to phone this boys parents

[biggirlsdontcry]

ds's friend (11yrs) has just called in for ds , he had a pellet gun with him & pointed it at me when i answered the door i warned him not to shoot it as those guns are dangerous , when i turned to call ds the boy shot the gun at my arm , it didn't hurt much but i got annoyed at his cheek & told him " how dare he etc & i would ring his mum , he then pointed it up close into my face , i shut the hall door on him & he hung around outside for a few minutes aiming it at the windows of my house & calling ds names wtf .
should i phone his mum or just let it go .

bosch it looks like a toy gun , bright orange with a clear tube underneath holding the pellets , but they shoot out with hard force iykwim , & i could well imagine they would take an eye out if shot at close range , the boy did not come back to apologise as such , he sent his younger brother in to call for my ds , i saw him hiding under the garden wall & called him , he wouldn't come so i told him then i would have to talk to his mum , then he came over , i then had a long chat to him about how dangerous this toy could be & asked him if i could mind it for him etc , at the end of the chat he then apologised . then pulled out his penknife & stuck it into our tree .

biggirls - sorry, didn't mean to sound like I was belittling your experience. Just that a lot of MNers seemed to be assuming that you were shot at with an air gun.

Must admit that I both a) scare easily and b) don't do confrontation. I certainly wouldn't storm round there tonight in the dark, but I would try to pluck up courage to go round and see his mum tomorrow. If she's happy with the way he plays with air guns and penknifes and you're not, you just have to have the courage of your convictions and say you don't want your ds to play with him anymore. He doesn't sound like a 'bad influence' as such and there was an apology in there, albeit you talked him into it. But if you wouldn't let your ds have a penknife at the same age then maybe it's an issue to hold out over...

Sounds like a BB Gun (I asked my kids, who have seen others use them!). Googling it there seem to be 2 types, a child's version and a more 'adult' type.

It may be of interest for you to see this footage on the effects of one:

news.stv.tv/scotland/tayside/129160-girl-may-lose-sight-after-dundee-bb-gun-attack/

teetheringontheedge you say "Most Irish travelers are trouble. Ask any Irish person. All will have horror stories of how they live totally outside societies rules"

What an unbelievable thing to say. Yes ive encountered people in Ireland who are racist in their attitude towards Irish Travellers but Thank God not every Irish person is.

Racism is a depressing problem that undermines irish society, and any society where its present, as a whole. Your post seems to claim that all Irish people are racist towards travellers and that you think this racism is justified? surely that is not what you mean?

Claudialyman, I'm not saying all Irish people are racist towards Irish Travellers, but that I would imagine they will have all been witness to a much, much higher rate of crime, anti-social behaviour, theft and intimidation compared to the non-traveller community.

off to bed now folks , thanks for all your replies i will post tomorrow& let you all know how i get on with his mum, night x

I just find it incredibly hard to even respond to your post teetering. However, I will say it is ill informed, offensive and typifies why I used the word 'demonised' earlier in this thread.

Enough of the "all." All Irish people have not been witness to a higher rate of crime etc in the Traveller community. All Irish people do not have horror stories about Travellers as you claimed in your earlier post. Irish Travellers have been discriminated against in horrific fashion for generations. It is shameful. Please do not made such extreme generalisations about the level of racism in Ireland-it is bad but not as bad as all Irish people being racist. And more importantly please do not infer that racism towards Irish Travellers is in any way, shape or form justifiable.

post above is to teethering

it's not rocket science is it?
when you say 'all xxx group of people are yyy'
that is prejudice
and when
xxx group are a minority group who are relatively powerless and yyyy is some hateful/negative/hurtful adjective,
that is racism.

By claudialyman

"Enough of the "all." All Irish people have not been witness to a higher rate of crime etc in the Traveller community."

Seriously, ask them, I have no doubt they will agree.

Is it racism if you are also Irish? I'm not sure.

