to think that sleeping through does not make a baby "good"?

[zombified]

First of all, I have a baby daughter. She is 4 months old. She is not sleeping through. And I am tired. So possibly IABU

BUT

It bugs me the way other parents say their baby is "good" or an "angel" etc because the baby sleeps through the night. Or they put it down to their excellent parenting/routine- not in so many words, but it is smugly implied.

This especially annoys me when the babies are formula fed or have a formula feed last thing at night. I have nothing against formula- but it does make babies sleep, so there's not much credit to be taken either by the parents or the baby on that count.

Whether a baby sleeps through or not does not make them good (or, by implication, bad). They are babies. They have no concept of sleeping through, they have no ability to be good or bad. They are just their lovely, innocent selves. Whether they sleep through or not.

My daughter has had the same routine since she was 8 weeks old, is in bed and asleep at 7pm every night, and her nights vary widely.I don't put it down to my parenting, whatever happens. And I certainly don't think she's "better" when she sleeps for longer. I'd love her to sleep for 12 hours a night for my own sake, but she wouldn't be any more of an angel if she did.

There's this obsession with sleeping through, as if it's not simply something which makes life easier for the parents, but is in fact the pinnacle of childrearing and a huge achievement for parent and child about which to crow endlessly.

Having just had my 5th baby (who slept through at about 5-6weeks) I can tell you its down to luck IMO.

Some do, some dont. 4 of mind bf and one ff. The ff one woke up every hour for the first few months.

'is he a good baby?' is the first question people ask me when the meet me with DC5. Its a ridiculous question. What am I going to say 'no,hes a little bastard'?

But its just one of those things and absolutly nothing is meant by it. Its like when people lean over your 8 week old and say 'whats your name then?' They are not actually expecting him/her to answer. Its just what people do.

Its the law.

(like when people say 'oo that went quick didnt it?' when you have been pregnant for about 2 years!

Haven't read all the other replies but wanted to say

1. YANBU about other peoples smugness and a all night sleeper being 'good'

1. YABU about formula - I couldn't breastfeed as much as I cried and tried and had to use formula - my DD only just started sleeping through at 2 years old!!!!!!!

formula does not make babies sleep at all

OK the formula comment was definitely a bit hasty... I really thought it made babies sleep through.

And I really wasn't saying it was wrong to give babies formula, even if it's to try to make your baby sleep.

Just that it is a very obvious demonstration that how a baby sleeps is not down to its innate goodness or evil!

Agree with what you're saying, babies can't be classified as good or bad. I prefer 'relatively easy' to describe what some might call a 'good' baby.

Have to say though that IME formula made my babies sleep better. But there is no need to be smug if you're lucky enough to have a baby that sleeps through of its own accord.

If you manage to get your baby to sleep through after a week of controlled crying then you've every bloody right to feel smug.

Yanbu
Babies sleep patterns change so much, mothers who brag about it now will find themselves sleepless at some point!
What is 'through the night' anyway? Its perfectly normal for a 4 month old to still be waking at night.

You are correct about formula fed babies sleeping for longer, the reason breastfed babies wake more is that breastmilk is far easier to digest and they need to feed more often. I feel your tiredness! It will get easier dont worry

Formula does not make babies sleep at night! There is no magic wand and whether they sleep through or not is not a judgement on the quality of your parenting.

I have to say I thought mine were 'good' when they did!
But everyone interprets things differently, mine didn't go to bed at 7pm like yours does but stayed up all evening. They then had a bath and a BF about 11pm, you're probably in bed by then, so everyone has a differnt definition on 'sleeping through'.

edit; "controlled crying" shouldn't be used at all imho, but certainly not on a 4 month old baby!!! HP's don't recommend it until after 6 months.

YAB a little bit U. But only because you shouldn't care. My (breastfed) babies did all sleep through the night from a young age 8 weeks - but only because I was pretty relaxed about letting them sleep in our bed until they were 6 months - as that worked for me. I am sure someone (a visiting health nurse) probably said 'naughty baby' sleeping in mummy's bed - but I didn't care - it's just something people say to try and show empathy for you, not to give you a hard time.

In a way I think yabu actually. Okay, sleep isn't everything but it is fairly high up there. Plus it seems to me those good sleepers are generally good content little people generally - easier babies if you like. No comment about your formula scenario and it's usually down to pure luck but yes if my baby slept well, I would definitely call it good. And you might call me smug but hey ho.

