to want to get rid of our dog who has bitten our son?

[paulaplumpbottom]

We have a 5 year old springer spaniel. He has always been the most gentle dog you can imagine and we all adore him. He has always been especially good with children and he has never shown any signs of aggression.

On Wed night my 20 month old son and I were sitting on the floor with the dog. My son was patting him very lightly on the head. This has been a very common occurance and our dog has always been very happy and relaxed before. My dog suddenly turned and aggressivly bit my son on the forhead. My son was fine and it did not break the skin.He did cry but was fine a minute later and I spoke to a doctor who said he would be fine. I then called my MIL who came and got my dog.

My husband was away on business and was not there to witness the attack. When I described the situation to him he said that I must be mistaken and that our dog was so placid that he would never do anything aggressive.This was also my MIL's reaction. I have been very furious because I feel that what I saw was a very aggressive attack and I am hurt that my judgement is being called into question. I no longer want the dog around the children. I have told my husband that he is never to be around our children again and that I want no legal responsibilty for him. My husband wants him back home but kept outside. My children and their friends play outside and I feel that it would be impossible to ensure that he would never come into unsupervised contact with him.
My Dh and MIL think i am being completely unreasonable. Am I?

I agree Zazen which is why I told my husband that if his mother insisted on taking the dog I want to make sure we are no longer legally responsible.

das and so im i, really your posts so stupid saying kids bite put them down also grow up ffs

If the dog bit your son without even a warning growl just because he was being gently patted, then he doesn't have the right temperament to be in a family with small children.

Of course dogs will nip if wound up, but a dog that snaps with so little provocation needs to be around adults who will not accidentally upset him.

Poor little dog - I find this really heartbreaking. If it had meant to hurt it would have really hurt your ds. It was obviously a warning - perhaps unbeknown to you he patted it harder or caught an ear, or an eye and hurt it. The natural reaction to being hurt is to snap (be it human or animal) but all credit to your dog, he didnt really bite as he would have caused damage had he done. I grew up with loads of animals and have loads now and all of them have their snappy behaviour if hurt - the ponies nip when girths are tightened (or pretend to nip as too good mannered to really do it), my in laws beloved dog who is soooo good with everybody snapped the air with dd3 when she stood on his tail accidently, our cats gently bite our fingers when being handled too harshly. Your poor dog may never do it again if your ds was taught to respect it and treat it gently, yet will potentially be rehomed with the sense of loss and confusion at 5 year old that would bring. Sad.

I don't think I could ever be relaxed about a dog I had seen act aggressively towards my child.

Both myself and dd have been bitten by different dogs who out of the blue attacked us - I had to have stitches and still have a scar on my ear.

Although not badly hurt, my dd was traumatised and it has taken years for her not to be scared around dogs.

I wouldn't risk keeping him. I think the worry would be at the back of my mind and take the pleasure out of having him around.

Being unsentimental, I would say you can always try having another dog.

my dog bit my daughter, she trod on his foot, she was 17 at the time, but he bit through her foot and she had to go to hospital. We had a 1yo at the time - of course we decided on rehoming the dog, i had time, DD2 wasn't mobile so i set about trying to rehome my dog - a difficult task, big dog with dubious breed reputation, rescue dog etc etc - anyway, in the process of trying to rehome him we discovered he had bone cancer and it was in the joint of the leg that DD1 trod on, of course he bit her - he was asleep at bottom of stairs, DD trod on his leg, it must have been agony - we had him put to sleep

Letting small child pat dog on head = craziness

You say MIL is having dog? or did i misread it? best solution all round i think. I doubt, taking the right precautions, if the dog would bite again but that "what if" will always be in teh back of your mind. Its about what is best for you AND the dog and i think rehoming is the best thing. Just don't get another dog!!!

Frog I find it heartbreaking to. I don't want any harm to come to Cooper.

I don't think I would get another dog. It just wouldn't seem right.

I think YABU. You should not have let your DS pat the dog. The first time he did it you should have stopped him and showed him how to stroke it instead.

Paula - I dont think you should get another dog either. I am truly not trying to be nasty but it does seem as if you expect too much. What if your son did hurt the dog (for example poke it in the eye while patting) and it just reacted. Cant you see that actually the dog did well not to bite properly (and if your ds was fine shortly after and no skin marks then it really wasnt a proper bite - just a gentle warning). What would you expect the dog to do on the spur of the moment if hurt suddenly - genuine question?

But the thing is, children don't always stroke dogs in the "correct" way - heavens above, my poor little terrier is my DDs best friend, and he don't half take some stick - but he is fantastic, however, i am wary and ensure DD doesn't hurt him. He has never ever shown any signs of aggression - however if he snapped at her just for patting him, he'd be history - if he snapped at her for doing more than that, then i wouldn't rehome him, lesson learned.

If a dog cannot tolerate head patting, which isn't ideal, but its not exactly being pulled across the room by its ears either - then its not a dog i would have with children.

OP thinking on it, if your MIL is having the dog, could she maybe foster him for a couple of years then you have him back when your son is old enough to know how to behave with him??

I was sitting right there. My DS did not poke him in the eye or ear. The dog was not hurt at all.
The dog didn't break the skin but my DS's forhead was very badly bruised and there were teeth marks.
I don't feel that it is too much to expect a dog not to bite my child.

I'm still hoping she won't take him. There are too many children about including my own.

