Demise of the ‘chav’ name?

[stilllill]

I’ve lived on the same council estate for years. When I was younger every girl was Keeley, Courtney, Charmaine, Chantelle, etc.
Boys were Tyler, Liam, Scott, Riley, Bailey, etc.
Knew 3+ of each in school, and these names generally made our class very obvious.

Now I’ve noticed that the children on my estate have completely different names.

Girls:
Iris, Francesca, Esme, Belle and Elizabeth

Boys:
Roy, Jasper, Anthony, Isaac, Jacob

I think these are really timeless, classic names!

I know MN is very middle class, but anyone else noticed this change?

This thread is giving me Katie Hopkins vibes - judgy and bitchy.

I wonder why this isn't more popular in England it's a lovely idea. It keeps the mum's surname going, and would add to the mix of first names in circulation. I wish I'd thought of it when naming DS

I would hope because the mother’s surname is now far more likely to be given to the child as an actual surname.

No, you have got that completely wrong.

Footballers are a prime example of why you are wrong.

A bit of this, a bit of some nature names that seem to appeal to both the more hippy end of the middle class as well as working class (eg Skye) and also a wider variety of names full stop.

Julie, Sandra and Linda were generally not middle class names in that era, (Julia and Alexandra were).

Highly doubt you live on a council estate OP, if you did, it probably wouldn’t enter your mind to start a such a thread. Don’t sneer at the people that you live amongst!

I would hope because the mother’s surname is now far more likely to be given to the child as an actual surname.

Not more likely than the father's surname. A very low % of children are given their mother's surname, I believe about 5% in the UK

They certainly were. I had a friend called Sandra who lived in one of the ‘posh’ houses. There were no Julias or Alexandras in my school.

Just to add, my point was that the names were more neutral. Linda did not scream ‘chav’ nor did Julie. You would not have been able to make an assumption based on the names, they were neither more WC or more MC.

They might have been, but they were unusual.

Well obviously I don’t know where you were living/going to school in the 60s/70s but all the kids had those type of names where I came from. For instance I had two Angela’s in my class, one from the same council estate as me and one from the big posh houses (I still remember her coming to school with a pair of shoes I had seen and wanted but my mum couldn’t afford).

This is actually quite interesting.

I was at school in the 70s and 80s (same private girls' school from 5-18), and the most common names were Sarah, Rachel, Elizabeth, Rebecca, Julia, Alexandra, Frances, Anna, Caroline, Katherine/Catherine, and Clare/Claire. Which are all pretty 'classless' names.

@Extraahott Am I not allowed to notice changes in name trends in my area/class? I’m not sneering. I’ve been friends with many a Charmaine and have what Katie Hopkins considered a ‘chav’ name myself. I think it’s ugly but it’s like any other trend isn’t it.

I never in my life thought the word chav was so controversial.

@IDoughnutKnow Funnily I’d consider those quite MC names, I don’t think I know anyone of that age group with those names!

I'm not sure I know anyone in that age group who doesn't have one of those names (apart from the few Georginas and Harriets and Amelias).

I would say that names like Augusta, Hortensia, Florian and Valentine were pretty rare when I was at school, but were not regarded as out of the ordinary at my DC's boarding schools (I mention these names as I used one of them for one of my DC).

The British class system is endlessly interesting.

BTW, @stilllill, I think everyone knows what you mean by "chav", even if they tie themselves in knots trying to say why it's such an awful word (and loaded with awful assumptions). Whatever its etymology, it's shorthand for something which we all understand.

? Oh-tilly?

Oh dear no.

It is (or should be) Oh-tee-lee-uh.

Not Otterly Botterly or Ohtilly Bohtilly.

Depends on different areas

I grew up in west London and the typical 'chav' names were Kelly, Shelly, Hannah, Hayley, Brooke, Ryan, Scott, Russel, James.

As I got older the chav children were all Mia, Ria, Tia, raiden, kayden, jayden.

Living in Kent and older still the chav children have names like Bambi, Esme, Flossy, Binkie, Turner, Diego, Leandro

Another Geordie over here and the charvas we used to have in the 90s/00s were called so mainly because of how they acted.
It was a complete disregard for any rules (both written and in written). So blasting music from their phones at the back of buses with their feet on the seats and taking up about 4 of them.
Before that it was smoking in the school grounds, purposely disturbing lessons, egging people's houses, starting fights if someone disagreed with them, shouting "hee-ya man, wot the fuck di yu think yu di-in?" if anyone asked them to stop or questioned them.

They could come from any background tbh so names were very varied. In my class (by this I mean class at school) alone we had Rachel, Beth, Jane, Rhonda, Charlotte, Ashley...just very normal names had by people from all sorts of backgrounds.

@IDoughnutKnow , It is (or should be) Oh-tee-lee-uh. That's the german pronunciation. The french pronounce it 'ott-e-lee'.

Very true. The French can get away with it, though, as they make it sound musical. "Otterly" is a very different matter. It's a bit like Amélie (nice name) and the British Amelie-pronounced-Ammerley (not nice).

@IDoughnutKnow , I agree with you. Amelie, Elodie, Natalie, Ottile all sound fine in French, but don't sound very nice in UK accent.

Ammuhly, Elluhdy, Na'uh-ly, Oh-illy. Yuk

I don't know any Otillies but Otterly made me laugh

I guess it depends a bit what you mean by MC, but those would generally be typically working class (or at any rate lower middle class names) from that era in the UK as a whole. But perhaps not in specific areas.