to think that the concept of post natal depression is overused?

[moondog]

HOW COME WOMEN HAVE TO HAVE A LABEL (sorry) for so many things?

PMS
AND
PND
Menopausal
OCD
Passive/Aggressive

It seems that the concept of being low/cross/nasty/bitchy/tired/worn out is positively old fashined.

Oh fuck...sorry.I'm on msn atm...

wrong place..

I haven't looked into diet, claig, though I sometimes take a multivitamin and mineral tablet, to try to support my system. I don't do it all the time, because it comes under the heading of looking after myself, and I struggle to do that.

I have just gone on amazon and bought some self help books though - cognitive behavioural therapy for dummies and the workbook that goes with it.

do you eat eggs, meat, butter, avoid fizzy drinks etc. Diet can help change mood, and give energy
www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/features/how-to-beat-depression-with-the-right- diet-1817675.html

Thankyou for that link, claig - I have had a quick look and will read it properly later. I do try to eat reasonably well, but am aware that I don't do that good a job (hence the multivitamins etc).

Now I need to go and make myself some lunch - having missed breakfast altogether.

enjoy your lunch

having a lable can as i said be positive, and enable you to feel that you are not alone and that other people feel the same way, like your not the only one, going mad and dont deserve kids because you feel like a crap mum

It was very bad when dd had colic, would cry from 9-9pm, inconsolable nothing we did worked, my dh coped with it much better, he is a more positive person and also he works so he was out of that situation for about 8-9 hours a day. There were times when i felt and nearly did harm dd, when that happened i had to go to the Dr, I could not hide it any longer. I felt so bad, crap, i was worried in case dd might be taken away from me, that is why i did not go to the Dr sooner. He was so lovely, there was no need to worry, he prescribed some anti depressants which seemed to work as my mood changed so mucn, it was easier to cope. I still have bad days when dd now nearly 3 presses the wrong buttons but it is so much easier to cope now.

DP honestly does it make sense?

Nope because MN is just a few people

most people with depression can't stop coming on here becuase they never were in the first place

Years ago I did 18 months trianing in one of the old style mental hospitals (now of course a housing estate) and some CPN work etc and really, depression can hit anyone

Getting out more is all very well- except that depression commonly affects those who can't for whatever reason, or takes away the mechanisms that allowed that in the first place. Getting out takes confidence, dynamism, the ability to engage with relaity, quite often money (depression doesn't stop you having money or only affect the poor but severe depression is more liekly to help you become poor IYKWIM, or be a reaction to the kind of events that can be linked to being poor).

People with depression do benefit from peer support, exercise etc- but once at a clinical level this usually needs to be enabled for them in the first place.

And from a personal perpsective

It wopuldn't matter how many times that soemone told me to get out more, I can't get out alone during holidays and when all the boys are about and absolutely that is when I am at my most vulnerable to being low.

But someone telling me to get out mroe won't help, all that would help is the sudden emergence of a holiday respite scheme that could take ds3 and leave me only one spectrum child + toddler inbuggy + clumsy (mild dyspraxic) child to handle at a time- the bolting more severe child needs a dedicated adult.

For me misolation + a lack of real routine does indeed exaccerbate any underlying feelings I have about my situation, but people telling me to get out certainly makes it worse as it rubs in the fact I can't always.

As it happens DH has been given a bursary for hard work and excellent grades and is buying me membership of a gym on a 50/50 basis as a gift and to help me make some friends and do something not centred on ASD (being that the MA term ends next month and that is all ASD focused anyway), but without that surprise bursary we couldn't possibly even think about it.

Hmmm...

Peachy I'm not convinced. I think spending too much time on MN (or any other chat site) can make depression worse, and can possibly have a negative effect on people without depression. It's all very cold and clinical isn't it ...(which works for me most of the time)....but when I want to loosen up a bit and be myself, (only so much you can say on here isn't there) I talk on MSN to M'netters I have built up close friendships with.

daftpunk - I recently read something about internet using making depression worse. I don't think sitting at the computer is a perfectly healthy activity, I know this myself!

It isn't healthy belgo...I have heard too much about interner use and depression...

I know i've been on here for the last 4 days...but I'll disappear tonight and wont be back for days.....I use MN when it suits me...

See Dp i thibnk you're right about some people.... and my own experience tells me that when you're low somewhere like MN is a good place to seek out people who will call you names and pick at your scabs, absolutely.

But that is some people. I am certain MN prevented depression when I was massively at risk during the dx's, and I do beleive that internet chat has a tendency to draw depressed people in rather than cause it as well.

If you go on some SiMS type sites (apparently never visited myself) there's a lot of people with AS.... the sims site didn't cause it but it is an environment that suits how those people function, so attracts a disproprotionate amount of members ffrom that community. Same thing at play here.

