to not know how to kick the feeling of inadequacy at being the "poor relation" in every way imaginable?

[arses]

Well, further to my other AIBU thread (screaming at the inlaws), I am still in need of MN to let off some steam..

Inlaws visiting this weekend. They are terribly successful. Have a ginormous house with about seven bedrooms and all mod cons (BIL and wife). Dh's BIL's wife is a GP as are all the rest of his siblings. All have these mini-mansions and great big Chelsea tractors and BMW's and the like.

We live in a 2-bed ex-council house in a city in the North of England with our six month old son. It's in an 'up and coming area' (or was before the recession) and there are fantastic facilities, we enjoy living here even if the estate is slightly scratty. We don't - and never have - seen it as a 'forever home': it was our step on to the ladder as public sector workers.

I didn't come from huge money myself: my father is an alcoholic and hasn't worked for years, my mother is a teacher. The drink soaked up a lot of cash until they split and it took some years for my mother to build up money of her own so we used to rent flats, move about a lot etc. Despite the dysfunction of it all, it wasn't all bad: I would say I learned how to 'make do and mend' and I don't see either things or property as particularly important (although I owning my own home is important to me).

Growing up was all a bit chaotic and housework was always pretty far down the agenda, but we were all relaxed about it and the house wasn't a candidate for 'how clean is your house' or anything, just very rough round the edges. My own home is the same. My mother's philosophy was that housework was secondary to pretty much everything else and as long as the bathroom and the kitchen were clean-ish and you could see all your floors, you could get on with what she considered the 'proper business of life' - talking, playing, writing, reading etc.

Anyway, fast forward to this weekend. SIL and I were initially rubbing eachother up the wrong way when talking about childcare.. but we moved on. Yesterday we decided with the good weather and the match to have a BBQ. It fits in with my 'slob like' tendency to do the easy hosting thing - chuck some food on the barbie, relax with it etc.

However, it turns out how the other half live was not compatible with my lackadaisical approach to home dining. SIL took over our (very small) kitchen. Where was my pestle and mortar? Did I have any red wine glasses (I have about six, we don't entertain formally as we don't have the space - no dining area). Where was my dish for serving fish? How did I cope without a pantry? Was it very hard without a utility room?

Then - mortifyingly - she took out the insert for the cutlery and cleaned it, complained that the oven wasn't very clean and emptied our fridge of all foods past their sell-by-date. She hoiked out our table (we never open it fully as it takes over half the living area) and set it fully but of course I didn't have the prerequisite 'proper' cutlery for this - I don't have serving mats or bowls to serve food in, it's just not what we do.

Meanwhile, BIL was with dh, asking how we 'lived like this' and asking were we going to continue on in such a small house for long..

I can't explain how horrible I felt about it all. I felt like such a failure as a wife, like the dirtiest, foulest slob imaginable. Rationally, I tell myself things like: 'it's not women's work' and it doesn't reflect on me as a person: my house doesn't have new fangled appliances and it isn't always spick and span but we are happy with it.. it has hot spots of clutter but is generally a pleasant place to live. However, in my heart I felt such shame. I tried to 'help out' in my own kitchen and found I just didn't know what to do or how to be, that somehow there were all these new rules about what I should be doing and where things should go and I couldn't find things.

I know that the shame side is partially to do with having grown up with an alcoholic: I feel terribly vulnerable when people root around in my house and disproportionately ashamed.. so I think that SIL was most probably trying to be helpful but it didn't stop me from heading upstairs to have a cry mid-afternoon .

In dh's family we are treated like a charity case. We're not. We're very much a middle-income family but this is where and how we live. I can see they have a different lifestyle but I don't feel the need to get them to embrace mine. Why on God's earth do I feel I have to apologise for not being uber-wealthy and having the right stuff when I don't even have any interest in it? Why do I feel ashamed of my rough-round-the-edges house when it suits our family just fine?

AIBU to have such thin skin and if so, what the fuck do I do about it?

Self employed GPs can earn £100k - £200k I think some of them depending on the practice and if those doctor siblings married people who earn similar arounds then a family income of about £400k - yes they might well have a nice car and house.

