falling out over toddler behaviour. AIBU and WWYD?

[Swimminglikeaduck]

I seem to have fallen out with my brother and Mother. But first, some facts.

I have a 2.2 year old dd. She sometimes hits other pre-schoolers when arguing over possession of toys and a couple of times she his swiped/hit another toddler for seemingly no reason at all. Ive dealt with all of these in the same way, namely:
Told her "we don't hit in this family" in a firm voice at eye level, then quickly gave immediate concern and attention to the victim, then picked up my dd and put her in time out, withdrawn any further attention from her for two minutes, then gone back to speak to her and bring her back to play.

This hitting phase seems to have started about two or three months ago, and although she chatters about time out and the no hitting rule, she still hits out.

Yesterday my dd goes in my dbros house and excitedly finds my dn(3.1) and her toys as im greeting my db and dsil.

Within a minute of being in the house dd finds a toy that she also owns at her own house (small piece of plastic jewelry nanny has bought both of them). She fondles it, dn tries to take it off dd, dd hits out at dn with plastic jewelry. She hits dn in the face (no marks) it probably shocked her more than anything, but may have hurt a little too. I feel this is pretty much usual toddler behaviour.

Dn cries. I try to give dn more attention than dd whilst trying to discipline dd too. Dn runs to her daddy (my brother), who then says this (in front of 3 year old dn):

do you mind if I tell my dd to hit your dd when she does that?
I splutter well, i cant tell you how to parent your child, but I dont think you should do that. he sees that Im angry and shocked that he would suggest his three year old hit my two two year old.

he responds with its just that my dd is always getting hit by your dd

I apologise and say Im doing my best to sort it out. I then totally helicopter my dd and his dd (and another 3children)for the rest of he visit so I can prevent any further upset. Fot the whole visit he stays in his arm chair and ignores the two toddlers and gets on with adult conversation.

My mum overhears all this and takes me aside and says "well, you wouldnt like your dd getting hit, he just thinks if the 3yr old retaliates, then the 2yr old will stop doing it. Basically, learn her lesson.

So now I get angry at mum, who never agrees with me and always tries to sit on the fence.

My dd is 2. She is learning with my help to control her impulses.

If he, or dsil, were to get on the floor with the children and help me stop dd in her tracks and help protect dn, then there would be fewer instances (there seems to be one or two or even three of these hitting issues each visit depending on how easily I can helicopter them)

If dn were to get annoyed with my dd and strike back, i would still maintain the no hitting rule and time out, and would hope that dn in the spirit of fairness would get a timeout with a gentler telling off(recognising that she was provoked). But I object to anyone being told to hit my dd.

I think we are basically clashing over parenting styles. His three children seem to be shouted at or sent to their room when being disciplined. Although I love his children dearly, I think they are often badly behaved, dont listen to their parents etc.
I am trying to deal with this hitting from my own dd in a calm and predictable manner. I realise my dn is upset when dd hits her, but actually they are great friends too, and she gets over it pretty quickly.

Could you wise people help me deal with this.

Should I be reacting to this hitting differently?

Should I avoid any meet ups for a while until dd has learnt to control herself better?

How can I stop getting irritated at my mum for always always seeing the other persons point of view? (i have apologised to her my my angry outburst and I know she was just trying to be fair to her own two children). I would love for her, just once, to say "in this instance I think you/your brotherr is right"

AIBU in thinking that my db and dsil should help with the helicoptering?

And finally, Im sorry if this was a boring read but I really am quite upset by it.

OMG that was really long

Hmmm....some thoughts....

If his DD is playing nicely and doesn't have a habit of hitting your DD then I think YABU for expecting him to helicopter your DD. That is your job.

I do not like the 'hit them back' response and wouldn't be impressed at being asked if this was ok.

I've never had a hitter but I can sympathise with you as it sounds hard. My DD is often hit by her friends and it pisses me off so I can also sympathise with your DB.

I guess I don't think either you or he are resolving the situation satisfactorily at the moment but I don't think his way is the best solution either.

I can see where both of you are coming from really. It's not nice to be hit by a toddler up to 3 times per visit. I just think you have to accept that your lot is to helicopter until your DD gets past this.

Actually I think your mum WAS saying your bil was right......

My mum overhears all this and takes me aside and says "well, you wouldnt like your dd getting hit, he just thinks if the 3yr old retaliates, then the 2yr old will stop doing it. Basically, learn her lesson.

I sort of can see the point they are trying to make.

Your daughter is hitting, but doesnt realise that getting hit can hurt. A bit of retaliation from the other child is probably going to stop her in her tracks and realise that hitting actually HURTS and isnt nice.

Three times a visit seems like an awful lot of hitting.

