/03/2017 23:41

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Wayfarersonbaby · 12/03/2017 23:42

Hi Saisanne. This thread seems to have gone very negative, so if it's possible to pull back from that, and go back a couple of pages to where posters were giving very good and supportive advice, I think that would really help.

I have a DD who has just turned 4. She is very advanced - she's now reading chapter books, is very skilled in maths (which she's picked up completely herself, getting as far as multiplication on her own), she's exceptionally articulate, bright, cognitively well advanced for her age. She's also lucky in that both DH and I were also both gifted/talented kids ourselves, and now both work in very high profile intellectual professional jobs, so we were kind of expecting that DD might be very bright, and she is. She's lucky in another way in that as well as having our experience to support her, she also goes to a nursery that has a lot of children in similar positions (a lot of our work colleagues have children at the nursery), so she's surrounded by children who often are also reading, very bright, have academically able parents, and so on. We aren't wealthy by any means, but I won't kid you that there is a social advantage there: my daughter is at nursery around bright children of bright middle-class parents who know how to relate to bright kids. She gets an advantage from that as she isn't markedly different to the skills of the others, though she's clearly amongst the brightest. But because of this, DH and I are intensely relaxed about her doing any kind of academic learning at nursery. We'd just rather she played and occupied herself running about and doing all the things we can't provide at home as we have a tiny flat - messy play, outdoor play, painting, social interaction, etc. - and, to be honest, we're just glad someone else is looking after her while we're at work Wink

I don't know your background, so I may be completely wrong in this: but it strikes me that you seem to feel that you're at sea here and have been doing a lot of research on gifted children to try to provide something you think your DS is missing out on. Yes, if he is in a nursery where he stands out as unusual to the other kids then you might worry that he isn't getting something vital. However if there are 60 kids in his session, then statistically there are going to be a few who are just as smart as him or nearly so. And in any case, why do you want him to be challenged and stretched at nursery? Honestly, the social skills and the experience of play are far far more valuable at this stage in his life, and will be for quite a while. He doesn't need academic stretching and support at this stage. Just answer his questions, tell him stories, and allow him to learn how to interact with other children. Let him run about and have loads of sleep and try out physical activities (and don't overwhelm him with classes). Play him music and read him stories - not those awful Biff and Kipper reading scheme ones, but proper ones, fairy tales and Brambly Hedge and Enid Blyton (the young kids' ones like Brer Rabbit and The Wishing Chair...)

Honestly, I'm speaking as someone who was G&T myself and on behalf of my DH. He had a mum who noticed he was gifted, didn't really know what to do about it, and so did a lot of "research" and took him to child psychologists and accelerated him in schools and took him out of schools and enrolled him in special tuition and all sorts of stuff. It messed his life up to the extent that he'll never, ever recover from it and has lasting, significant emotional problems from being treated like that and not ever being able to form good peer group friendships. Honestly, better that your little boy doesn't quite get "challenged" academically but has a good time playing in the sand pit and learns how to make friends with all different kinds of children than always feeling the odd one out. It is not nice for a clever kid to feel different and singled out, because there is a lot of low self-esteem and emotional pain waiting for him in the "specialness" of being different. Please hold off on this as long as you can.

Anyway, children can't tell how bright their peers are with any reliability until they are at least at secondary school. Honestly - it's true. Don't encourage him to feel himself different to others or that his peer group aren't up to his standard - it's a recipe for loneliness.

There are a few things you do really need to know if your little boy is very bright.