The interesting issue is what is in you and what is in them. If you're dining with peasants and they pick the food up with their hands you copy them - I think Queen Victoria did that once and eveyone then followed suit so in theory no one should be making anyone uncomfortable. So in their cars coming over to you they shoudl be thinking... okay they are different, not like us so we won't talk about Jonny's school being in the top 10 in the country or how hard it is to live on £200k a year and we'll try to find areas of common interest.

But other people whatever their lives are
nothing like this. It's an internal issue whether you are or not. Some are borderline aspergers and never consider others, tactless to the core.

So I suppose (a) ananlyse who said what and whether their comments were really tactless or whetehr you were just over sensitive - probably the former not the latter and (b) if you aren't sure about your standards etc at home think about that. There is no right or wrong abouti t although some families have rooms os knee high in mess they are embarrassed to bring school friends home. Over 25 years of being a mother of 5 we have known a few like that and my children have sometimes commented on how messy a house is (usually mess not dirt as children don't really see dirt and we all know that in some ways the more dirt the better - the more dirt your toddler crawls in the less likely it will have asthma - GPs should prescribe dirt in some ways)

She was rude, but must have thought she was helping. Why don't you just explain to her how you feel, and she'll perhaps explain that she has problems relaxing. Then just be happy you are different. We don't all have to be the same - there's no wrong or right! (Although it is wrong to go to someone's house and impose her views!)

I'm a hopeless entertainer, and I just laugh about it when those sort of friends come round - needless to say, I don't entertain often! Be happy she cleaned your cutlery drawer - now you don't have to do it.

You never know, she might have gone home concerned that you thought she was too materialistic etc etc.

YADNBU! I would love to know what a serving dish for fish looks like though?! Surely it is any dish the fish fits in?!

aw! I feel really sad for you, and your SIL sounds a bit of a bossy insensitive cow, but I don't this this is about her casting aspersions on your housekeeping skills, this is about you feeling shame for things outside your control, and I can identify with that. To the outsider looking in I have the perfect life, and the perfect house, etc, and come across as articulate and confident, yet I have and (always have had) deep-seated feelings of inadequacy, and I feel am never really feel good enough. It's because some of my background has been a bit yet I have always surrounded myself with people who have had a more straightforward 'nice' life. Do you feel like this generally in life, or do your in laws just bring it out?

As everyone has said YANBU!
We are the poor relation in our respective families, particularly against my sil and her family.
However, she has so much more class than your inlaws,and is helpful without anything like that behaviour.
I guess we are all aware of the situation,and understand that there is a definite standard of common curtesy that everyone adheres to.
Needless to say, when we are in a similar position, we also play by the same rules of respect and curtesy.

It demonstrates absolutely no manners or 'class' to behave in such a way. True manners were all about making everyone feel comfortable, absolutely not what you saw. I know who I would think was more inadequate socially in this instance, and it certainly wasn't you.

As for BIL, his comments are totally out of order and amazing in their audacity. I'm surprised they were allowed to stay!

your BIL and SIL are acting like rude cunts to be blunt

the money thing, well you cant do anything about that

but dont take the rudeness

practice some firm retorts, with a smile on your face

and dont take it, no way

Oh bloody hell. Have just taken a look at my cutlery drawer! Hang on a mo.....

they were bloody rude, and ignorant.
having money or objects does not make you a decent person, and manners cost nothing.

what is it they say, money and class are two seperate things, and people behaving like that only have money, they are sorely lacking in class or judgement.

we have friends, who has a seroiusly fab house, both drive top of the range bmws, and plenty of spare cash to enjoy life, we live in a TINY 3 bed house, im a sahm, oh works in a shop. they have NEVER made me feel inadequate when they come here, yes they have a dishwasher, but they are happy to wash up here, yes they have a bloody big aga, but they are happy to eat what tehy are served here, yes they have a manicured garden and a man who looks after it for them, but they are more than happy to sit in ours, surrounded by footballs, and a tonne of kids junk, eating off my mismatched plates and drinking out of out tescos glasses. the reason being? they are good decent people, who accpet us as a valued part of their lives regardless of what we have. your ils obviously are decent people to put your home and life down in such a rude way.

