People's comments on my son's names

[Petmalex]

I have two sons, a just-turned 3 year old called Jason and a 4 month old called Robert/Robbie.

When we introduced Robbie to Jason's nursery teacher and my health visitor, they both commented 'oh, like Take That'. I shrugged it off to begin with but I can't seem to shake this horrible feeling I get that I can't really describe... Perhaps someone can put some words/sense to it. Everyone around me thinks I'm being ridiculous and overthinking it. Jason was named because his name means to heal (we lost a baby prior to him at 23 weeks in my pregnancy and we lost a baby at 24 weeks after him but before Robbie) so Jason really has been my healer to get through some very dark times. Both my partner and I loved the name Robbie and agreed on it. And since learned that it means 'bright fame/glory'. My Robert is the brightness after the darkness of our most recent loss. However, since these Take That comments, I've been really struggling to call him Robbie without being reminded of Take That. I'm mid 30s and the comments were made by women who would remember Take That. I'm not really into music so didn't think of it. They are both traditional, normal names that can't be changed. My mindset needs to change but I've tried for months now and I can't seem to move past it. I'm hoping that by sharing this here someone will offer some insight as to why I feel this way, why I'm taking it so seriously and why it upsets me so much. Like my living sons are so special and unique but someone has mocked it/making their names common and not unique (Jason's teacher doesn't know of our losses but my health visitor does so should have known better). Thank you for reading. I do suffer from anxiety and intermittent depression so perhaps these comments were made during my baby blues stage.

[Petmalex]

@hashbrownsandwich

How long until the mirror prints this story?

Do you know, they already have! I'm so new to MN that I didn't know how it all worked. I was randomly googling and found my original post all written out by the mirror! I was so shocked, then realised people had responded on MN. Why does the mirror print stories like this?

[Petmalex]

@bloominglovelyorange

I think you should challenge yourself with thoughts like "it's not the individual names themselves - it's the fact that together they become less unique because of the TT association". Most names have an association. That doesn't make the individual or pair who have the name less unique. If I had a child called Cameron and a few people mentioned Cameron Diaz, it wouldn't make the child any less unique. What about people who use two biblical names for their children. Lots of people will notice they're both biblical names - but so what? I definitely think this is some sort of ocd or pnd issue. You've picked two lovely names. All names have associations. If it wasn't TT association, I feel like you'd have found some other way to blame yourself for the names you've picked.

Thank you. I agree that this is a mental health issue, whether ocd/paranoia, pnd, it's definitely ill mental health.

Perhaps it's something I've latched on to so I have something tangible to blame myself for or hold myself responsible for? Because I'm self punishing for some reason I'm trying to find. You are right, I'm sure if is wasn't for this TT coincidental association, I would have found something else to latch onto and blame myself for. As though I'm somehow reasonable for not knowing the things I don't know and could have prevented from happening (I do need help!).

[Petmalex]

@Petmalex

Thank you. I agree that this is a mental health issue, whether ocd/paranoia, pnd, it's definitely ill mental health.

Perhaps it's something I've latched on to so I have something tangible to blame myself for or hold myself responsible for? Because I'm self punishing for some reason I'm trying to find. You are right, I'm sure if is wasn't for this TT coincidental association, I would have found something else to latch onto and blame myself for. As though I'm somehow reasonable for not knowing the things I don't know and could have prevented from happening (I do need help!).

Just to add - I wonder whether this issue comes from a misplaced sense of trying to take responsibility for my losses, and thus blame myself for them. Neither of them I could have prevented but they were MY babies. As a mum, I 'should' have been able to save them (as though I am omnipotent to defy mother nature and the universe 🙄) but because I couldn't, I naturally and automatically blame myself for them and cannot forgive myself for losing them.

[Robinni]

@Petmalex

Thank you for all your messages! I'm new to MN and still figuring out how it works. Perhaps you are right, I wanted everything to be ideal and his perfect name was instantly 'grouped' along with my first rainbow Jason. Perhaps it isn't even about Take That specifically at all (because like I've said previously, it wouldn't bother me if people were reminded of Jason Statham or the argonaughts - which they were - or even Robbie Williams himself). It's the grouping factor that I've taken to mean negatively in terms of overlooking the individual miracles and blessings that they both are, and mere names (albeit great traditional names like Jason and Robert) have become overlooked. I hope that makes sense. It's like people have seen the whole first (TT) rather than the individual parts (J and R). And you are right, my obsessiveness is currently fixated on this issue but it's been fixated on other issues just as intensely.

