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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To expect maternity ward to respect my wishes?

120 replies

victoriascrumptious · 14/02/2010 13:08

I'm a bit fucked off at the moment. I was admitted into the antinatal ward the other day for some checks. I brought my handheld notes with me (as you do).
Basically the notes contain a birthplan template which you are supposed to fill in. Mine contains basic instructions for yes I want to b/f, yes I want vitamin K, yes I am open minded about drugs-would like to see how it goes. Nothing unsual about that

The one point of contention is that there is a question as to whether you want student midwives in the room-so I said yes but only if they are female. I don't want a male midwife present at the birth, I don't want a male midwife or consultant doing internal checks.

It would appear that there is a male midwife on the ward who I am sure does an excellent job. However it seems some of the female midwifes were grousing about what I had written as I heard them bitching as I walked past.

I don't really give a fuck if men want to be midwives however out of personal choice I don't want one present at my childs birth. Men stress me out on a very primal level for reasons I wont bore you with. If I was to have a cx they can invite the whole of the local rugby team into my room if they wish-but I dont want a man there when I am trying to dilate FFS!

When I was on the ward they made a pmy blood pressure/chat to me etc(this was after I had heard them bitching)so they are clearly trying to make some sort of political point as there were about 4 other female mw's in the staff room drinking tea. I didnt care about being seen by him then as I wasnt in active labout but I am really really annoyed that if this has happened once they are going to ignore my requests when I am actually in labour.

This has upset me so much I am now thinking of VBACing at home as I really dont want a fight on my hands/bad feeling in the room when I am trying to give birth.

AIBN? Am I being nuts?

OP posts:

bellissima · 14/02/2010 14:26

Isn't it the case that, say if a male doc examines you ie a gyanae exam, you are allowed to request that a female be present? If so, could you not stipulate that if any male examines you (which a MW is bound to do) then another female should be present.

Staff shortages alone should then mean that they won't allocate you the male MW. Not sure what I think about this - does seem a bit sexist but if it's the way you feel then it's the way you feel.

troublewithtalk · 14/02/2010 22:12

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

DuelingFanjo · 14/02/2010 22:16

"There are reasons in my past why I would react like this." then YANBU and nor are you being Sexist.

WidowWadman · 14/02/2010 22:27

I don't see how a "no male staff" preference should be any more acceptable than a "no black staff" preference.

DuelingFanjo · 14/02/2010 22:36

purlease!

troublewithtalk · 14/02/2010 22:53

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

pinksancerre · 14/02/2010 22:59

I can understand your wishes but as I recently found out at my NHS equality training the NHS stance will be YABU. You can only request female staff for intimate procedure and BP does not cover that. Widow is right... the NHS stance will be that

MadameDefarge · 14/02/2010 23:12

Oh FGS!

You weren't in labour. He was on the ward. Get over it. Your birth plan refers to when you are in labour, nothing else.

Stop being such a princess. Unless he was staring up your fanjo what's the big deal?

YABU.

DuelingFanjo · 14/02/2010 23:13

So - why do they even bother asking the question on the forms they gave the OP if the NHS stance is that it's an unreasonable request?

chegirlshadabloodynuff · 14/02/2010 23:13

I doubt any NHS trust would force a woman to have a male nurse, dr or midwife.

It is not sexist to not want a male midwife unless you dont want one because you think they would be rubbish due to being a male.

The only reason you wouldnt want a black member of staff is because you think black people are bad, dangerous, dirty, stupid etc. So that is different.

Not every woman, however liberated, educated, open minded etc is happy being examined or even touched by a man she does not have a intimate relationship with.

Because i would not want a male medic doing intimate examinations does not mean I think they are having sexual thoughts about me or anything like.

I am a very private person and would feel very stressed by it.

I dont strictly agree with the idea that once you are in full blown labour you dont care what is going on or who is there.

I do. I have become very upset when random people enter the room. Its not always that women dont care, they are usally powerless to do or say anything about it.

If your elderly dad objected to a young female nurse treating him because it made him feel embarrassed/uncomfortable would you call it sexist? (unless it was because he thought woman were incapable of giving him quality care)

MaisietheMorningsideCat · 14/02/2010 23:16

Isn't is a shame that male midwives still have this barrier to overcome from women.

As MadameDF said, you weren't in labour - he came in and checked your blood pressure. What on earth will you do if you need medical intervention and the only doctor present is male?

pandora69 · 14/02/2010 23:25

I can see both sides of the argument here. I am a woman working in what is considered to be a man's job. Only 2% of my profession are women. Yet I am treated as a capable professional by my colleagues and the only cases of sexism in 12 years have been from the public, ie the people I am there to serve. It isn't a nice feeling to have a customer say they would like someone different to do the job because they feel unsafe in the hands of a woman, but would be more than happy if a man were to replace me.

BUT. On a much more personal level I can see why the OP may not want a man present during, whether he is capable and professional or not. While giving birth it is important to feel secure, and even if it is an irrational fear, it is a fear nonetheless, and could lead directly to a longer labour. It is a difficult one to deal with though, as although there is only the one male midwife you may come across, there is a greater percentage of male doctors. I would ask to speak with the male midwife personally, if you have met him and he is a nice person. He ought to be understanding. But I think you may be limiting yourself if you state 'no men' on your birth plan, particularly if a doctor were needed.

