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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think he should not be on incapacity benefit

134 replies

doodles31 · 08/02/2010 14:26

My ex has been off work for about 8 months now with depression and anxiety. I am dubious to the severity of his problem as he seems capable to do most things. If someone were severely depressed then would they be capable of going to Florida for 2 weeks (paid for by his parents) or aibu to even question it? To me, incapacitated means just that, how can you be capable of leaving your home/routine, getting on a plane, walking round disneyland going on rides for 2 weeks but not of working. I believe that he has given up on the idea of work because he knows that it wouldnt be worth it. If he worked he would have to pay csa money for his 4 children, quite frankly, I think hes trying to get away with not paying it, or have i entirely got the wrong idea of incapacity benefit and who/what its for?

OP posts:
Coldhands · 08/02/2010 18:44

YABU to assume that people on In Cap are totally incapacitated. I am on it for a long term illness that I am likely to have forever but as long as I manage it well I can go out for a couple of hours most days etc. If people see me coming and going, they wouldn't know anything was wrong as it isn't an illness that is visable. I can't work though so I have to have the benefit.

Not sure about your ex. Depression can be tricky for people who don't have it. My friend has it but seems ok on the outside. If people didn't know she had it, you probably wouldn't guess. Your ex could be coming through the other side of the depression. When I had PND, I was on the anti depressants for about 8 months before being weaned off them.

Kaloki · 08/02/2010 18:48

expat Too true, which makes it harder for those who need it to get help.

Right now for me it really upsets me to hear depression (and bad backs) get attributed to skivers, as I struggle with both.

doodles If he is forever getting out of payments then I would be very cynical too.

wannaBe · 08/02/2010 18:52

I am going to get flamed for this, but IMO benefits make it a lot easier for some disabled people not to work, and as a result many don't work purely because they don't have to.

And no I'm not talking about depression - I'm talking about disability in general.. where people who could work don't because it's just as easy not to and to be supported by the state.

I grew up in South Africa where there is no benefits system at all. And all the friends I went to school with, without exception, have jobs. They are all visually impaired.

In this country 90% of the visually impaired are unemployed. And I know enough of them to know that many don't have jobs purely because they can afford not to. Because the benefits they receive (mid-rate dla, in some cases incapasity benefit (or whatever it's called) plus the usual income support/housing benefit) means they actually gain a fairly decent income from the state and can afford not to work for a living.

Of course some people with disabilities (be those physical disabilities, or cronic illnesses or mental illnesses) are incapable of working. But people are naive if they think that it is just a tiny minority who take the piss. The reality is that many don't actually deliberately take the piss and that it's not actually fraud. But that it's so easy to claim you're incapable of work if you have a disability because of society's view of disability as a whole, that it's easier not to work than to get off your arse and get a job.

harimosmummy · 08/02/2010 18:54

Sorry, but am I the only one who is a bit at the number of people who have 'depression' and cannot cope with work but their 'depression' doesn't extend to holiday and the nice things in life.

Kaloki · 08/02/2010 18:56

wannabe The other thing to take into account is how many jobs refuse to take on people with disabilities. When I was still working (only depression to contend with back then) I had a boss tell me that he wouldn't have hired me if he'd known about my depression, despite it not affecting my work.

harimosmummy · 08/02/2010 18:56

Surely benefits are for those who truly need them.

Not for those 'tricky situations' where people can't work but really like the nice things in life and would very much like someone else to pay for it.

Kaloki · 08/02/2010 18:57

So if you are depressed you shouldn't be allowed nice things? You must be more miserable?

harimosmummy · 08/02/2010 18:58

No, if you aren't able to function enough to get yourself to work on a regular basis, you should expect people to be a bit surprised that you can get yourself on a plane and enjoy a holiday.

Simple.

harimosmummy · 08/02/2010 18:59

And,you shouldn't be surprised that others are too chuffed to be paying for the kids you have managed to father / mother.

