To wish the next 11 months away?

[CinnabarRed]

DS2 is 4 weeks old; DS1 is 2.6 years.

I hate the newborn phase. The broken nights, the constant feeding, getting not even a smile back from DS2, neglecting DS1 because DS2 screams anytime I put him down, the anxiety and constant worry that I'm not doing if Right (especially re not being able to get DS2 to settle himself to sleep or even put him down).

I felt just the same with DS1, only really lifting at around 6 months when he became a little person in his own right.

I long for the next year to pass. DP tells me I'm wrong to wish DS2's life away. But each day passes so slowly, even with DP giving DS2's late feed as a bottle of EBM so I can get some sleep.

I just hate this phase.... Sigh.

It is a really difficult time, especially with an older toddler. I found myself wishing DS2 would grow up sometimes, but now he is nearly 3 and I look back on the baby period more fondly (though wouldn't want to do it again)!

But your DS2 will soon be smiling, and I did find that made a big difference.

Is your DS2 a more difficult baby than DS1? Mine were the other way round, and I did get PND with DS1 because I felt so useless, and then if you can't put him down or get him to sleep it means you have no time for yourself and you kind of lose your identity somehow. I found it much easier the second time round as I had decided there was no right way and you just have to muddle through as best you can - and some babies are simply more difficult than others, and that's not your fault.

I would think about whether you may have a bit of PND. The things that made a big difference to me with DS1 were getting out for a walk every day and also trying to get some time to myself (1-2 hours) twice a week, ideally out of the house, where I felt like a normal human being again.

Do you have any support? If you are struggling then get in touch with Homestart.

I remember it well. It is just a phase and it will pass.

I really didn't like the baby phase - I was bored rigid, and I know all about development.

You may be depressed (I know I was) but you might also be one of those Mums who just loves it better when they are bigger. I love being a mum to my Primary aged kids - its brilliant, and I'm good at it!

I never coo over new babies - never have.

But might be worth finding out if you are depressed just in case.

You do sound low. It is tiring, I know - ds is a bugger for sleep, and poor dd has borne the brunt of my snappiness. A sling has been a bit of a lifesaver for me - ds is quite contented for ages in it, means I didn't have to put him down, but had hands free to deal with dd.

Perhaps you need to build in some fun in the coming weeks and months - some days out, a holiday? Just wee things to look forward to, and break up the weeks. I have heard it said that the first year with a second child is hard - I've certainly been a lot more tired! But ds is nearly 8mo now, and just lovely - it will get better.

I empathise, DD2 was hideous as a baby, cried all the time, didn't sleep for more than 1.5 hours at a time, i hated it and was really sad to be missing out on enjoying the newborn bit. Even the paediatrician we saw for her reflux told us just to cross each day off on the calendar as we survived it and we would suddenly one day find things got better.

It did get easier, she is now nearly 11 months and is an absolute joy, i am loving my time with her so much now, so i didn't enjoy the first 8 months but i have years to enjoy her now.

Don't be hard on yourself it can be very tough.

Well I don't blame you.

Things will gradually get better though - 4 weeks is so young and they start getting the hang of naps and sleeping a bit longer at night, then they start being able to amuse themselves a bit, and it gradually gets a bit better and a bit better as the weeks slip past.

I totally sympathise though, I have a nearly 3yo and a 10mo and it's been boody awful. I cant wait to get back to work. Not everyone is cut out for babies and toddlers - my DH is better at it than me TBH.

Do make sure that you get sleep where you can, look after yourself, eat properly, get some time to yourself completely away from both of them if you can, even if it's only a ten min walk, and try the suggestions that others have given.

You'll get through it

I'm waiting to be assessed for depression. My GP won't do the assessment before DS2 is 6 weeks old. I did have PND with DS1, and this feels very similar.

We live in the countryside, and the one thing I used to really look forward to was taking DS2 for a long walk across the field in the sling while DS1 was with his childminder. But my HV says I mustn't put DS2 in the sling anymore because it won't allow him any chance to learn to self-settle. Which is an absolute bugger, because putting DS2 in the sling while I put DS1 to bed was the only way I could manage - bedtime is now a nightmare. It also means I've lost my only way of calming DS2 down when he gets overstimulated (which tends to happen each evening), and can't get jobs done during the day.

The HV is not been helpful. If the sling works for you then use it or tell her to come around and do bedtime for you.

Getting out in the fresh air will do you all good.

I should also add that DP is wonderful and DS1 still goes to the childminder part time, so I do have support. Makes it even more pathetic that I hate the newborn stage so much.

Fucking hell (sorry for big swear but it needed it)

Ignore the HV
Use the sling
Have your walk, it's a lovely sunny day

Am that the HV has removed your main outlet of relaxation, enjoyment and pleasure, especially when she knows that you had PND last time. And your main tool for settling the baby and getting some work done.

