to consider moving to a town (Saffron Walden) so that my DCs can be state educated (good schools)?

[thedolly]

ATM we live in a semi rural area and the DCs are at a Prep School. We are very happy with the school but the money to pay for it will run out eventually and I will end up working to pay for school fees.

Should we just stay put (in our very nice house) and brave the local state schools or move to a place where house prices are very expensive but the schools have a good reputation?

Is it just me, or is the OP becoming more like that posh mum character from the Catherine Tate show every minute?

The one who tells her children not to talk about Iceland because it sells (gasp of horror) 'frozen food'

And when when they took a wrong turn & accidently ended up in 'Totten-Ham' her son says that all the people look funny and she answers 'that's because they're not wearing brogues, dear'

' we do keep ourselves to ourselves a bit.'

I think that this is your big mistake then dolly! Get out and meet people-visit the local school before you have to move. Most people have a story to tell -the doddery old pensioner that you see in the street and have written off as as 'local' may well have travelled the world before settling down. The SAHM that you assume went to a local school and left without many qualifications may well have given up an exciting career in London. The boy from the local farm that you see hanging out with his mates may well be an A* student with an ambition to study medicine. You can't know unless you get to talk to them-and even then not at a first meeting.
Although I think tha ACORN classification is a good laugh it does sort in a very broad sense. I can't see why you want to leave your 02 position village for Saffron Walden which is 7 points lower! They can't all be low aspirational farm labourers where you live!
I remember finding out-on one of these education threads -that only 2.7 of the population are educated privately. This leaves the huge majority using the state system and so many of those will have very high aspirations for their DCs and they are spread over the country. There are probably as many parents with high aspirations in Bolton as in Saffron Walden.

thedolly - I have read this thread now, as well as your other thread which I had already posted on.

I think I understand your position better now: you yourself pulled yourself out of your working class family through (private) schooling and university, and your own aspirations, to join the rural comfortable middle-classes, and you are petrified of your children "falling back" socially and economically.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that fear (and well done you for rising in the world), but paying school fees will not of itself provide any guarantees about your children's aspirations in life. What is really crucial, however, is the message that you send your children about what to aspire to. A lot of parenting is a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Oh dear - discovered that I went down from a Type 1 neighbourhood to Type 10 when we moved to a village near SW. This is because we moved from a wealthy suburb to a village - where, generally there is more of a social mix - yes we have a large area of social housing up the hill - so useful for providing cleaners and workmen!
I think that the OP needs to get out more, to visit all the potential local schools. We've visited many state and independent schools in our search for the right house/right schools for our DCs. At almost every school we visited the Head or Deputy Head spent time with us and took us around the school during a normal school day. From that we could immediately tell those schools we wished to avoid - and they weren't all the schools in "poorer" neighbourhoods, just those with poor leadership.
And tne OP shouldn't presume that state is always worse. We've educated our DCs in both state and independent schools and have always looked for the best school for that child at that stage of education.
Right, off to SW now to do some aspirational shopping in Waitrose.

I suppose I had better get on with scrubbing my step and smoking roll ups

Nosily - you are from NI, the dolly, yes? Do you think you have been caught up in the belief system of the marvellous two tier system? I hated it, the idea of a chosen few and a huge cohort of 11 year old 'failures'. Because I look at my kids, all now older than 11, and all their friends - the truth is that most parents where I live (very socially mixed) want their children to do well and stay in education. Even my dd1's friend who is in charge of clamping in my local supermarket - sadly not Waitrose.

piscesmoon - you are right and I'm getting quite excited now about the people I might meet

BonsoirAnna - the message that we send our children is to aspire to something that will make them happy, be financially rewarding enough so as to give them choices and be 'flexible' enough to allow them a work/life balance that will be right for them at the different stages of their life.(This is the most challenging one for us)

I might add that all this is done in a very 'low key' way (chats in the car etc.)

Within all of that we encourage them to seek out their talents by trying new things and we support and nourish them in their choices.

Stledger - I am torn about the situation in NI. Atm about 40% of pupils are at Grammar School so things are much better than they were. Maybe they could try something radical - it just might work

I think that my DC will be fine wherever they go to school, I just want it to be as enjoyable and smooth a path as possible for them.

