Not to let my ex see the children this Christmas

[gemmydingdongbell]

Ex hasn't been interested in or seen the children for months. He's missed birthdays, most access visits (arranged informally) doesn't phone or return calls.
However, a few days ago he has been calling frantically wanting to come for a day over Christmas (more so the day itself) to see the children saying that he has changed.
I've refused as I don't believe him and don't want him to ruin things. yet I still feel strangely guilty.
So aibu?

How old are they?
I wouldn't let my XP see our DCs over Christmas if Jesus himself brought him to the door.
He has ruined enough of their lives as it is, if he wants to ruin Christmas he has to get through me first.

I think YANBU - a child that flits in and out of a child's life is not good for the child.

I agree with those that say if he really has changed start new access agreements in the New Year and if he keeps it up then let him see them next Christmas.

For those that say she should let him to be a "good parent" - would she also not be a "good parent" by protecting her children from the hurt and upset of a father that turns up when (if) he feels like it?

Arrange for him to come for tea on Boxing day and don't tell the DC so they won't be disappointed if he doesn;t show up. TBH it sounds like what he really wants is someone to cook a Christmas dinner for him and he will not show if he gets a better offer.

I do believe that parents should try to set aside their differences in order to allow DC contact with Mum and Dad, but if one partner is making no effort and forever not turning up, it becomes not worth the other partner making any effort without anything in return.

I agree with solidgold.
He wants a nice xmas, there is a ready made one at your house.
Children aren't just for Christmas..

lets just remember that not all exH/P's are like mine - who has just rung me to confirm which games I've already got the DS's for their Wii to make sure he doesn't double up (yes he's left it late to do his shopping but at least he's doing it) and who sees his DS's reguarly and hasn't let them down when he's said he's going to pick them up he has. If arrangements have been in doubt because of work then he's let me know in advance (as much as possible) so I can pre-warn the DS's.

Many ex's aren't like that and mess with the DC's heads by not turning up, only seeing them intermittently (or if they want something)

YABU - I think you need to let him come on xmas day.

kslatts, have you ever been in this situation?
Watching the man you chose as father to your children breaking their hearts day after day. Watching their little faces at the window when they think he's coming only to have their world crumble around them when they realise that he is a lying cunt who can't put them first?

YANBU - boxing day, don't let the children know in case he doesn't show. if they're old enough to be snarky with him because of his previous treatment of them, then let them be snarky. Don't rearrange your day to fit around someone who doesn't seem to show you or DCs the slightest regard for the rest of the year.

I wouldn't let him come on Christmas day, arrange it for boxing day but, as others said, don't tell the children as he is unreliable. I wouldn't want to give him the opportunity to ruin Christmas day - which he would if you are constantly expecting him to turn up and he doesn't.

'Watching the man you chose as father to your children'

This phrase speaks volumes.

They are not the mother's children. Neither are they the father's children for that matter. Children are not property, they don't belong to us. Children have two parents and they are entitled to have a relationship with both those parents. I didn't choose my dh to father kids that would then belong to me. We chose eachother and decided to have kids together.

So?
If one parent doesn't put the children first then the other may have to take steps to ensure they don't get hurt.
Sadly, most parents should do this, but they don't always.

yes and children are also entitled to a secure upbringing, without having someone that is supposed to be their father drifting in and our of their lifes when they can be arsed.

You could equally well argue that a secure upbringing is one where the children can live with both parents under the same roof, and not have to live with court orders stipulating that they can only see one parents for XX amount of hours on XX days.

The point is, once parents decide for whatever reasons that they don't want to remain with the person they chose to have children with, they need to acknowledge that the children still have a right to continue to see both parents.

It is not up to one parent to take away those rights for the children.

so you would rather see you child distressed and unhappy because the father can't be arsed, doesn't turn up when he says he's going to, and when he does it's when he can be arsed.

No thanks, if I were in that situation with my ex then I wouldn't be putting my children's emotional well being before his "rights" as a parent.