I sympathise with your DB - I don't think you sound like you are sorting out your DD properly.

I don't blame him.

I have a kicker at the moment [2]. I tell him off and remove him etc- huge tantrums follow. BUT don't think kicking him back would solve anything!!

I too think you need to be extra vigilant with your child.

If child has hit cousin on a few occasions now can see that your brother will view your parenting as ineffectial, which really it is, as child is still hitting.

Why should they helicopter when its your dd causing the problem?

I can see where your coming from, but i know a lot of people would of already told their child to hit yours back, and your DB asked.

I don't know the background but I think your mother has a fair attitude. Your trying hard with DD but its not fair on DN and I know you say his children are badly behaved, but it sounds like a heavily provoked DN has never hit your DD back.

And I don't really think other parents should be helicoptering because of your one DD. You should be enough.

I agree with what your doing re: disciplining and I hope it works soon.

Brother instead of getting his child to hit back should be encouraging verbal response ie getting child to say nice and loudly "NO YOU DO NOT HIT ME"

What will he do when they are older, encourage his daughter to hit back in the playground.

Your dd will grow out of it with your support, he could try teaching his daughter to share, at her age she should know to share her toys with other children

It does seem that you will have to helicopter your dd until she grows out of the hitting though

Your brother was wrong to suggest hitting back.

But unfortunately your DD is going through a hitting phase so you are going to have to helicopter until it passes.

And I think you're doing all you can - its not like you're sat there ignoring it.

It will stop soon - my eldest was the same and it was very stressful.

Whatever it is you are doing to discipline your child to not hit is not working. Find another way.

I do not sanction your niece hitting your child but I can see why your brother would want her to. And can see why your mum agreed.

I totally agree with how you are dealing with it. I respect your B's right to want to handle it differently, but he is wrong (IMO). If his DD hit back, without prompting, then that's one thing, but to be told to hit, that's a lazy rubbish way of dealing with it. And he should be teaching his DD not to snatch.

If I were you, I'd avoid visits as much as possible, and keep them short.

If his DD is not in the habit of hitting and just plays nicely, then why should your brother helicopter? Just in case your DD decides to smack her one?

And I have to admit, having tried everything else, I have finally told my son with regards to one particular child who 'plays' very rough and whose parent seem to pass it off as a 'phase' even though he's been doing it for years, to hit him back twice as hard in future following a headlock and face scratch that drew blood. But they are both aged 8.

I think you need to be firmer with your dd, raise your voice, shock her if she hits. More than a gentle word. I would also avoid family gatherings until your dd has passed the hitting stage (as she will)
Your bro's advice that his dd should hit back isn't great advice, but I must admit to not being particularly upset when my DS retaliated to my dn who was going through a very vicious hitting/biting stage.

The OP's child is 2 - have some people overlooked this? Its normal toddler behaviour and the OP's approach will work - what would people suggest she do exactly that she's not doing at the moment?

One of mine used to hit at this age, and it is true that you just have to prevent and helicopter, but calmly. It would do no harm to involve yourself in the kind of interaction you describe to model appropriate social behaviour (not snatching, not hitting, taking turns etc).

I don't think good parenting comes from encouraging your child to actually hit another, although I can see why he gets frustrated and is at the end of his tether thinking of a way to stop it.

I've thought about telling my 2 yr old DS to hit my 3 yr old nephew back because he's hit by him more or less constantly through an entire visit. He's very nasty to him. However, I wouldn't want to give my DS the message that hitting is OK in any event so refrain from doing so and instead keep away.

So for that I think your brother is BU, but I also understand his frustration.

I agree with another poster who said it sounds like your mum actually took your brothers side and agrees with him, rather than sitting on the fence.

I don't think you can expect your DB and SIL to helicopter your DD when it's your child that's the problem so therefore your job to prevent.

How long has this been going on? It seems your method of disciplining your DD may need to be reviewed if it's not effective.

My sons dad once made the mistake of telling our 8 year old to hit another child back who had been bulling him

The other child then knocked mine to the ground and repeatedly kicked him in the face

I agree that hitting back is not necessarily the right response but I do think your DN does need to retaliate in some respect as well. RosemaryandThyme suggestion of getting dn to tell her not to his her is a good one.
I thankfully haven't had a hitter personally but a good friend did and with her agreement we got the dc to say something along the lines of don't hit me and walk away from them.
What we also found worked was another adult sometimes going and telling him off instead of his mum there is honestly a lot to be said for another grown up telling them off.
I do think YABU expecting the other adults to helicopter your dd it is your job I'm afraid. It isn't nice being the parent of the child being hit but I do have sympathy for you as well because your dd is only 2 and just needs to learn a bit of impulse control.

And the ops neice is 3.. should it be ok for her to be regularly hit by another child?