Your DS2 will learn to settle in the end, they always do!

One tip I have learnt from MN - if you have a HV making unhelpful suggestions like this sling thing - tell them what they want to hear

It's not pathetic Cinnabar, newborns are hard work, especially with a toddler as well. It could be PND, or it might just be that you're not a fan of newborns. Either way, don't be too hard on yourself. In my (albeit limited) experience, it gets a little easier with each week that passes.

But what if the HV is right? What if I'm "breaking" DS2's ability to sleep by using the sling? I wish I felt confident enough to trust my judgment.

YABU but I understand and sympathise completely. I don't particularly enjoy the baby stage - I feel a bit anxious all the time and cope much better with older babies and toddlers (I'm looking forward to primary school age!).

Is there anyone (mum/sister/ friend/ random mumsnetter?) who can come and sit with you just to keep you company a bit? Are there any activities you can take your DS1 to so that he feels he's getting attention IYSWIM?

Xposts. The HV is barmy. DS will learn to self-settle but you can carry around as much as you need to. This stage is hard enough - do whatever you need to get through it -dummies/co-sleeping/slings whatever and worry about changing habits later.

Honestly, please don't worry about whether you're doing it right. Your DS will be much happier in the sling and he doesn't need to learn selfsettling yet.

OMG

Please ignore that HV. He's only 4 wks old fgs. Sorry - cross with HV not you.

Sling was my lifeline with 2nd baby. Then a door bouncer took the baton when he was a bit bigger.

Switch your brain off when someone says the following phrases to you:
'self-settle'
'rod for your own back'
'spoiling him'
'should you/he still be doing that'

Oh cinnabar

The baby is 4 weeks old, he hasn't got a clue what's going on. I'm not a sling person myself (ie I'm not speaking as someone who is an attachment parent style person) but at this age whatever gets you through is what you do.

Even if there was any chance of babies getting into "bad habits" or whatever, it's certainly not when they're this big! What you do now will make no difference long term to settling etc - IME some babies are good at self settling, some aren't, and there are techniques that you can try much later on to encourage sef settling etc if you feel that you want to. But all that stuff is for later, don't worry about it. For now just do what comes naturally, to make life as easy as possible for you and your newborn.

Your HV is a complete arse. Start ignoring her advice.

Agree 100% with using the sling. I'm another who finds the baby stage quite hard and I prefer it when you can actually talk with your child.

Ds (dc2) lived in the sling as a baby as i simply would not have coped otherwise. In fact I still carry him on my back in the Ergo (take a lot of London rush hour busses and can't face taking a buggy on them).

I also (after a hellish first year with dd of me spending every night trying to settle her in her crib) researched co-sleeping and did that from one year old with dd and day one with ds. Not everyone's cup of tea and probably varies between children but I definitely got better nights sleep with ds than in dd's first year. Ds is now 2 and sleeps in his own bed and doesn't come through to ours until he wakes up in the morning. (Dd is almost 4 and often climbs into our bed in for the last few hours of the night though!)

I don't think you can predict or control how children will turn out in terms of independence / self-settling etc. You can however control and do the things that help you get through the day (such as taking a walk with ds2 in the sling).

Ignore the HV. Seriously, he is 4 weeks, he will learn to self-settle as he gets older. Also, you don't need to keep him in the sling all the time- if you are concerned you could limit its use to the bedtime and then once a day to get out and take your walk. I think a bit of fresh air and exercise once a day will help a lot.

YANBU - you are a fab mum who is doing her best. The first bit is so hard and everyday seems to pass very slowly at times.

Ignore the HV and get out for your walk. Personally i find being in the house all day trying to get the baby to nap/feed/wind just gets even more depressing and you will feel better if you've had some distraction.

God some hv are really crap aren't they!
At four weeks and with a toddler you need to do anything you like to keep you sane
settling himself comes later!

Agree with the others. Ignore the HV, your baby, your choice. If you have found a way that works for you and your child why would you change that?

With my DD I found myself doing all sorts of things that I thought I 'shouldn't' (based mostly on the books I read). I fed her to sleep, gave her a dummy, let her sleep on me- and she grew out of each of those habits, with no problems whatsoever when she was ready to. Next time, I will go with what feels right for me.

Oh, stuff the HV. I fed dd to sleep until she was 7-8 mo, when she gave it up herself. teaching them to self settle is, I think, easier when they're older, and can understand better what you're saying and doing.

You need something to keep you sane, and something to look forward to. Some HVs are jsut obsessed with self settling.

I felt the same - toddlers are marvellous, but the first year was pretty grim. Now expecting DC2 and looking forward to having another child, but not the newborn bit.

Agree with everyone else - if sling works for you, use it. That's only HV's opinion, and it's a pretty far-out opinion nowadays. You're a much better judge of what helps you.