If you genuinely were watching your ds's every move like an eagle and know for a fact that no stray finger went in an eye or twisted an ear, then ok - you have an unpredictable dog. But be honest with yourself, as i would never know that with my dds or ever watch them that closely and it wouldnt be obvious at all. Seems very weird after being so gentle for 5 years - coincides with your ds getting stronger and more forceful/aggressive maybe. It seems like you know what you want. Hope you find a really good home for the dog - sounds like he deserves it.

When I say I was sitting right there I mean I was petting the dog as well. My attention was completey focused on both of them.

Paula, your dog did not "bite" your son. He nipped in reaction to being patted on the head.

I can only echo Fluffyone's comments way back on the first page. I haven't read all 9 pages of this as I am not sufficiently even-tempered tonight to keep my cool with those who will inevitably bay for the poor dog's blood.

Clearly you, your child and your Spaniel are incompatible and the kindest, most decent thing you can do is to admit that you made a mistake and consult the experts in order to find him a good home. Obviously you won't love or trust him and if he stays at best he'll be banished to the garden come rain, sun or snow, with the relationship between owner and dog rapidly declining (probably until he's really resented).

If the Springer Rescue suggested by Fluffyone can't help you can always put a message up on the Pets section here, entitled Vallhala, and I'll gladly give you a list of no-kill rescues local to you/which take dogs country-wide or assist you in finding and negotiating with an appropriate rescue (and more about me/references if you'd like them, to prove I'm genuine).

Val - dog rescuer/networker.

Trouble is some dogs are just insettled by small children. My 2 small dogs are actually frightened by children thanks to some bratty kids I know.

I think your dog was just giving a warning - you think your child was patting your dog nicely but he didn't agree.

It's very difficult situation but I would want to give the dog another chance. But that's me.

Incidently, my sweet, gentle dog was on a lead by my side at the pub and a child snuck up beside her and was bugging her so she snapped at her. In a case like this I def thought the child (age 7) was at fault not my dog. She had been warned to leave her alond BTW. But I bet others wouldn't agree!

Ok, say you kept the dog. Would you ever trust it again? Really?

I am shocked at the number of people who have said 'oh well the child must have patted it wrong... i was nipped s child... etc etc. ' The OP's child is just 20 months old. He's still a baby for crying out loud. If it was me and a dog had shown aggression towards my child for any reason without severe provocation (and I do not think patting a dog on the head with adult supervision is severe provocation) the would be gone that night, end of story. I wouldn't want to give a dog the benefit of the doubt if it had bitten my baby son.

Gosh I feel for you, I really do. You seem to have taken alot of stick tonight when you are concerned for your son.
My son was bitten in the face when he was 5. The labrador was unprovoked ( I was standing right by them both) when he jumped up and bit my son on the face. He had 2 and a half hours of surgery sewing his severed tear ducked back together, his lip back on and several holes in the side of his face. It was horrific and I have never trusted a dog again. We have a labrador at home now and so I am not dog-phobic. You must get the dog re-homed as you have no idea if it will bite again. Yes you could get it checked at the vet, yes you could make sure your ds stops patting it on the head but can you be really sure this will never happen again?
My thoughts are with you because I know what it is like to love a dog.

Vallhala can I just say that a lot of recuse places won't accept a dog if they feel it's aggressive?

The rspca didn't neither did blue cross -who actually said the my dog was far too agressive when he growled at the lady who came into the room who came staight over and tried to stroke him. They said they would have put him down if he had come in as a stray.

My dog hadn't bitten, just was showing increasing aggression to my 2 year old but I felt I had to be honest with them. I used a Jack Russell rehoming site and he is now with his new owners and very happy.

"Once again the children are being blamed for not knowing that patting a dog on the head is an aggressive gesture."
I know that's pages back, but I need to respond to it. What a daft comment. Of course the children aren't being blamed, we're talking about a 20 month old little boy!
I'm not blaming anyone, including the dog. I think that if you have pets you need to be aware of how they need to be treated and cared for, and as a parent you are responsible for teaching your child to treat the animal kindly.
I allow children to visit my ponies. I'm not going to let them do something that makes the ponies uncomfortable, because they might end up getting hurt. I don't let children pat them on the head incidentally, I can't understand why even adults do this, but I always make them stop. If anyone can't understand why, just try patting yourself on the head 10 or 20 times.

fluffyone, I tried doing just that and found it bloody awfull most sensible comment yet me thinks...

I understand your concern, but if your dog has never had an issue with your child before, i think you may have just been startled. the dog could be unwell, or just irritable that day. i know it sounds wierd, and i in no way think dogs are 'human' but my dog has off-days too!

your dog doesnt sound 'aggressive' just pushed to breaking point possibly.
and 'aggressive' dog is one that daily growls and nips people, not one that has been docile up to this point and got pushed too far!

please give your dog a second chance. my old dog nipped my DC's plenty of times, at least twice a year, but thats all it was, a nip! and often enough he was just being a little git, but i would never have called him aggressive! its a nip, he just wants to tell you to piss off, not to injure you!

what would we all feel if it were a toddler who had bitten another toddler? what excuses would we give to the other toddler? would we be so harsh why has this child donethis etc etc. there are a lot on this site who are so down on dogs, why is this?

The bottom line is that you will never trust this dog to be around your children again, so the only thing you can do is to rehome. He sounds like a generally lovely dog who was perhaps having a bad day, but the way you feel about him has changed forever. No-one's fault, just a sad turn of events.