You do not have a thin skin and YA Definately NBU! you sound like you have your values and belief system firmly in place and these people have been incredibly rude to you and your family..

I understand that your dads problems in the past can make you feel vulnerable and guess that is part of the reason you feel so upset by them, you have coped admirably and sound really self aware.

How bloody dare they!!!! its just pure rudeness to go into someone elses home and start making judgements based on your own value system. This sort of attitude really pisses me off, and if it is any consolation usually indicates a deeper insecurity.

Please please ignore these people and continue to live and enjoy your life the way YOU choose.

YANBU. You are fine and normal. completely agree with OutOutLetItAllOut re: class and money.

Oh poor you.

They have been massively insulting and tactless. But the worst of it is that it all sounds unintentional to a large degree.

Intentionally insulting you can deal with. Intentional would give you the satisfaction of some sort of retaliation.

But unintentional is so frustrating because how can you explain how you feel to people who just do not get it in any way shape or form? People who have become so submerged in a world of special fish plates that they seem to have lost the ability (if they ever had it) to epmathise with others or enjoy them for who they are not what they have.

They sound dreadful. I wonder how they would react if the situation was reversed. Visitors to their home making them feel crap about themselves? Right off the Christmas list pronto, is my guess.

And no, I wouldn't be grateful to her for the cleaning. I'd be insulted. Making you feel like a spare part in your own kitchen indeed!?

I'd be quite straight I think. No doubt they will speak to you again soon? If the subject of this visit comes up say they hurt your feelings. Tell them. Don't be on the defensive or they'll assume you are envious of their money, their stuff.

Be calm about it. No need to cut them off forever or have a huge row. But sound to them how you quite justifiably sound here - hurt by their comments. They should apologise and rethink how they come across.

How rude!! Unbelievable that your SIL would do that!!! Presumably she has a cleaner in her house, daaahling.

Next time you have a BBQ and she comes round and starts cleaning like some freak just give her other stuff to clean, like whilst you're there can you empty out my cupboards and clean them, you obviously enjoy it. Give her plenty of stuff to do and then you can all go out in the garden and enjoy yourselves.

Seriously the only way to deal with it is to laugh it off and take the piss out of it. And try not to have them in your house too often.

And to feel sorry for them. If life is so shallow for them chances are they are very unhappy people.

A lot of people do this too. I was talking to someone recently who had had the same thing, constant criticism whilst they went round their house. If people have nothing nice to say they should shut up.

But I do think it's worth analysing it. What is one example of who said what - literally word for word if possible?
If someone comes here and says where is the XYZ (something I don't have) they might innocently assume everyone has dried herbs for example and it doesn't bother me in the slightest taht I don't have that thing and I don't take it as criticism. Sometimes it might prompt me to get XYZ if that sounds ilke a good idea. Other people might say the same thing butin a differfent voice and it be be nastily meant. Also if you're content with how you have things which luckily is how I've always felt (which is perhaps the key to all these thigns) then it tends more to be water off a duck's back.

Right, am back.

Where was I? Oh yes, I agree with everyone on here who has said you sound lovely and someone who has their head screwed on right. Your ILs sound extremely rude.

In our family, we have a similar situation but the other way round. My SIL had quite a difficult upbringing, very little money, competitive, bombastic, aggressive siblings, warring parents, difficult father, mother with a personality disorder etc... I suspect that she might have felt inadequate coming into our family, although none of that was an issue for us at all. We were thrilled that my bro had found someone he loved who appeared to love him back and did our best to welcome her with open arm, although I will say it wasn't always easy as she can be very 'prickly.'

