to be shocked about the amount of suppo rt a teacher gets when they nearly kill a pupil

[2shoes]

now I know it sounds like the boy was not a good kid, but he was 14, the teacher nearly killed him, yet on here and in the media the teacher has been getting so much support.
yet a boy was nearly killed...........
(prepares to be flamed)

My sympathies are entirely with the teacher. And this is what happens when you remove the powers of discipline from teachers.

I agree with Gay40.

Like another poster on page 1 or 2 I only teach part time now (in a difficult school) - I couldn't do it full time.

Some kids are......shits. Nasty shits, who will look for a vulnerability in a member of staff and exploit it. Those kids shouldn't be half bludgeoned to death of course, but my feeling is that in this case the SMT are as much to blame as the teacher.

In my experience (from observation of colleagues) school leaders set struggling teachers up to get them out on competency proceedings rather than supporting them.

A very small minority of children, for whatever reason, are creatively vicious in their behaviour towards teachers (or some teachers, or maybe just one teacher, whilst being perfectly civilised in someone else's lesson.

(One reason why it's bad form to say 'Well, she's all right in my lessons', in the staffroom...).

Bullies pick their victims: the ringleaders in this instance picked a teacher who had been off sick & whom they sensed to be vulnerable, & whom they thought could be got to explode entertainingly - tears, swearing at them or going home & topping himself would all have been satisfactory reactions.

Of course the teacher's actions were awful & I don't think anyone's seriously upholding them as 'how to deal with little shits'.

But the wider causes are that 'decent' kids in a group dominated by a determined bully out to 'break' a teacher, will go along with it. Stanford Prison Experiment, anyone?

SLG should've been aware of the deteriorating situation (although often a 'not coping' teacher, especially one who has previously been successful & well-regarded, will not feel able to ask for help).

We need wider awareness of 'student on teacher' bullying, & a culture where its victims don't feel that they 'should' be able to deal with it - up until the second when they snap.

It's happening routinely in schools across the country - it's just that usually the teacher concerned loses their marbles quietly & without hurting anyone else.

The court came to the right result. I hope the teacher finally gets the support he needs.

'The footage is chilling and reminiscent of Columbine.'

I was working in the DTC, the Denver Tech Center, Denver the day that happened, having lived in CO since 1993, living in Littleton.

Those perpetrators planned their attack very carefully for a long, long time before carrying it out.

They sought to murder in a calculating fashion and blow up at least parts of the school and then commit suicide, that was all part of their nihilist plan.

That footage is nowhere, nohow reminiscent of Columbine.

Very little CCTV footage was released to the public from Columbine because of course teh cameras recorded the execution and severe injury of a number of pupils by their own classmates.

And Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris never snapped. They were almost casual in their actions.

Oh, and the small difference in that they were using a number of firearms.

I'm wondering if I've seen different footage as the kids I saw were still baiting said teacher then following him back.

Apologies for suggesting that the children appeared scared and that the teacher in question looked threatening. Apologies for suggesting that witnessing a teacher losing control, dragging a student to a storeroom and hitting him over the head with a dumbbell while shouting 'die die die' could be traumatising.

I am very sorry that you were in Denver, expat. However, I will not apologise for suggesting that witnessing violence and panic in school reminded me of footage I saw of an event at the other side of the world.

The thing is, I was a right one in school. OK a complete bitch TBH. So I know the kids knew what they were doing and didn't give a toss. But also it's only years down the line I'm mature enough to regret how I carried on. These are not mature adults with sound reasoning obviously. We had a teacher who had a breakdown and thought it was a joke But Peter Harvey was ill and shouldn't have been in that position. Terrible mix of circumstances.

Glad to see this topic here: I've been away this week so following the story on the net. Was totally shocked by the result and some of the reporting (my fault for picking up the DM at the airport!). Surely, however awful the childrens' behaviour, it is never jutifiable for an adult to basically try to kill one of them?

Am not a lawyer, but would have thought a more accurate situation would have been for the teacher to have been found guilty of GBH or attempted murder or whatever and then perhaps receive a lenient sentence and support as appropriate, taking the provocation into account.

Because it is just not OK to batter a child round the head with a dumbbell. End of.

He pleaded guilty to GBH, & will receive a sentence accordingly - apparently a 'community order'. Don't know what one of those is or how it works.

He's spent 8 months on remand already.

I knew plenty of people like this when I was at school and in the schools I have seen recently - nasty, vile, unpleasant behaviour from mob members. Yes, they made the lives of some teachers a total misery. Breakdowns, mental health issues, hideous emotional damage. One of the kindest loveliest men I ever knew was driven to suicide by this sort of behaviour. Leaving a family behind of course. I would have liked to have seen his tormentors prosecuted too.

This type of lack of empathy for your fellow human being past the age of, say, 5? 6? is totally inexcusable and unforgivable. I do hope that those who caused that kind of misery in the classroom now feel guilty about it.