Teethering - Just to let you know, I am Irish and I know far more Traveller families who are really nice people than I do of Travellers who are really badly behaved like you describe. Most of the Traveller parents that I know would be absolutely mortified to find out that their DC had shot someone and they would punish their DC for their bad behaviour.

Just popped back her to see the outcome of OPs encounter with the mother of this boy and I have a few comments to make.

I agree with much of what Teetering, Valhala and Bloodredtulips have said and some of the things you have said teetering are absolutely terrible. In fact bloodred your post on page 3 really says it all ina far more respectful, non insulting and eloquent way than I could ever put it!

People all have thier own experiences and form their opinions from those experiences. You cannot substitute talking about someone who chooses to be a traveller as a lifestyle choice with the word "black". being black or white is not the same. it is not a lifestyle or community choice it is justt he colour of your skin.

Again Op I do think you need to be wary of approaching this lady, even with the best of intentions. It may be viewed as an insult to go round there and say you've confiscated her childs "toy" especially if she had got it for him and was happy for him to play with it. If she is part fo a larger community then you really do not want to get on the wrong side of her as you will "possibly" find yourself in for a whole lot of trouble...!

Hando- a child from a travelling community was murdered a few years ago around here.

The reason- because he was a traveller. He was targeted, chased, bricked and beaten to death for the sole reason of being a traveler.

Most travelers have lived like this for generations, its not so much as a lifestyle choice but a lifestyle that they were born into and the only lifestyle they know.

I dont see how this childs death was any different from that of Anthony Walker who was murdered because he was black.

How can a child born into a travelling community choose that lifestyle. Thats like saying a child born into poverty choose to be poor.

I think i would be asking why a child called for my ds wielding an airgun, then called my ds names, came back later and hid behind a wall whilst his brother called for ds and then had a penknife on him. Maybe i'm overeacting, nothing to do with the child's bacground btw, but i'd be worried that the child had a problem with ds.

I thought a traveler was someone who lived in a caravan to avoid paying taxes etc? the op said that the boys mother lived in a rented house on the next street. So even if the mother has a traveller background she isn't one now... so that is like discriminating against someone because of something they have no control over. which, imo, is wrong.

Korma, Msspentyouth wasn't being rude in her post - can you not see that? Perhaps she has not lived in areas with large groups of travellers and does not understand what the term means?

Don't "FFS" someone when they clearly weren't meaning to annoy you!

Is this wrong? am detecting a bit of sarcasm maybe? I live in an area where we don't get any travelers are all so please excuse me if my thoughts are wrong?

So what actually defines a traveller then? We used to have a family who used to park up near our village with their old style wooden painted caravans and would tie their horses up and down the side of the road. We used to call them travellers... maybe we were wrong..?

As another poster has pointed out, a child was killed NOT because of anything he did as an individual but purely and simply because he was a member of a particular group.

That points to a high level of generalised hatred. And a hatred that crosses the boundaries of the rational and the humane.

Some of the comments on here are just unacceptable, especially given that they take place against that background of generalised hatred.

They are also WAY off topic.

The OP has already said that the mother seems reasonable - so some posters are bringing their own assumptions/prejudices to this.

Like Korma, I'm in two minds about asking for this thread to be removed.

Teethering Irish Travellers are recognised as one of Irelands largest ethnic minorities. They have a seperate ethnic & nomadic identity, and seperate history, traditions and cultural heritage to settled Irish people. Predjudice and discrimination against them from settled/sedentary irish people is racist.

Unfortunately there is an idea that settled irish society and its beliefs are superior to travellers and other ethnic groups. But by no means do all irish people think in this predjucial way.

Its truly terrible that you have had such bad experiences and anyone treated you in this way/ But obviously there is also such behaviour amongst setteled Irish people and indeed settled people in any other country I have lived in. Assault, robbery and child abuse are deplorable and not unique to any ethnic group.

You say you are aware your comments sound "outrageous" But the comment you made in your 23.25 post about children who are members of the travelling community goes far beyond outrageous.