  1. The best thing you can learn, straight off, is that the whole "gifted and talented" business is a race you can't win. There will always be someone else's kid who is brighter and quicker than yours - an IQ that is higher, a child who has better musical talent, parents who are richer or have better cultural capital and so can give their child an advantage. You only harm your child by getting into the race - your kid might be a thoroughbred but he can't win the National every time. And someone else always has posher stables.
  1. There is a lot of charlatanry out there. There are private educational psychologists after your money, special tutors who are on the make, gifted child courses that cost a fortune that tell you they will endow your kid with special abilities, Mensa-style clubs making money out of flattering people about their IQs. None of these will ever do anything for your child's real future. Try to trust the teachers at the nursery and school - you are not paying them so they don't have to flatter you, and they are the ones who will be working with your child each day. If they are telling you that he has needs he has to work on in social development and behaviour, it is important to know this.
  1. Relax! A really bright kid will still be bright even if they don't get "challenged" for a while. I spent a lot of my primary school career loafing and refusing to do anything. I had a reading age of 16 at 6 and refused to have anything to do with the reading scheme; similarly with maths. It didn't make one iota of difference to my academic achievement at 18/21+. However, I did completely fail to learn good work habits and any form of self-discipline, which would have real helped a lot in my life. Make sure your kid knows that sometimes you just have to jump through the hoops, even if they are too-easy-for-you hoops, and that's OK. And sometimes you do have to cope with not having a great teacher who gets you, or not being perpetually stretched, or feeling like you're not appreciated. And that's OK too; sometimes you also have to get used to making your own amusement, or learning how to be productively bored, or doing things just to be a good citizen, or getting perfect at something through hard work rather than dashing through it. And it's OK for a bright child, even a very bright child, to be pottering about in a mediocre primary school with parents who aren't frantically looking up Suzuki violin and private tuition and how to get their kid into a London day prep on scholarship. (Because frankly that's a grim life, too, and if you were a billionaire your child wouldn't necessarily be any better off being crammed through the London private tuition and prep circuit and being force-fed every stretching experience on offer.) Just let him be himself for a bit and relax about his academic achievements and abilities. And I know everyone else on this thread has been saying this, too, but as a former "gifted" child, I can tell you that it's absolutely true!
zzzzz · 12/03/2017 23:48

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Wayfarersonbaby · 12/03/2017 23:49

Oh and I don't mean just stop stretching him - I mean keep doing the things that it sounds like you're already doing - museums and trips and stories and reading and all sorts - but just don't make a race our of it or get into the "gifted" stuff. If he's very bright, enjoy it - it's a lovely thing having a very clever child. Keep helping him develop, but without pushing external "experts" and programs and so on on him. And be quietly proud, but avoid the "child genius/gifted child" circuit. Look for schools that are a good fit; let him do activities and music and sport and build up friends. Just don't label or pathologise. He will be fine Smile You are lucky in having him. Enjoy it!

saisanne1 · 12/03/2017 23:51

Thank you wayfarersonbaby, your post made me smile and made a lot of sense, I'll be sure to take it all on board. Thanks alot😊

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saisanne1 · 12/03/2017 23:52

Thank you, I'll be sure to do all that 😊

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littleoldladywho · 13/03/2017 00:00