It's a shame BOTH parents don't stick to court orders.

He sounds like a useless cunt who won't bother turning up. Invite him for tea, NOT dinner, and don't tell the children so they won't be gutted when if he doesn't bother turning up.

Sounds like he's just noticed he's going to be alone tomorrow.

Not everyone has an ex like FAQ and even to an extent mine. My ex will see more of the kids than me over Christmas, because I'm working and he's having them. He's here for Christmas, but he's cooking the meal. I cannnot ever be in a relationship with him again, but he isn't a bad co-parent.

Gemmie's ex sounds like a twat of the highest order.

He's missed birthdays, contact visits, the KIDS say they don't want him there - if this is all about the kids, let's give them what they want, hey?

Children have the right to see both parents, they also have the right to state that they do not WANT to see one or the other parent due to that parent's neglect - and to over-ride that right in favour of what the parents want is NOT about the rights of the children, and is entirely about what the adults perceive to be their rights.

Parents don't have rights over their children's rights. They have responsibilities.

Did you read the op?

"Ex hasn't been interested in or seen the children for months. He's missed birthdays, most access visits (arranged informally) doesn't phone or return calls."

You think allowing this man to possibly ruin Christmas is the best thing for the children? In all honesty?

No-one is saying don't allow him to see them, just not Christmas Day.

FWIW, I wish I had put my foot down and not let XP see the children the xmas after we split. If I hadn't they wouldn't have had to sit at a table with him making drunken snide remarks for yet another year or see him taken away by the police Boxing Day after he decided to kick me in the head and strangle me.

As a parent we need to make the right decisions concerning our children. Having had sex and created a child does not give you the right to walk all over them.

Excellent post Coldtits. (Love the name!)

YANBU - give the kids what they want this Christmas a day without him or the stress of wondering if he is going to turn up.

He has whittered away his rights and now has to work hard to get them back IMO - starting January the 1st.

YABU - and the kids won't like you for it either. You'll end up being the loser - when everyone knows that he is

Don't tell them, let him turn up (if he does). My dad used to do that and I always thought it was a lovely surprise when I saw him coming up the path for the first time in 3 years .

I guess my mother probably didn't say he was coming so I didn't get disappointed. I could hug her for being so selfless. He was a total tosser - but he was my dad and I loved him. And my mum was big enough to see that.

Do the right thing...

Excellent thoughtful post fondant - looking at things from the point of view of the CHILD, which is something that seems to be sadly lacking in some posts.

Children almost always love their parents unconditionally. They need to be allowed to have those feelings, and to be able to see the people they love. Trying to put an adult perspective on it and decide for them whether they should be 'allowed' to see him is selfish, which is exactly what the OP is accusing her ex of being!

It's rather like a parent's love for a child - that too is unconditional. We all know that even if our children screw up or let us down, we will still love them and want to spend time with them. A child won't understand all the complexities of why the two adults may no longer love eachother. And why should they? They will just have a natural love for the two people who created them and they shouldnt have that love denied to them.

but the OP's children themselves have said they don't want him there - how is it in the best interests of the children for him to be there if they don't want him there???

and I think you'll find that a lot of us ARE looking at it rom the child's point of view.

"Dad" who's paid little or no interest in them in ???? long suddenly turns up on Christmas day claiming to have changed. Child gets excited thinking they'll see more of him, he then buggers off into the sunset not to be seen again for XXXX amount of time.

Sorry - didn't realise the dcs don't want to see him - that's different.

Still think there should be some contact - either very limited on xmas day, or a bit longer on boxing day. He'll have to make do with a phone call.

Dcs might feel differently if it's for a short time too.

Shame that they've lost that much trust in him

Hmmm. What do the kids want and need? And can he deliver that? YOu don't want to make a date and they wait around for him and maybe he doesn't show. I don't think you should use Christmas to punish him but neither do I think he has a right to mess them around.