To belive that my children are having a great childhood in London?

[mrsruffallo]

Annoying woman at parent and toddler grouip today.
She was noisily proclaiming her intention to leave London before her child turned 5 as it's an awful place to grow up!
I said if not here, where?
There is so much to do, lovely green spaces, much better than being stuck in the middle of nowhere
Turned into quite a lively discussion

must go to bed have failed to do research so will be up at 6am to actually do it.

but strangely aroused by 'soft sly' cockernee men [groin]

Threads you are 21C Lawrentian.

Well Onebat, I have to admit I am the Lincolnshire fens so know little of the 'other side' of which you speak. Possibly because monsters patrol the borders at night wearing red cloaks with boar-like heads (have you seen the film The Village?)

But in all seriousness I think that is an area of beauty and I would seriously consider it. I am jaded.

Cambridge is a very lovely city obviously. I am sure that it is very different from where I live.

How very funny though the description could be narrowed down to The Fens, am off to bed smirking now!

I had a long long conversation with a brick layer in a sauna the other day, about terms and conditions in relation to enforced snow-days away from work.

That is completely true, and def preferable to a soft sly cockernee fantasy.[groin]

lol. nighto

Hey, must live in the best place EVER... (most expensive place on the coast... well... right next dr to it (mumbles something about celebs pushing up house prices in the WHOLE area because they are escaping London). Not that I have seen any celebs, must be an urban myth...

I live in a town, more towny than where I grew up (it is close enough to London for people to commute there, tho the 4hrs a day travelling must be a nightmare), and it is rich and diverse, well moderately so... I mean, true to say, most of the kids are white, but other nationalities ARE represented (unlike my high school of erm, 1500 students, mostly white...). Our area is specifically quieter, but 6miles away it is far more diverse.
I don't like London all that much because I hate the busyness of it all. I hate to be pushed and shoved etc, and every time I have been, this has been my experience. So Not for me.

That said, I will take the kids in when older (to museums/shows etc). Right now I live in a non-boring place (well we do have a youth problem, but I know that kids can be bored when they have LOTS to do). I can walk everywhere if I choose (apart from church cos I choose to go to one I need to drive to), or take the bus if I don't think smallest DC can walk that far.

I don't see how I am missing ANYTHNG apart from the aforementioned free museums and amazing theatre.

this thread has turned quite entertaining...and I definitely agree that the londoners are taking the prize for the greatest number of ill-informed, judgmental comments. with not a hint of irony.

someone said there's only so many times you can skip through the fields. well the kids, dh and I have never skipped though the fields but here's the kind of stuff we do get up to and some other plus points (from s.one who lived in london til a year ago). some of it, certain londoners will be suprised to know, is just like stuff you do down there too but some of it you just can't do. so ner. :

• go mountain biking
• go climbing
• go bouldering
• go bouldering indoors
• go horse-riding (at a fraction of what we used to pay in Richmond Pk)
• walk across the field to see friends' horses, sometimes help feed them, and ride them for nothing
• visit friends for dinner and parties who are walking distance (I haven't had such a big network of walking distance adult friends since university)
• allow dds to walk to friends' houses
• have access to a pool of teenage baby-sitters (children of above adult friends)
• go to the pub
• have lunch in a cafe
• go to Brownies (dds)
• help at Brownies (me)
• drama, dancing and singing (dd2, not my thing )
• gymnastics at a good quality fully equiped gym (in nearby city, 25 mins drive)
• fell running in breath taking countryside
• see wild deer
• live somewhere that can cope with snow - school closed one day this year and not at all last year
• borrow random things from neighbours when I run out
• get fresh eggs from friends' chickens
• go to the kids village film club - monthly screenings where the kids sit at the front sharing their sweets and the adults get tea and cakes
• and if I wanted to I could visit museums in a range of big cities and go to the theatre and even spend the day at Meadow Hell Hall
• have a genuine choice of good, undersubscribed schools, dd is in a class of 13.

think i'd better stop

at length

Where do you live? Or just name nearest town if that outs you. I want to live there right now ......

i forgot...there's a michelin starred restaurant 2 miles away and a spin off foodie pub with pictures on the wall by michael vaughan.

the one thing dh and i can't do (and, I admit it, it's a biggie) is get "proper" jobs in our respective lines of work - both of which are - in the uk - london-centric. moving has only been possible because we're middle-aged mid-career and got the contacts to go freelance. dh is in london 1-2 days a week. i tend to get away with once a month.

and we can't get a decent capuccino en route to work (en route to wrk = quick walk across the field from school to home with the dog). i'm getting the hang of my capuccino machine though...

if we were of a mobile profession - teaching, law, medecine, it, marketing, skilled trade, craft etc.we'd be fine though.