YANBU
I agree with katkouta, babies who sleep through initially often start waking in the night when teething, having a growth spurt etc. when your baby will probably be sleeping 12hrs a night

Old women in public places (doctors surgery, supermarket, bus etc) always say to me 'Ooh, isnt she good?' about my DD, mainly I think because she is quite quiet, will sit contentedly for a long time and yes, when the subject of sleep comes up and I say she slept through from 6 weeks old, they usually say 'Ooh, lovely! Isn't she very good?' . I must admit, i did feel like kissing the ground beneath her when I realised she was going to be a 'good' sleeper

Having had an older child who seemed to survive on approximately 3 hours sleep a night for the first three years of his life, it is good. For me. My DD isn't inherently good, though, no. To be honest, I don't think people think much when they say this sort of thing. It;'s just small talk, isn't it? Nobody ever says 'Not sleeping through? Bad baby!' do they? I would chill about it if I were you. Life is too short.

p.s. the formula myth - load of bollocks. Both mine were formula fed from quite early on and they were like chalk and cheese, as I said - one hardly slept for three years, the other slept 12 or 13 hours a night from 6 weeks old. Similarly, I have known breastfed babies who slept very well and those who were nightmarish.

But, PuppyMonkey, does that make a baby who doesn't sleep through 'bad'? That's just ridiculous. And also a dumb generalisation about 'good sleeper = good content little person generally". What utter tosh.

Agree with TheBolter. Sleeping might not make them 'good' but it certainly makes them less challenging and (unless you get off on sleep deprivation) me a lot happier.

It doesn't make them "bad", it makes them a bad sleeper, compared to their better-sleeping peers, is all.

Honestly people dont really believe newborns "behave" (or not) - they dont actually mean naughty, bad, good, etc. What they mean is accomodating. Letting you get on with some semblance of normality and on a good night's sleep, is all.

There is apparently research that is pretty conclusive that food in general - be it formula or solids - does not make babies sleep, and that is in fact a neurological milestone that allows a baby to go throughout the night without waking for food or otherwise.

Its true that formula takes longer to digest than breastmilk, so its known for allowing babies to go longer between feeds for that reasons. But it doesn't take 12 hours to digest - so a baby sleeping 7pm-7am who is on formula has more going on that a satisfied tummy.

I was exclusively breastfed till I was 7 months old and slept through the night from 6 weeks. I found that hard to believe but my Dad backed it up so it must be true!

I have to be honest, when people ask how my DD (15 wks) sleeps, I do say she's "really good", as she sleeps 10pm till 7amish most nights. But I don't mean it in the "well behaved" sense and I certainly wouldnt say she was "bad" or "naughty" if she didn't sleep so well; babies that age don't have the capacity to be good or bad in that sense. And it's certainly nothing whatsoever to do with our parenting; we're just really bloody lucky.

(As an aside, I once saw a woman tap her 7 week old baby on the cheek and call it "naughty" for.. blowing raspberries. This was long before I had my own baby, but I was !)

dd is 9 months, has had formula from 5 months, still doesn't sleep through the night.

At christmas, a cousin asked me, 'Is she good then?' I said ' oh no she'd terrible, got an asbo already' (in a jokey way obv) and the cousin looked at me as if i had just killed a kitten.

BusyMizzIzzy - i was on a bus once and a baby - around 6 months i'd say, was getting a row off her gran for making noises!

Ha! Ha!

My daughter was the model baby until about seven or eight months old when she started teething. I exclusively breastfed her until 24 weeks and she was sleeping through at 24 weeks 7 to 7.

However this was short lived. she started teething at about seven and half months and has not slept through since. Infact she wakes about 3 to 4 times a night.

I think that how well a baby sleeps is more to do with luck than whether you breastfeed or formula feed.

YANBU

My baby slept through at 1 week from 10 in the clock to 7 in the morning. Every day, Every week, Every month.

Now, this is not down to my "routines", parenting, baby beeing good etc.

I just think i was lucky and baby was big at birth.

PS: feeding bottle and breast.

Yep - had to keep away from (otherwise lovely) mums who referred to their babies as 'so good' as they slept well. I refused to think of my baby as 'bad' just cos he didn't.

There was no moral compass in his sleeping abilities. He was just hungry hungry hungry for the first six months of his life...

Yanbu, I used to hate it when my DD was a few months old (mind you she is only 11months atm) but the constant oh I have a good baby because he/she sleeps drove me up the wall. I happen to think that my DD is a good baby although she doesnt sleep through. And on the formula milk, although I dont have any evidence of that being the only reason for babies sleeping through, all my friends with the 'good' babies formula fed

YABU, really, but only because you're sleep-deprived.

I was exactly the same - saw other people 'crowing' about their babies as a criticism of mine.

I look back now and think It Was The Best of Times, It Was the Worst of Times.

YANBU. I hate the language associated with babies' sleep. I'm sick to death of reading FB status updates about 'Mummy's little princess' (vom) who slept through the night or whatever.

My DD is 4 months and wakes twice for a quick feed and then goes back to bed. I have no problem with that at all. It's luxurious compared to the early days when she'd only sleep on me and I'm glad I can offer her comfort and nourishment. In lots of other ways she's very easy-going. Doesn't make her 'good' though. Stupid word to use in relation to a baby.