I'm very low ATM, but usually am not and have been here for 9+ years. That would suggest to me it isn't causal at all, although it is possible to use it in a way that can make it worse which is why my visible threads are so very minimal in number now- heck I know people depsie me for claiming benefits, why do I need to rub that in etc etc etc.

But when I was really low recently I went on those a lot as it reinforced the negative view I had of myself. And now I am heading back up again I can see what I was doing.

That's the thing isn't it peachy....coming onto sites like this if your vulnerable is leaving yourself wide open for more pain...depending on what threads you go on of course...

I wont pretend I haven't upset people on here because I have, but it's never intentional. I can't possible know the midical history and social background of every person I talk to and whether they'll be able to take what I say to them...that's unfair on me.

I certainly don't contest the existence of those conditions. That said, I think someone in an earlier post mentioned the possibility of them being used by other people to dismiss an individual woman's problems.

Which I think certainly occurs with PMS. Some women have PMS, yes. How many, I don't know, but it's a bit much to dismiss a woman as "just having PMT" when she tries to raise an issue. Despite my aforesaid opinion on the matter, though, men and women continue to do so...

Daftpunk - I've told you why mumsnet helps me, but you seem to have dismissed my views as irrelevant - despite the fact that I have depression.

I wouldn't be going out more if I weren't on mumsnet. But I would be feeling more isolated and alone - I fail to see how that's supposed to make me feel less depressed!

Bollox Dp yopu know you post contentious issues. You may not wish to upset but you know there is a risk of it.

People are free to go where they choose, and whilst we have to take responsibility for own own mental health it is clear that you ahve to experience the harmful threads to be able to identify thwem: hide threads can then deal with that effectively. I ahven't a clue for example if any anti SN threads have started recently as AIBU and similar are alrgely hidden for me now.

Whilst SN is a wonderful lifesaver at times. And is just as much a spart of MN as any otehr section. More so if you look at longevity and the relative newbiness of palces such as AIBU.

i think its very hard to understand depression unless you actually suffer from it. without mn I probably would have felt so isolated and alone that i would have ended my own life. am not exagerating.

i refused to see my oldest friends because i despised myself for being so weak. people who knew me didnt understand why i was so low, after all i'd been desperate for a baby, i had one. what more did i want. noone understood why least of all me. i didnt want people to see me as i was, i thought that if i died id want people to remember the bright, bubbly, loud woman that i once was not the shell that was left behind in the labour ward.

i have been on mn for 4y now and am thankful for it. i still take ADs from time to time when things become too much, but mainly for my ED, mood drops/weight drops etc, but trhere is life beyond PND, just doesnt feel like it at the time.

i remember saying to my EDT that when things are grey i dont remember what technicolour looks like and vice versa.

Have I got the wrong end of the stick here?

Is one poster telling another poster not to use MN via the medium of... err...MN?

That can't be right.

Can it?

From what i can gather you should cut down on your mn use, especially if you suffer with depression and switch to msn, which is known in the trade as talking bollox i think.

"Is one poster telling another poster not to use MN via the medium of... err...MN?"

err yes.

But should everyone who suffers from PND have to suffer to the same extent or to an extreme extent in order for it to be "real" PND then? So if you cry every day for months, constantly feel life is not worth living and consider slitting your wrists on only one occasion, it's not "real", you're just "a bit low", because you don't wish your dc hadn't been born and do manage to function on a practical day-to-day level?

Surely there's a wide range of severity of PND felt by women?

And if your PND has been brought on not only by hormones, but also by lack of support, loneliness, exhaustion, etc, it's not "real" PND then?? Or because you'd be better served by decent counselling/human support than by anti-depressants, then you don't have "real" PND?? I don't agree at all!

And I agree with Cory and all those who have enquired where are all these moaning minnies who are pretending to have PND? Only in the Daily Mail, folks.

I think there are many more women who suffer from PND than who let on, and that's it's great we have identified it, are trying to understand it and deal with it better. Agreed throwing pills at everyone is by no means the answer, but I would hate to go back to dismissing a real and horrible female experience as being "a bit down, and hormonal, you silly thing, so toddle off now there's a dear..."

Should I be using MN?

Should you, Pag?

If only there was someone (on MN) to tell me!!!

Surely one poster telling another poster not to use MN via MN, has to be better than a poster not using MN but switching to MSN to talk to M'netters?

My head hurts.

Doesn't that make them MSNetters?

Mine too.

In fact I must be one of these whiners that moondog is referring to, as I only had mild PND, decided not to take anti-depressants and took other steps to bring myself out of it, with the help of my dp, family and friends. Actually I started to improve vastly as soon as I admitted it to myself (after doing the Edinburgh test - hadn't heard of it, thanks MN! - and seeing my GP) So the "label" helped me climb out of the emotional pit I was in...but according to some here I am a whiner who didn't have real PND, fancies using a label, was just a bit down and should just be old-fashioned and use my stiff upper lip! Well, cheers for that! What female solidarity and compassion there is there!