saisanne, but you haven't told us anything about your child. You have spoken in absolutes about 'gifted kids'. I have three gifted children. They are all absolutely completely different. Not just chalk and cheese, but blancmange and granite.
A skip: dc1 IQ 125 not especially gifted. Alphabet at 18 mos (I went away for the weekend and when I got back it was her new party trick, along with 'words that begin with'.) Extremely hard working people pleaser. Will always succeed at everything she does. Has been amazingly successful at pretty much everything she has tried. Bloody easy teenager. Grin earns her own money and is just off to uni with a scholarship. Normal kid. Boringly normal. Gifted but utterly ordinary. Very proud of her.
Dc2 IQ 137 is an absolute pain in the proverbial. No one knows what to do with him. In his yr 2 SATS the head teacher had to stand behind him to keep him on track because once he had a thought, he was on to the next, and couldn't be bothered to write anything down because his fine motor couldn't keep up. Ambidextrous until 7. Eventually assessed for ADD and ASD at 9. No one had bothered before because he could answer verbally any question the teacher asked him. Oh, he taught himself number bonds and multiplication at 3. Nursery appealed to the school board for formal assessment because his math ability (untaught) was off the scale. Corrected teachers spellings in KS1. Has been moved up a few years here and there. Socially anxious. Obstinate as fuck. Inattentive. Lots of sensitivities. He was dx ADD with some ASD traits. Weird. Grin y5 teacher said it was essential he was assessed otherwise he would drop out of school at 14. Said he was literally on another planet. Has been through the full gamut of wobble cushions, fiddle toys, and various ADD meds. By far the most naturally gifted in one specific area. His IQ score is dampened by his low scores in one specific area, which contribute to his inattentiveness. Doesn't give a fuck about any arts subjects. Is happy to fail them. (Oh, taught himself to read chapter books at 3 or 4 ish.) Doesn't see the point in writing essays/ history/ English/ social studies (and will tell you so). Maths is his life. He tolerates science if it's interesting. He would be better off homeschooled but we choose to keep him in school due to his social issues.
Dc3 - IQ 142. Also has cerebral palsy. Taught herself to read at 2 when she was non-verbal. We realised she could read at 3 when she read the lion the witch and the wardrobe to her grandma. Would read Virginia Woolf over my shoulder. We didn't believe grandma. She was statemented for yr r due to her communication and physical issues (not walking). She was formally assessed in yr r (P1) and found to be working between 5 and 7 years ahead across the board. Heightened sense of justice. Will stand up to bullies, teachers, and any adult that she feels is wrong. Extremely emotionally sensitive and almost physically feels injustice. Wrote first book in y3 and teacher sent it off to publisher. Had two years of compulsory school counselling because she had nothing in common with her peers. She loved it because she got to spend time with an adult. Lots of side issues which could be CP related, could be over sensitivities, could be both.
Behold my fabulous children. Grin With lots of specifics. I can give more. Grin I know nothing about your boy except that the EP observed him and said he was highly able and he apparently has some sort of emotional issues and possibly ADD.
I would say that it isn't bog-standard giftedness that is hard (sure they are busy kids, but that's quite nice - total sponges and you don't need to teach them anything, just tag along behind) but it is rather some of the also-rans that are trickier.
For me, I struggled with a kid that was reading novels but couldn't talk, and a schoo, system that said her handwriting had to be two years above average to be given any extension work. She couldn't hold a pencil or walk unaided. Dc2 was a litany of concerns. My post would be a damned essay. None of it was really 'gifted causes this' though.
I'll check later and see if you have thought of anything specific that you are struggling with. One of us will have dealt with it. There are scores of gifted kids around. At four though, some of the 'problems' are just as likely to be general immaturity or the beginnings of ADD. In which case, welcome to the 2e world.

littleoldladywho · 13/03/2017 00:09

Should also add, I included the overall test outcome/ IQ so you can benchmark where your kid would fall against mine if your EP gave you an assessment result - they are not especially high scores (the 142 is getting up there, but lots of mners' kids outstrip her quite substantially. Grin - it's high enough that it made her paediatrician laugh at 5 when she was tested, because it was higher than his, but it isn't by any means jaw-dropping level - these tests are only really of relevance if they show some disparity between sub categories which is indicative of specific learning difficulties in some areas - which still may be above average, but in context serve as some sort of flag - this was the case for dc2 and they went ahead and did a full battery of testing for ADD etc in addition to the usual WISC)

Wayfarersonbaby · 13/03/2017 00:15

Smile Smile

I really do think you can afford to relax a bit - I think if you are aware that other kids might have social or financial advantages to support them that you don't have, then there is a temptation to look to academic activities in school to replace that - but actually he would be better off just learning how to "be" in a pre-school/school setting for now, and doing lots of fun stuff at home.

The time to start worrying about the academic program of the school is later, possibly not even until secondary school. Get him into a position where he loves school and friends, and he's much better equipped to do well. I do understand what you are going through - my DD is strong-willed and my worry for her is that she might not learn how to be in the system, how to play well with others and make friends, how to interact with the teachers so that they want to help her learn and get the best out of her, and then might get bored or turned off school. I want her to form good relationships with her peers and teachers, and also to understand that sometime you have to do boring things that are a bit easy as well; sometimes you advance and sometimes plateau, then you advance again - it can't be high-energy super-learning all the time.

There is a danger IMO for very bright kids in developing an outlook where they either don't endear themselves to their teachers and peers, or develop a sense of entitlement or poor social skills where they can't quite make use of the academic support they are offered. Learning good social relationships, healthy, productive work habits, and how to have fun and be creative is as important as any kind of factual knowledge, probably more so. And if your child is very bright indeed, they will honestly do OK whatever you do, as long as they have the right outlook, foundation and social skills.

