In thinking that the benefit system encourages lone parenthood?

[retiredgoth2]

And no.

I am not starting a fight for its own sake, even though I am aware that one may ensue.

I am a lone parent (of four. Two with SEN)

So is my Special Friend ('SF') She has two children, one with a disability.

We are going to move in together. Neither of our earning capacities will increase. We are both already working as much as is possible. In SF's case, perhaps more than is advisable...

We have done the sums.

Between us we will be (wait for it) 20 k a year worse off.

Yes. I said Twenty Thousand Pounds.

And this does not include the housing benefit SF currently receives.

I will lose all of my widowed parents allowance, and the late Mrs Goth's NHS pension, about 8k. The balance is tax credits, which will reduce to almost zilch.

The only net gain is council tax. Whilst we both lose the 25% reduction, we will only have to pay on one property. This is a gain of about £500.

Now. I don't think I am owed a living. But these sums nearly put us off. There are many others who would be deterred.

I do not know an answer, but feel that this is a flaw in the benefits system, discouraging people from either (a) being honest or (b) living stable lives...

What could be done?

well, that's my point, you DO start at minimum wage, why not? And after work, you go back home and hang out with your mates instead of changing nappies, staying up all night with a screaming baby and have nobody to kick out of bed to take a turn.

You can maybe stay at home and save up until 18, you can take a working holiday (yes, it's possible), you can experience a million things.

Nothing wrong with starting a family, if the aim IS the family (it being a single parent family or a two parent family). But not for the sake of living on benefits, I'm not quite sure they know what they're getting themselves into.

Plus, what do you do when the children grow up and you're not entitled to benefits, pension and have no skills and no work experience? Keep having kids?

As a single mum I was much better off than I am now with a DP. I also lived in a house that was £260 a month more expensive, and I still had more spare money than I do now.

I worked part time when I was single, but was told repeatedly by the job centre/benefits officers that visted to check I was living on my own that I would be better off if I didn't work . But I was living comfortably and it was important to me as I was on my own that I maintained a job. My friend on the other hand had never done a days work in her life, was on her own with a child, had more money than me .

My situation now means that it is not finacially possible for me to go to work.

The benefit system is completly crazy IMO.

mummygirl - My sister got pregnant at 17. She's never had a job. I have no idea when her children go to school what she will do... I doubt she has even thought about it. I doubt she would have made the same choices if she didn't get all the money she has handed to her. I'm not being cruel, that is the truth, and she'd probably say the same. (she is a great mum though BTW)

Someone I know deliberatley had a one night stand to get preganant because the job centre told her to get a job because her DC had started school. She did the same when that one started school too.

Yeah, when I was pg with my first I had gone back to the uk after a long holiday in Asia, and had been in my new job for two weeks only. I was very ill and developed SPD early, wasn't entitled to mat payment and as I was married I couldn't claim anything. DH was working but his income back then was hardly enough for us to cope and my parents had to help us out.

"being married" shouldn't be a one-fits-all testing mean, surely. What about the 7years I had spent paying 26000 a year in taxes? I'm still angry that there wasn't any help out there available for us

IWACAAD, what's this about DC starting school though? Is it a new thing?

MG - If you can't live at home and you start on minimum wage you'd be on the streets pretty damn fast.
There were lads at college with me who lived in bedsits whilst doing their A'levels who were regularly mugged and broken into, a young girl couldn't live like that.
So there needs to be an alternative to getting pregnant and that in my opinion is rent controls like they have in many USA cities which allows a young person to go to work, earn something and still be motivated, not crippled by their rent.
And instead of forcing rents up with housing benefit, force them down.

mummy I get annoyed too

When I was younger I houseshared me my best friend and my dh who was just a friend in those days (seperate rooms)

I lost my job

Went for help paying rent and bills while I looked for a new job and was told because I lived with someone (and they said a man) I wasn't entitled. Well I wasn't getting any of his money so I had to borrow off my parents. I started temping and four years later managed to finish paying off my parents.

Surely benefits are there to help those when they really need it. It seems not

Anyway...
Retiredgoth I'm very happy for you and agree its completely wrong. We worked out that I would be quite a bit better off a month if I chucked dh out. Lucky for him I love him too much

MMM, I agree, I can't get over the fact that getting pg is a way of getting state help. There have to be other helping schemes out there. And if not, there SHOULD be.

I don't hold it against these girls, but against the state/society, schools, parents that have so cruelly underfed their ability to dream and their faith that they can make some dreams come true.

mummygirl - do you mean the girl being told to get a job?

ChickandDuck, what are you refering to?

Thanks to all for your good wishes...

...and I can confirm that there is no way I would part ex 'SF' for some WPA and and an NHS pension...

I suppose I was well aware that any thread on such a topic was likely to digress in the way it has. However I apologise if I have precipitated any upset..

Peachy I take particular note of your points regarding parental care for autistic children being a cheap option for the Powers-That-Be. SF has a profoundly autistic son, who will be living with us (as well as my boy with Aspergers) so we are aware of the difficulties. In fact, SF has an almost identical point of view as you on the matter...

