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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that people seem to think that a birth is only traumatic if it ends in an emergency c-section??

161 replies

anyoneelsedonethis · 26/11/2008 21:01

I have massive sympathy for women who end up with em c-s after attempting natural birth.

Am I wrong in thinking though that unless you end up with an emcs people just dismiss your birth as non-difficult/traumatic???

Some people end up with horrible ventouse/forceps/tearing experiences but no-one really seems to give much sympathy for these. That is wrong I think.

OP posts:
TheLadyEvenstar · 01/12/2008 00:31

I have to add my bit here...

ds2's birth was traumatic and you will all probably think I am nuts.

I went into labour a month early and it all passed so quickly he was born in 4 1;2 minutes at home. Paramedics just got there literally 1 minute before i had him. Now that was traumatic for me...then I had to deal with the hospital stay.... but there is another thread on that.

treedelivery · 01/12/2008 00:44

I can completely see why that would be traumatic. Fast and furious and overwhelming.

People often say they want it to be quick, I want it to be calm! Don't think you're even slightly nuts and just goes to show that there is no definition of how it 'should' be. Everyone will react differently to their own unique life.

TinkerBellesMum · 01/12/2008 00:44

I suffered from Birth Trauma after my second daughter was born by a Crash Section at 31 weeks. I am quite aware that my situation is about as extreme as it could be but I wouldn't ever think that someone who hadn't had it "as bad" as me hadn't got a reason to complain.

I've heard of a woman who suffered Birth Trauma after the MW came in and said "right then, get your knickers off, the doctor's coming to examine you". Most people wouldn't even think to laugh it off, it wouldn't even register but something about it upset her. We all have different tolerances and stress levels. It's sad that some poeple are too self absorbed to see that.

treedelivery · 01/12/2008 00:47

There is no knowing how any of us will react to anything. Makes my job dead tricky. [midwife - sorry]

TinkerBellesMum · 01/12/2008 00:52

I don't envy you! It's probably the most vulnerable time of a woman's life so it's not surprising that some innocent comment or action can lead to a traumatised mummy! You can't even predict how you will react to labour during pregnancy, I can't believe the way I was - I have a low pain threshold, but don't consider labour to be "in pain" and only have pain killers for my back, for example. I said some really strange things when I was close to delivering last time as I seemed to have lost complete control of my mouth!

treedelivery · 01/12/2008 00:56

I told the Anaesthetist [sp - it's late] she was an incompetent fat bitch.

Sent grovelling apology afterwards and bumped into her in a different hospital in theatre. Blushed to my roots but she didn't even rememer the incident!!!!

treedelivery · 01/12/2008 01:03

Can't believe I've told the worl that.

TinkerBellesMum · 01/12/2008 01:07

Someone put a sheet over my legs, I threw it on the floor, lifted myself up, looked directly at her and growled "I'm too HOT!" She was only young and looked terrified! I think that was the most aggresive thing I did. TBH it was my first baby who was born at 20 weeks and everyone looked terrified! No one could bring themselves to tell me I was in labour. I asked Mum to hold the mouth piece because my hands were shaking from the G&A I couldn't express myself so I said "holes aren't supposed to move when you're trying to put things into them" so she took it off me! I got another contraction just then and was trying to get it back in.

The odd thing is I coped far better with the birth of my first baby than I did with Tink's birth.

treedelivery · 01/12/2008 01:14

It's such a rite of passage - EVERYONE who gave birth somehow or other has a story. Some comical, some sad, some gross, some lovely. But we all have one.

MarxAndSparks · 01/12/2008 07:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Jackaroo · 01/12/2008 08:59

I think it's true - in my experience - that C/S get a different kind of reaction.

I tend not to go on about my experience, except sometimes on here, to my DH, and to my therapist . I would go so far as to say the reason I had such a traumatic experience was because the m/ws were so hell bent on it being "natural" even when I was induced for days and days (5)...

Even afterwards, when I was a complete loon from pain, shock, exhaustion etc etc they kept saying "well at least it was a Natural delivery"....

I am now contending with flashbacks, nightmares, terrors at visiting the hospital 3 years later and pg. with my 2nd......and I'm terrified of this next outcome.

I didn't really have a specific reaction from friends or relatives, because I didn't ever tell them the full story (no room here either).