I met a woman recently dolly, she looked like a bag lady but when she spoke she was obviously very well educated and had had 3 DSs go through Eton!

I forgot to say-the moral of that was never judge by appearances!

It sounds like you have the perfect set up for your DC piscesmoon - well done you for doing your homework .

Most of the older people we know in the area(outside of school)used the independent sector for their children.

I tend not to judge people, just buildings .

And what sort of buildings do you like for schools, thedolly?

My DD's school is housed in a beautiful 19th century hôtel particulier in the 8th arrondissement, looking right onto the Parc Monceau.

The accommodation as far as education is concerned is literally appalling.

You would hate the building of our local comprehensive-ugly 60's with portacabins! It would be nice to have a fantastic building but it is what happens inside that matters.
I can't believe I am wasting so much time on here. I must give it up completely once term starts! I will finish-the only advice is visit-insist on seeing the Head and make sure it is a normal working day and you see it 'warts and all'.

Dolly, I think they are trying to do something radical in Norn Iron education...it is grammar schools who are resisting.

piscesmoon - thank you for your time and your sound advice

BonsoirAnna - I know that beautiful buidings do not a good school make, it's just that a good school with beautiful buildings and lots of outside space is more inspiring than one without.

that you are appalled by aspects of your DDs school.

stleger - fingers crossed that the powers that be don't screw thing up

It's all relative, though. The state schools in central Paris look more like prisons than somewhere you would want your child to spend its day. Rather beautiful albeit cramped historic buildings than a prison!

Haven't commented on this thread before now, but just wanted to say a few things.

Firstly look at the schools themselves, not the sector they are in.

Also nice buildings may be more inspiring to you, but you're not the one going to school. Your dc may well be inspired to achieve from other factors.

There are many crap, underperforming state schools, but these are not the majority. There are also plenty of high achieving state schools with inspirational teachers, good results, well behaved children, good facilities and plentyof extra-curricular interests. Saying they're all crap is like saying all non-selective private schools are just full of thick posh kids.

IMO if you geniunely want to go down the private ed. route, but are short of funds, I'd say save the funds till secondary.

Finally I think your feeling is that if you pay fro something it automatically must be better than the free alternative. This is just not the case. Without meaning to sound patronising, I think your fixation on websites, brochures, results etc, rather than anything less tangible like how you feel your child would fit in, is because your background isn't one where education was valued, and therefore you don't feel confident enough in your ability to make the right decision. So you analyse hard facts, because they can't be augued with, rather than looking at the whole picture.

HTH

thanks titchy

I have phoned the LEA and I now know (for sure - I had a vague idea) which schools we are in the catchment area of and which out of catchment are likely to be oversubscribed.

I think that the issue of whether to pay for either primary or secondary schooling, when you don't have the funds for both, is entirely dependent on the state of schooling in your area.

In grammar-dense areas, the accepted wisdom is to pay for prep and then cross your fingers your children get into grammar school.

Can I just add that portacabins can actually be a sign of a popular over subscribed school.

I do think that attractive buildings are underrated, our school has been in portacbins for some time and we have just moved into our new buildings so have state of the art facillities and older more stately buildings. I have noticed a big improvement in the behaviour and work of our students. They are very very proud of their school and feel they have to live up to their surroundings. As a teacher I know I am very very lucky and adore coming into work. It is good for the soul to look out of the window and see beauty to know that society cares enough to offer you the best. If our pupils need to let of steam we have huge grounds, even a woodland to walk in. They have landscaped grounds a stunning cafeteria with terraces to sit out on when it is sunny.

The flipside is that some pupils find it intimidating, our school does not look like a state school. It has the look and feel of an independant and some pupils do feel as if we are trying to make them "middle class".

Where is this school of great beauty about which you speak?

Dolly I dont think we would be up to your standards, all those agricultural families and remember I ACORN classified 44.

I work in Dorset.

Dorset - lovely

I think you need to come here - as others have said - and actually go and see some of the schools. Rab is a good school - friends with children there have said so - but is large (three reception classes circa 30 per class, they are also typically oversubscribed so it's not that likely you would get in anyway. There are other schools in sw to consider and excellent schools in the villages close by (including the one my children are at which is fantastic and the ratios of teacher to pupil are significantly better than any of the town schools)