The fact is that the vast majority of people do NOT behave like this. It might be bad parenting, or it might be just that those people are bad people. I don't know, but I have little sympathy. I don't expect people who think that causing another person to go over the edge is "funny" can actually be considered human.
What I do know is that the total bitches at school are the total losers in adult life. I look at some of them on facebook and think - yes I can see that the kind of person you are has taken its toll on you. Some sort of justice there then.

A court of law and a judge and jury decided on the facts what was right in this case based on the evidence. trying to second guess their decision based on short partial news reporting is ridiculous and frankly brainless.

THERE WAS A TRIAL. THE JURY FOUND HIM NOT GUILTY.

FGS this is really pissing me off now. Unless you have a really big fucking issue with the British system of justice (in which case you should be talking about that, rather than one individual case) then you have to presume the jury considered all the evidence (and not just the reports you've seen/read) and adjudicated accordingly.

Do you all have grave misgivings with our legal system? And if so, what other system would you like to see introduced? And if not, then shut the fuck up. I am sick to the back teeth of this mob rule mentality on here. It's revolting

LadyBiscuit, harpischord -
this thread is not about whether or not the teacher was guilty. It's about whether you can also feel sympathy for the boy and whether the media should decide that it is some sort of moral victory that this man was not given a sentence. There's been a lot of discussion about discipline, education etc and I don't think anyone has suggested that the teacher (with mental health issues) should have a different judicial outcome.
Read the OP - it's about the support for the outcome in the media and the 'facelessness' of the boy in question. Absolutely no mob mentality.

I was surprised the media did not say much more about the boy, even after the judgment was handed down - it cannot be for restraint on the media's part. The boy and his family must have decided not to speak to the press.

I wonder whether it is for legal reasons whilst the criminal trial is on. Will be interesting to see if the boy now decides to launch civil proceedings against the teacher or sell his story to the press.

If the boy continues to maintain a discreet silence, I might be able to find some sympathy for him. Otherwise, it would just reinforce my opinion of someone who thinks it sport to goad another person into a mental breakdown ...

why shouldn't he sue for compensation? whp knows what lasting affects he will have,
whether you think he is scum or not the teacher was found guilty of GBH

He can sue of course, it is his right to be decided by a court of law whether the attack did indeed have any lasting effects.

All I am saying is it will just serve to reinforce my opinion of him ...

I think it is incredibly unnecessary to show the footage following this poor mans breakdown.
As for traumatized children, well maybe they will think twice before acting like a pack of animals and pusing a man to a breakdown.

This poor man was failed by the people there to help and support him, he was put in to a highly stressful situation, and some members of the class took advantage of this.

I have no sympathy what so ever for the child hit or his family who will no doubt be doing hand wringing cash grabbing TV and newspaper interviews about now.

"Poor mane"???!!! Poor child. I really cannot believe some attitudes on this thread. Oh poor, poor teacher, absolute rubbish, if he couldn't do the job he shouldn't have been doing it. Poor child for being attacked and nearly killed, who knows what damage it has done to him.

I hope someone does the same to him one day, who knows, maybe the boy himself will find it necessary one day and he won't be at fault if he does imo. Maybe the parents, again, they wouldn't be wrong in my eyes. No excuse whatsoever for attacking a child. As for the footage, it shows the teacher to be aggressive.

Blaming the child for "goading" the teacher into attacking him is akin to blaming an abused woman for "goading" her "partner" into attacking her. Same difference imo and I've been in that position. You can't say one circumstance is OK and another isn't; either you're accountable and responsible for your own actions or you're not.

Not reading anymore of this now as it's just upsetting that people can blame a child for a grown man's disgusting actions, and to feel to pity for the poor boy?? Are you people robots???

blueshoes so if the boy has long term issues because of a criminal attack on him...he should just hide.
he is the victim

Very little sympathy for the little unruly twat that pushed this teacher over the edge.

Let's hope when that boy's head injuries clear up, his parents take drastic action in remedying his behaviour - but I doubt it. If I was them I'd be too ashamed to even consider legal action. Their son drove a teacher to the point of insanity.

mrsbean - I don't think you have read (or understood) my post or anything about the case.
The mob mentality I was referring to was the children's response in the classroom. Deliberate, vicious provocation to drive a man as far as they could push him = mob mentality. and yes I have seen in, on many occasions.

"that this man was not given a sentence" if you read the reports, then this is wrong. He is awaiting sentencing at a h earing in the future, pending reports. He was guilty of (iirc) causing gbh and he will receive a sentence for that afaik. He has already spent considerable time in prison so that will of course count as a prison sentence if he receives a custodial sentence.

IF he has long term issues, 2 shoes ... He does not have to hide. He can bring the suit I fully expect him to. Just surprised he has not already done so - and was prepared to temper my views based on that. But if he does sue, there's no surprise there.

I suspect the court will not award much by way of lost earnings.