IMO though, from what you have said, the male midwife sounds a nicer person than the bitchy female ones! I am registered with the only female doctor in our practise, but would far rather see the male doctors than her, for more or less anything! She is one scary woman.

MadameDefarge · 14/02/2010 23:29

She wasn't giving birth! She was having her BP checked!

When did we all get so demanding?

Get pissy if he waltzes in while you are in labour, otherwise suck it up.

And yes, are you going to send a male doctor away when you need one?

I don't think so. So you are being snotty about their position, rather than their sex.

FWIW, I had a shit birth with ds, and would have loved to have had a decent MW, of either sex.

chegirlshadabloodynuff · 14/02/2010 23:29

You cannot force people to feel ok with medics of the opposite sex performing intimate examinations on them.

Its not an unnatural barrier. Its the way we are.

Emergency situations are a different thing. Giving birth is not an emergency situation in the majority of cases.

People are able to choose if they want to see a male or female counsellor if they are having therapy for abuse or sexual issues.

Why on earth should it be different in the case of a woman giving birth or a man having a catheter?

Surely a male entering midwifery would be well aware that there will always be women who will not want his services? As a man who wishes to enter a profession dedicated to the service of women not want to make sure he gave the best possible care to each individual?

In my work, my experience of loosing a child is something that some parents would feel very uncomfortable with. Its too close to home for them. I am good at my job and would be able to help them but why would I insist on it if I knew it would make their situation more difficult?

MadameDefarge · 14/02/2010 23:30

One last time. She wasn't giving birth.

Is this so hard to understand? This is not an OP complaining about having a male MW forced on her during labour, simply a male MW taking her BP.

Ugh. A bit of rigour. please.

DuelingFanjo · 14/02/2010 23:33

the OP says

"I didnt care about being seen by him then as I wasnt in active labout but I am really really annoyed that if this has happened once they are going to ignore my requests when I am actually in labour"

her issue is not that he came to check her blood pressure, she was fine with that. It has just made her worry about them not sticking to her request on the BP, partly because she feels that the female midwives think her response to the question asked by the hospital about having a male midwife is a negative one.

Has anyone really read the following posts by the OP which clearly say that she has issues in her past which have effected her response to the question about make midwives?

chegirlshadabloodynuff · 14/02/2010 23:35

But the OP is not complaining about having a male mw present on the ward.

She is upset because her birth plan stated she doesnt want male staff present at her birth and the mws were being unpleasant about her choices.

She hasnt complained about a male mw taking her BP, she is annoyed because she feels the other mws were making some sort of point and she is now stressed that this will happen whilst she is in labour.

At least thats how I have understood it.

DuelingFanjo · 14/02/2010 23:38

that's exactly how I see it too chegirl.

I think some people haven't read the OP properly.

bundle · 15/02/2010 00:02

yabu

these people are medical professionals

would you check the gender/politics/eye colour of an A&E doctor or nurse?

and midwives are allowed to have a teabreak, last time i looked

MillyR · 15/02/2010 00:14

It is clearly not the same as objecting to a black midwife. It is different in exactly the same way that we have separate male and female changing rooms but we do not have separate black and white people changing rooms.

I remember watching a TV programme about male midwives about 10 years ago, and they were saying it was a woman's choice if she wanted a male midwife. I thought at the time, that will change, there will be staff shortages and accusations of sexism and some poor woman will end up giving birth in a room with only men in it, and it will not be her choice.

mumof2children · 15/02/2010 00:14

if your baby was in danger, and needed to be delivered quick and only a male was avalible to get the baby out quick...would you still stick to your plan of only females in the birthing room.
also what if you need a c-section for what ever reason...would it still be only females.

MillyR · 15/02/2010 00:20

How is that relevant? I would let a student midwife or even the postman deliver my baby in an emergency.

Mumcentreplus · 15/02/2010 00:24

I dont think the fact she prefers a female over a male is any big deal..and in an emergency I'm sure a woman would have a friggin 'taxi driver' more less a male nurse deliver her baby if required!...thats not the point!...to request a female is not a sexist thing..and to try to force women to accept something they are not comfortable with is damaging.

KnackeredOldHag · 15/02/2010 00:35

OK, I'm going to get into trouble for his, but, I don't see what the problem is with a male midwife. Presumably he's seen it a few times before and if he's to succeed in his profession will see it all a few times again.

If this is about sexualiy, would you object to a lesbian midwife? Would you even know in that case?

Someone working in that profession that can not discriminate seeing someone's privates for the purposes of having sex, with seeing them for the purposes of giving birth shouldn't be in the profession.

I do kind of understand why it would make you uncomfortable, but OTOH, I think that they are training to be medical professionals and if you think a man will be less professional than a woman in that role, then that is something you need to consider.

MillyR · 15/02/2010 00:42

Again, we have separate changing rooms based on biological sex and gender, not sexuality. If giving birth is not about someone's biological sex, that what on earth is?

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