Welsh girl names - Help

[Cookalia]

We are really struggling with girl names.
It needs to be Welsh but work in Welsh speaking Wales and English speaking Wales and can't have a LL in it.

We have tended to like 'dated' names over current popular ones.

Megan, Bethan, Rhian, Carys etc are all nice but too run of mill.
Siân and Sioned also can't be used and nothing that begins with a T

[quote MikeUniformMike]@AdaColeman, she should have posted on here before naming her children. One of them has the middle name Olwyn.[/quote]
And this is precisely why people should double check these things and ask native speakers.

I know an Olwyn (parents misheard and misspelled Olwen). My Mam burst out laughing when I mentioned her name and said 'let's hope she never moves to Wales'.

@Sportsnight, Betrys is the welsh form of Beatrice. The double t isn't welsh.

My aunties were Blodwen and Ceinwen but I suspect those are irredeemable!

@MikeUniformMike, is Betrys just pronounced Bet-riss, or something else?

This has tuned into an interesting thread! I’m not Welsh but often follow these threads out of curiosity because I have a vague connection with Wales.

To the resident Welsh gurus on here: I often see Seren suggested on MN as a Welsh girl’s name, and it certainly ranks highly in the name stats. Is Seren a new(ish) name or one of those 90yo ones that has seen a revival? Hard to gauge its “feel”.

Also, is Matrona a Welsh name? I always thought it was Russian (albeit would probably be Matriona in English) but recently someone English living in Wales said it was Welsh. Stuck in my mind as, if true, the two places hardly have anything in common.

@ILoveStickers, yes, pronounced Bet-riss. I imagine it's a phonetic spelling of someone welsh saying Beatrice.

Welsh is phonetic, so there isn't much variation in how names are pronounced. Welsh people who don't speak welsh are unlikely to say the name the same way as Welsh speakers. The same goes for English names. Vowel combination are usually tricky.

Examples could be Lisa pronounced as Leusa, Iris pronounced as Eirys, Mary pronounced as Merry, Jane Jên etc
or Siôn pronounced as Shaun, Eira as Ey-ruh or Ira, Ieuan as Y-eye-un etc. The difference is small but like nails down a blackboard.

I have a Cerys but we also considered Nerys

Nerys hasn't been used for a long time, but I prefer it to Carys and Cerys.
Cerys is nicer than Carys, but maybe that's because I know so many Caryses.

Catrin, Nia and Mabli are my faves

@AncientRainbowABC, I've not heard Matrona before, and is not welsh.

Seren is IMO awful, and would only make a pretty name for a pony. It's new and has become very popular quickly leading to many little Serens said as Serrun.

Seren

I would describe Dilys as old-fashioned in a granny-chic sort of way, in the same way as Ivy and Edith. I know lots of women in their thirties and forties with names like Nia, Catrin, Sioned, and Rhian, so lovely though these names are they are more likely to feel dated for a baby born in 2020 as they will be the names of her mum's friends.

Diolch all
There are lots of names for me to go through and see if anything strikes a cord. We have gone over and over our book and people we know (and credits on programmes on S4C!) So hoping that maybe doing this might help bring something to light

Some aren't really what we are looking for (Seren, Rhiannon, Catrin etc). Mamgu chic is just fine (if that is a thing?)

@MikeUniformMike Thank you for the reply. I did laugh our loud at the pony bit. Please write a baby name book.

We have a Seren and hoping for a Ffion soon! Also loved Eira. Never met any other Seren's in our area but she sometimes gets called Serin or Se-ren, which bugs me a bit!

I asked my Mam to check my pronunciation of Seren a few years back and she asked why. She was surprised to hear it's being used as a name now (hasn't lived in Wales for almost 40 years). She made it clear she didn't like it.

Obviously Seren is the only Welsh name DH likes

Then again, Mam thought Osian and Macsen were newfangled (made up) names and didn't like them. She hadn't heard of Osian a Nia/Oisín and Niamh, or Macsen Wledig. She didn't appreciate being told, either

Although I think she was impressed I knew what the Mabinogion was

@CaffiSaliMali I 💜 your post. All of it.

Sorry for the late arrival to this thread op, DH are in the exact same position as you with about 5 weeks to go before DD is due to make her appearance!

Here's my shortlist and the book I used to make it. Ffion is crossed out simply because DH is French and Ffion in French sounds exactly like the word for arsehole 🙈

I vetoed Arsène for DS for similar reasons, as you can imagine!

We're going with Gwenllïan as a middle name, as the first name needs to work in English and French. Hope that helps!

The Heini Gruffudd book is good. I've not seen that but I have an old copy somewhere. I'd love to write a name book - I've been fascinated by names all my life.

I at CaffiSaliMali's comment about her Mam saying Osian and Macsen were newfangled names.

@mamansnet, Please don't call your daughter Cariad. It is the welsh word for girlfriend/boyfriend/love/sweetheart/darling/charity.
It's pronounced CARR-yad not Carry-ad. Ychafi.

Paid a phoeni Mike, dwi'n casau Cariad fel enw

Cariad is on the list for a joke. It's what DH has me down as in his phone. Pretty impressive for a Frenchman, I thought!

I'm sure it was all the more galling for her coming from her non-Welsh speaking daughter

(Dw i'n dysgu cymraeg, but my family don't know).

Mam didn't like Osian or Macsen. Which is a shame for her as they're two of my top 3 boys names alongside Tomos, subject to DH agreement, of course.

At least she'll know how to pronounce them, unlike DH's parents

Ychafi - that's a nice name

I wonder how the french say Gwenllïan

Ychafi - that's a nice name

That made me snort

Oh I am sure however they say it it sounds very lovely anyway...There's something about French accents....

Yes.
I have had an itch to go to France for a few days now.

I suggested Gwenaëlle, on another thread, I think to mamansnet, but her DH didn't like it.

I think if you suggest names from a country or culture that isn't your own, there is quite a strong likelihood of you suggesting names that were fashionable decades ago. There's a current thread asking for Scandinavian names, but the ones I can think of are those of people roughly my own age.

Hope this doesn't out me, but I at school there was a Beryl, a Brenda and a Sheila. What were their (Welsh-speaking) parents thinking when there are so many names out there.