Hatwoman,

We do all the following and much, much more IN LONDON

" - go horse-riding (at a fraction of what we used to pay in Richmond Pk)

• walk across the field to see friends' horses, sometimes help feed them, and ride them for nothing
• visit friends for dinner and parties who are walking distance (I haven't had such a big network of walking distance adult friends since university)
• allow dds to walk to friends' houses
• have access to a pool of teenage baby-sitters (children of above adult friends)
• go to the pub
• have lunch in a cafe
• go to Brownies (dds)
• help at Brownies (me)
• drama, dancing and singing (dd2, not my thing )
• gymnastics at a good quality fully equiped gym (in nearby city, 5 mins drive)

I love the defensive way the country lot rush to put down the Londoners
Don't hate us because we're beautiful

oh, heck - stay or go, it's their call
These decisions are reversible anyway. if a lot of these families stayed for better or for worse, it would put EVEN MORE pressure on school places and other child-related resources in London so i don't mind that much even though i miss some of our friends!

MrsR - once and for all - IT'S NOT ALL FIELDS OUT THERE. Really. And it's great to be happy where you live - but that doesn't make London any more the be-all and end-all for everyone else. Everywhere has upsides and downsides, and although I think your toddler woman was pretty rude in implicitly criticising people who choose to bring their children up in London, there has been a hell of a lot of weird ideas on this thread about what's beyond the M25. And that's almost as galling.

have been. Gah.

BTM I'm sure you do. as i said many of the difference aren't that great. but you don't mention what for me are the top activities - climbing, bouldering, mountain-biking, fell running. and looking at this from my back door. not everyone's cup of tea, i know. but it is mine.

MrsR people get defensive when they are attacked.I don't think anyone's expressed hatred for londoners. just annoyance at ignorant comments, which they have tried to disabuse. perhaps thats's defensive. and I do think, on balance, there's been more ignorance from londonders. mainly i think because a lot of the more rural/non-london inclined among us have actually done stints of both (like me). whereas a lot of the londoners only seem to have done london.

btw - where is your corner, if you don't mind me asking. it does sound nice.

what's bouldering, hat?

"I love the defensive way the country lot rush to put down the Londoners."

Hmmm it works both ways.

Don't live in London now but think it's brilliant! Grew up for first 8 years of my life in or near London-fabulous.

Then moved to rural back of beyond dullsville in Cheshire. Beautiful countryside, lovely wide open green spaces, bigoted small minded people, dull as s**te. Didn't help that the nearest town was Stoke.

Now live in Manchester after escaping here to University 15 years ago. If Londoners think people are down on them they should try peoples opinions of manchester! Yes it IS deprived it doea have a gang problem, there are social factors here that can't beignored. We are fortunate enough to live in a lovely suburb that is absolutely brilliant, shops, bars, cafes, restaurants, arts festivals, beautiful parkland, the mersey valley right on our doorstep, literary events and a fantastic selection of theatres, art galleries, museums and loads for children to do less than 20 mins drive/bus away.

My parents still live in a hamlet in the back of beyond near nantwich, very scenic but mind numbingly quiet and dull imo. After 1 day there I'm itching to go somewhere/do something. Also hate the fact you have to get in the car all the time to do any activity save going for (another) walk.

Definitely going to stick to a city upbringing for my dcs.

climbing without ropes (so maybe note quite a separate activity). you don't go as high and it's a lot quicker because you don't need to tie yourself up and belay people (ie stand at the bottom holding your partner's rope while they climb). it's as technically challenging though. bouldering

where we live is international reknowned for climbing and bouldering. people come from all over the world - some of what this japanese kid did video here might be called bouldering. some of it might be called lunacy

there's been a hell = singular Habbs - you were fine

I think everyone's gaff sounds nicer than mine, whether rural idyll or rus in urbe or actual proper urban.

You're only really and truly qualified to comment if you've done both, I reckon.

And..I believe there's a lot of attachment to where you were brought up as a child, so if you still live there you don't see beyond that.

I have done both, I live in the sticks now, I've lived and worked in the Big Smoke and lived in the subs. I would chew my right arm off to live in the subs again..chew it off.

I've done both now and I want to go back to London. It's where I grew up and it's where I feel I belong.

missurrey me too! I am out in the arse end of nowhere and would kill to be back in the burbs. Looking at nothing but fields was great for the first few months but three years later I want to jump out of the window.