I think the grouping will happen anyway whenever you have 2 or more children. It goes from being this individual miracle, as you say, to “the kids” or seen as a group, TT or no TT!!. Had this with all our friends now, it’s just “the kids”, names rarely mentioned and not the same recognition or focus for individual children.

OP I think once you have some counselling you need to focus your energies on your living children who need you. All this looking back and feeling responsible for pregnancy loss - 15% of pregnancies end in miscarriage or stillbirth, it was not your fault. There was nothing you could have done differently. You have the power now to address the MH issues you have on account of tragic circumstances so they don’t impact negatively on your little boys. Good job on recognising what is at the route of all this.

As for the Mirror, probably the same reason DM publishes from Mumsnet - they’re all at it, easy money.

[Petmalex]

@Iceddecaflatte

Sorry but what does the "take that'' mean?

Sorry for the late reply. That That were a music group. Very successful boyband essentially, predominantly in the 1990s although they're still around.

[Petmalex]

@noborisno

People are going to mention it. Sorry you didn't know before but it will come naturally for the rest of your life. Just learn to be okay with that.

I think my issue is that I didn't know before. I'm blaming myself for not knowing. I've found something to blame myself for (I'm sure it would be something else if it wasn't this). The thing is, if I knew about the association before, I probably would have been totally fine with it and would smile about it. I wouldn't have chosen a different name for Robbie.

[CoastalWave]

I'm sorry for your losses.

I think you're just going to have to get used to it if you introduce them as Jason and Robbie. Literally the first thing I thought of. I wouldn't make the connection if you said Robbie and Jason though. Or introduce them as Jason and Robert - that wouldn't raise the idea either.

[Petmalex]

@Petmalex

Sorry for the late reply. That That were a music group. Very successful boyband essentially, predominantly in the 1990s although they're still around.

Take That 🙄

[WimpoleHat]

I'm blaming myself for not knowing

But not everyone can have universal cultural reference points; it simply isn’t possible. “Jason and Robbie” would mean absolutely nothing to my mother, my DH or my DDs. They’re all the wrong age to have had any interest at all in Take That. It wouldn’t have occurred to me until it was pointed out. Unless you’re called Harry Potter or James Bond (and I’ve met one of both!), there is nothing that has anything like a universal association. So “Jason and Robbie” might make a very narrow group of people (women?) of a certain age think of a pop group. But so would “George and Andrew” or “Gary and Martin” or “Paul and John” or “Mick and Bill” for women of different ages. As I think I said upthread, the comment says something about their cultural reference points; it says nothing about your boys or their names.

[babyjellyfish]

For what it's worth, I'm a 35 year old woman and Take That aren't even really on my radar. I might make the link with Take That if I met two boys named Jason and Robbie, but I might not.

[mathanxiety]

I think my issue is that I didn't know before. I'm blaming myself for not knowing. I've found something to blame myself for (I'm sure it would be something else if it wasn't this).

Love, you need to talk to a therapist about guilt over your pregnancy losses.

[Petmalex]

Thank you for your support everyone. Having your messages has really made me identify what my underlying issue is, and surprise surprise, it has absolutely nothing to do with Take That. For those who are interested in my soul searching...

In brief, I have identified that I am a 'perfectionist', but a very destructive one. My issues have arisen in every area of my life (and when I reflect back, are unsurprising given my childhood trauma and upbringing). Becoming a mum again has probably ignited this self awareness (I had been using escapism with Jason). The reference to Take That has been a trigger - I 'should' have known about it before. I didn't know about it before. How careless that I didn't. I never 'drop the ball' like this. I'm always hyperaware. How stupid etc etc. And cue the persistent and chronic self criticism. I've made something to blame myself for because I am always to blame for something. I don't deserve what I have. I am unworthy and unvaluable because I have failed. This is what TT has triggered. It has triggered the sense of shame and it is this which I hope to get therapy for - to develop some self-compassion.

Now that I understand what TT represents for me, I love my babies' names JASON AND ROBBIE. I couldn't care less about the reference to TT and when I think about them, I can now smile.

Thank you everyone ❤️

[mathanxiety]

YAY!!!

Well done, and wishing you every good thing. You deserve happiness.