Oh God, we're all terrified of her! Bro is successful and they now have pots of money, and we're the ones who feel inadequate! (well, not really but if we were more sensitive souls). She behaves in our houses exactly as your SIL did in yours. Bloody rudely. I guess we deal with it by a) not inviting them round much if we can avoid it and b) making jolly sure we've had a major springclean before she arrives so she doesn't have much ammunition. And realising that, whatever we do, she'll always find something to dig at. And if not us, then she'll spend the time telling us about the shortcomings of other people she knows. Odd, but she doesn't have many friends!

So, no. It's her not you. I'd love to come round to yours for a BBQ.

HanBanan, I don't see why they'd be unhappy - they just have a different outlook on life. They'd only be unhappy if they had that outlook, but were poor .

At the end of the day, they are relatives, and it'd be nice to all be friends. I'd point it out to them, and they'd probably be mortified. Some people are driven by money, and you might find all their friends are too. They just aren't used to meeting normal people with different values!

I think the BIL was the most rude, though...

They both sound very unhappy/insecure tbh.

I hadn't spotted taht bit - "Meanwhile, BIL was with dh, asking how we 'lived like this' and asking were we going to continue on in such a small house for long.."

I suppose as they're brothers (I assume) and it was a private conversation may be it was just their normal banter. Most people live in small bouses or flats. Most of us even those of us living in large houses know that and are sensitive to it.

Unbelievable bad manners from your in-laws! The fault lies entirely with them. Maybe your SIL meant well, but she behaved appallingly. I have suffered the same thing for years from a certain member of my own family and it makes me feel furious, but I have learned to laugh about it at last. Talking about it to other people really helps - makes you realise that you are not at fault after all.

How can your SIL do her job as a GP if she is so lacking in sensitivity and good manners?

Loads of good advice already on this thread, so I don't think I need to add to it, except to say that I agree with Biddy's idea (saw you on the other thread, Biddy - shouldn't we be Flying?) to go out and buy some cheap ASDA stuff for next time so you have the basics and can preempt rude comments. Although I mind less about a certain rude, judgemental member of my own family, I still plan ahead and make sure the house is ultra tidy first, etc, so that there is less scope for criticism. I know I probably shouldn't care about it, but I do.

YANBU not to know how to kick the feeling of inadequcy - it is a very natural reaction, especially considering the factors you highlight in your upbringing.

I know who I would rather spend time with out of you and your SIL. Your idea of a bbq sounds much more fun.

It does sound as if you have huge feelings of inadaquacy - and, because of this, perhaps you are oversensitive to what people may say.

Your SIL does sound a pain in the arse though and she should not have made a point of cleaning out your cuterly draw and criticising your tableware.

But - this is where I disagree with the majority. Most people DONT like being in messy, dirty homes. I wouldn't have made a fuss like your SIL did - but I wouldn't have been happy to eat off cutlery that came from a dirty draw or food that came from a fridge crammed full of out of date stuff.

YANBU what a bitch. If they are so wealthy and have so many rooms why aren't you at their house having pimms and canapes.

I wouldn't have them back, you are obviously a lovely woman and a kind host.

Our house is bigger and we have slightly more disposable income than DB, so we do the entertaining, they pitch in, we are a FAMILY. That means accepting everyone for what they are....

FWIW I don't think you are jealous of them at all. I think they are trying to make you feel inadequate though. I also don't think the situation is about your needing to earn more to be like them because you don't feel the need to. Money isn't everything!

My SIL is a GP, and her house is the most untidy, dusty and relaxed house I have ever been in. Not one piece of crockery matches, and they could not give a fiddlers. Why I would be perturbed by a messy house that is not mine is beyond me. Your SIL sounds as if she has a problem, tbh.

But why would they try to make OP feel inadequate? It's the OP who feels inadequate herself, although she has absolutely no reason to, as we all agree. I think they're just totally insensitive and OP needs to point it out. They'll realise and then can all be friends and laugh about it in future years.

...or they'll still be totally insensitive, and OP can choose to reduce contact with them, as they're not actually that nice.

For all we know, SIL may have gone home upset that she had to clean OP's cutlery drawer because she has an issue with germs .

Money doesn't buy manners. I think you should feel grateful that you are not a judgemental person and just a normal human being getting on with what you've got in life and not worrying about things that really don't matter.