Anyway, I'm sure you have had enough of me pontificating now Grin but the best way to help him is to enjoy playing and reading with him yourself Smile Good luck!

littleoldladywho · 13/03/2017 00:16

Oh a small imaginary friend anecdote. Be careful what you wish for. When dc3's invisible friend moved out (well, the invisible family as there were several of them, all related) she was inconsolable for two days. She woke up one morning and they had gone, overnight. She literally sobbed for two days. At this point, you start to wonder if there is something going on that you aren't seeing. Grin completely inconsolable. And that was that. They never came back.

saisanne1 · 13/03/2017 06:35

littleoldladywho
My son is very socialable, articulate, chatty, generous, smiley, people person, very lively 4yo, he also has a strong sense of injustice and that's the reason he had a lot of meltdowns when teachers caught the tail end of it and he got the blame. He's great with numbers, he loves doing times table and telling the time. He has an imaginary friend who he talks to on his iPad, he's almost created himself, a boy who travels a lot and he writes to him all the words he wants to memorise. He has a photographic memory, is constantly asking question and has a never ending energy for life. He's very interested in the weather and the world around him ' why is Morocco poor mummy' he's highly sensitive, if he or someone cuts them self, he's very concerned and upset. He gets very emotional too, but has be taught to self regulate, which he's doing great at. He dives in head first to everything and we are trying to get him to slow down. He a confident swimmer and has been swimming unaided since the age of 3. He's great a drawing and writing and talking his way out of anything and everything, he's like a mini lawyer. He likes to win and make rules for games, but through classes I'm teaching him that it's ok to lose and you have to play by other people rules too

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SchnitzelVonCrumb · 13/03/2017 07:10

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SuburbanRhonda · 13/03/2017 07:22

On a slightly different rack, OP, can I make a suggestion for when your son starts school?

When people on here have spoken about other children with highly developed reading skills, you've frequently said that because they don't have the other skills you say your son has, they are merely "bright" but not "gifted".

As a parent support worker in a primary school with many years of experience, I can confidently say that putting down other people's children in this way will do you no favours with other parents. It could even make it more difficult for your son to make friends.

SuburbanRhonda · 13/03/2017 07:22
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Devilishpyjamas · 13/03/2017 07:27

Well I read your list with interest as ds3 ticked most of the boxes (although he read later as he has problems with his eyes & couldn't see the page). I wouldn't say he is unusually gifted although he is certainly bright & I have always said I could see him in academia (unlike ds2 who is bright but loathes school work with a passion).

But anyhow ds3 is 12 now. He is an anxious child & now goes to a school that prioritises things other than exam results (very different approach than ds2's grammar school). I do my best to spread out his interests as he can get very knowledgable and full of facts very quickly about whatever his latest interest is. But this isn't really a way to make friends.

Being clever isn't really a problem. And if you have a clever child you are better off focussing on their ability to get on with people, their ability to try new things and accept failure, and - this is a big one - their anxiety levels.

I'm not anti intellectual achievements (i went to Oxford for starters) but academic achievement is not actually the key to happiness or success. Relationships are far more important.

zzzzz · 13/03/2017 07:35

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Devilishpyjamas · 13/03/2017 07:38

Yep - really saying there is some major difference between bright and gifted is crazy. It puts an awful lot of pressure on a four year old if they have to achieve 'gifted' things and not 'bright' things as well . Confused

saisanne1 · 13/03/2017 07:38

I'm not putting down people's kids all I'm saying to their kids have all the other traits as well as self taught reading, there's a difference! ATM my son is assessed as able and is getting the right support, if things change I'm sure I will be pointed in the right direction, his peers may well catch up and the support may well not be needed later on, which will be great. My son is well mannered but has his ups and downs like any child. Thanks for all your input, I've had great advice and will use this

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saisanne1 · 13/03/2017 07:39

And also I've never told my son he is gifted, I treat him like and bring him up they way I brought up my brothers and sister

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zzzzz · 13/03/2017 07:41

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saisanne1 · 13/03/2017 07:41

Honestly I'm not getting in to all this again, if he was bright, he would have been assessed at bright

Highly Able Children
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saisanne1 · 13/03/2017 07:42

Then they most probably will be assessed as gifted

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zzzzz · 13/03/2017 07:45

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