Kaloki · 08/02/2010 19:03

Bearing in mind I'm speaking as someone who, apart from a short break, has always worked through my depression. (For good or bad)

Going somewhere regularly is usually more of a problem for depression, as usually you can't drag yourself out of bed, or into a shower, if I brushed my teeth it was considered a good day! During the really awful period of depression I was a state, during the holiday it was a chance for me to do nothing but relax in a country where where was lots of daylight (good for depression) and be away from my bedroom (which I associated with self harm and suicide), and also made sure I was interacting with people. So it was beneficial for me. And improved the depression.

Whereas if I hadn't of gone who knows.. work definitely hadn't been helping. I couldn't concentrate and would have been fired if I hadn't left.

GypsyMoth · 08/02/2010 19:04

As far as 'depression' goes, I agree with harimosmummy.

How many prople with depression actually get diagnosed properly??? And that's not by a gp

when I was in a hostel the workers told me to go and get antidepressents from the gp to give me more housing points.......and I did, and it was so easy to get those anti d's. Which I didn't take cos I didn't have depression!!! Too bloody easy to pull the wool over their eyes

Original poster
doodles31 · 08/02/2010 19:06

thats very interesting wannaBe, a true comparison. I wonder if there were depressed cavemen and what happened to them... [ducks for cover]

OP posts:
Kaloki · 08/02/2010 19:07

Whatever it was, I hope it beat the asylum's once we became "civilised". It's not a new problem.

fairycake123 · 08/02/2010 19:08

ILT, why do you say that GPs can't diagnose depression?

Original poster
doodles31 · 08/02/2010 19:09

Hopefully the holiday will help him kaloki, he is moving when he gets back so hopefully that will take away those feelings of association.

OP posts:
Original poster
doodles31 · 08/02/2010 19:10

But do you think they still went out and hunted for food or lay in their cave doing nothing.

OP posts:
lou031205 · 08/02/2010 19:10

"No, if you aren't able to function enough to get yourself to work on a regular basis, you should expect people to be a bit surprised that you can get yourself on a plane and enjoy a holiday."

But there is a world of difference between a holiday and a job. A job is a committment to be at a particular place, at a particular time, to do a particular thing to a particular standard, and meet a particular target.

A holiday is is being able to be the same person with the same difficulties in a different location.

My Mum & Dad wouldn't organise a holiday for themselves, they have neither the motivation, the money, or the concentration right now. But I would hope that if I organised one for them, they would have the good grace to come, regardless of how they feel, and I would accept that they might not feel like the life and soul of the party despite being on holiday.

GypsyMoth · 08/02/2010 19:35

fairycake....how do gp's have the time in an appointment to do the proper assesment. they dont. when my ex went to a psychiatrist for a proper diagnosis he was hours and hours. and it was then that his depression was ruled out....after years of hell...

the psychiatrist says this is very,very common...gp's cant do the job of the psychiatrist. he said that himself

expatinscotland · 08/02/2010 19:42

Again, I have to really be honest here. I've lived in 12 different countries now, and only the British see the holiday as a right and not a privilege.

expatinscotland · 08/02/2010 19:43

You have a valid point, iLove.

I see a consultant now myself.

Kaloki · 08/02/2010 19:48

expat Never understood that myself. I can count my holidays on one hand! Whereas some people feel hard done by when they can only have one a year

Sorry OTT

That is true ILove but on the other hand it can be really difficult to get referred. There's not enough support for mental illness, too much reliance on pills.

harimosmummy · 08/02/2010 19:52

well said, expat

Trickle · 08/02/2010 19:56

holiday a right? I've never been on holiday working or not (not since I left home at 17) Where did that come from?

expatinscotland · 08/02/2010 20:00

It's a cultural trend some of us including me have noticed.

I guess I'm coming at it from the same angle as wannabe, again I'm prepared to be flamed as well.

ESA is hard to get, hopefully things will moderate in a while.

But it's equally wrong to say that everyone who was claiming IB for depression was genuinely too ill to work at all.

Trickle · 08/02/2010 20:01

Oh and if a holiday means another country - I really never have ever been on 'holiday'. I keep hearing this term 'staycation' like it's something different from a holiday

  • well that's all I've ever been on and I thought they were fab.