Still, I am aware that I am exchanging a very cosy financial situation (part time work, minimal housing costs, substantial savings) for more work and a large mortgage.

Oh yes. And happiness too.

So it is, in the end, very much worth it.

It just that the social policy doesn't seem to make sense!

I'm confused...

mummygirl you asked about the DC starting school, was it a new thing, and IWACAAD was trying as far as I can see to clarify what you meant.

From next year, (I think) lone parents with children over seven will have to look for work.

That would be work that starts at ten and ends at two in areas where there are no after-school clubs and childminder shortages for people with no family to help. Friends aren't allowed to any more, (are they?)

Quite where all these jobs and childcare places are going to come from I don't know...

Too be fair though, they could do course to make themselves more employable between 10am and 2pm though couldn't they ?
And once they've had a taste of education then might go on to be inspired to further their careers, lots of people have been let down by schools, doesn't mean they aren't capable of achieving a good educatio, a 2nd bite of the cherry if you like, can't hurt.

RG good luck- happiness worth more than disposable income. And remember timetorant for your DP or yourself, all SN carers welcome! (on SN threads).

Milly I'd love a job between 10 and 2, I had childare lined up etc- there aren't any. The few that I have aplied for have been snapped up, but I have never even had an interview- and I am pretty well qualified and skilled too. There are so many people (women esp.) looking for those hours, far more than the jobs available.

AFAIK she was on Income support, which needed to change to Job seekers once DC started school, meaning she had to attend interviews, be activley looking for job. She couldn't even face LOOKING for a job, never mind actually working, so got preg instead.

and just want to say thanks retiredgoth, you reminded me to sort my tax credits out. My Maternity Allowance has stopped, meaning I am no longer employed so I no longer get working tax credits. MEANING I now get £300 less each month (on top of £123 a week less from MA).

Maybe the government does do alot to support working families as well as the un employed

aas from this October the age where lone parents are switched from income support to Job seekers is when their child reaches 10. next Oct it will change to when the child reaches 7 yrs.

I think its a great idea as i do live in an area where there are loads of childminders and after school clubs.

yes they can be expensive but we have to remember that they can claim 80% of their childcare costs back.

But i must say i am amazed at the amount of people i actually know who have told me they will have another baby rather than go back to work

and there are other ways that sneaky mums will avoid the 'getting a job' and one of the main ones is doing voluntary work. My mum is a head teacher of a primary school and was amazed recently at the amount of parents who suddenly enquired as to whether they could come into the school for 2 hours a week and listen to the children reading. Her shock was short lived when tehy all asked her to sign a letter for job seekers stating they did voluntary work at the schools.
2 hours though

Sorry, I've forgotten who mentioned training and education, but I was actually better off financially with my DD aged 3 in a 1-bed council flat on benefits than I was working as a teacher (with six years experience and on the appropriate pay-scale)

It is expensive going to work. A work wardrobe including a coat, lunches away from the meal-plan, regular haircuts, the ENDLESS fecking collections for birthdays, tea money even though you drink water, works nights out which you are summoned to, it all adds up.

When my first DH left and I was on my own with DD aged six months my employers told me that I should, in addition to everything else, do a Saturday morning course from 10-1 at my own expense. And that it was mandatory.

I told them to go fuck themselves sack me if I didn't do it. They didn't but they did "persuade" me to resign a bit later on - very cleverly

trickorninks i qualified as a teacher when my dd was 13 months old. i decided there was no way i could do my nqt year while she was little and would wait until she started her 15hrs free nursery place.

a lovely school i had trained in who knew my situation offered me a part time position as a hlta (they had no teaching places) so ive been there a year and a term now (dd now 2.5) my wage from 16hrs a week + child tax credit, working tax credit & child benefit means i get more than i would as an nqt. (i live with parents so dnt get council tax credit, housing benefit etc)

so... dd starts nursery next sep. do i continue working part time with no after-school planning/ marking/ assessing/baselining/report writing/ etc etc etc, and lots of time with dd OR

do i start my nqt year with 24/7 worries, constantly thinking have i planned and got resources etc etc, no quality time with dd, only to get less money ???

its not a good decision, but the way i feel is that i worked to get my qualification for 4 years... if i dont do my nqt soon, i never will...

im glad i had my dd while i was at university... i dont know how (working) teachers could afford it!

please tell me, are u working now - if you are how do you find it?! scared...

rachy I'm not working as I am lucky enough to be supported by DH. DS is only 2. My job is looking after him atm.

I'd like to re-train as a SALT but it can't happen as the post-grad courses are too far away.

But I would try teaching. Perhaps it has changed since I was doing it. It's hard but there are some days when you can't believe that you are getting paid for having so much fun and that's the truth.

I haven't done it for six years but parts of it were great fun.

rachy have a look on the other boards too, lovely.

I hate to see talent and enthusiasm going to waste