Was acutely aware though that my friend got a week in hospital, own room/en suite special unit for c-sections, and hers was planned.... very very relieved for her, but felt somewhat sad that we don't all get that sort of attention if we've done it "properly" (midwives quote).

Gateau · 01/12/2008 10:14

Have only read the first couple of posts but I had an emergency c-section and it wasn't traumatic. Nor did I require sympathy. Why would I? I got a healthy, beautiful baby baby - and I was fine; for those reasons I was and am very grateful. I think too many people dwell on the birth, whereas I see it as a means to an end.

MarxAndSparks · 01/12/2008 10:25

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TinkerBellesMum · 02/12/2008 12:47

That's great Gateau, but unfortunately there's no choice about mental health, you don't plan on how you will react to something. I can't even say "When Tink was born" as the start of a sentence without bursting into tears, I'm constantly eating because I'm scared of another GA and I make sure I take my Heparin every day so they can't give me an epidural. That's not about me not getting my own way or not being happy that I had a baby at the end of it. Trust me, if I had a choice I would be enjoying this pregnancy!

TinkerBellesMum · 02/12/2008 12:49

Also, I knew that there was no other option and I am fully aware that this is going the same way. Trauma is in the eye of the beholder you could have been traumatised by something that wouldn't have bothered me.

jingleMAMADIVAsbells · 02/12/2008 13:07

TBM

That sounds horrible, and I hope you somehow manage to cope with this pg, I have been put off having another because of my labour with Liam it's not nice being so scared and it doesn't help when people say you ae moaning about nothing, well not exactly I know but still.

treedelivery · 02/12/2008 14:09

Oh Tink! -

FioFio · 02/12/2008 14:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

TinkerBellesMum · 02/12/2008 16:12

At the moment coping is a lot of denial! I was trying to explain this to my antenatal club, they think I'm brave but if I thought about things I would be a wreck.

Ha, fio, I'm waiting for that one! [evil]

treedelivery · 02/12/2008 20:06

Tink - is there anything to be done for you that would help? I'm sure you've explored all the avenues with your team?

TinkerBellesMum · 02/12/2008 21:25

I spoke to PALS yesterday and they're putting me in touch with a MW who can help.

The problem I have is that I was diagnosed with PND so I'm being treated like a mental health patient (trying to explain this online isn't easy!) so I get asked all the time how I'm feeling and it's not about me and my pregnancy (IYSWIM) and if I say "I feel" then they revert to the sympathetic face and my feelings aren't taken seriously. The best example (rather extreme but trust me it works) is going to the GP with a stubbed toe and they ask "How does that make you feel?" The first person who ever has made me feel understood is my nurse therapist, he often says "Well of course you feel like that, you've been through..." He once asked me if Tink is mine (accepting it was a daft question as he did) I told him she's not I'm the babysitter and he asked if I understood why I felt like that. It was great having someone understand what I mean when I say I'm babysitting her!

So I'm too scared to talk about my feelings because they don't take me or them seriously. I need them to accept my feelings as a person who has been through all that I have and not as a mental health patient. It seems the only way I can do that is to do what I had planned on never doing and seeing the antenatal mental health team. PALS assure me they will understand.

Sorry if I've rambled!

treedelivery · 02/12/2008 22:19

They will. They'll understand. I don't know if it's a comfort or not but truly there is nothing you can say that they won't have heard or seen in regards to experience and reactions to birthing. I don't mean to undermine your experience in any way at all please believe me - just to say you won't have to explain yourself if you don't want to.

I think I can relate to your situation a bit. I had a car accident at 2 months delivered, and a legal problem and became depressed. Therefore I was postnatally depresed. So everyone [G.P etc] treated me like a postnataly depressed person re the baby etc. I wasn't postnataly depressed, I was depressed due to other things and about other things. No one could see how this clear line between the 2 mattered to me - I felt misunderstood.

So not the same, but resulting in the same sort of feelings I think.

Have you got a delivery plan?

TinkerBellesMum · 02/12/2008 23:11

I understand. It's just been finding someone who doesn't do the sympathetic face [grr] when I say "I feel" or they ask me how I feel with that face. My nurse therapist said it's surprising how many normal nurses and MWs think every mental health patient is looking for the nearest plate glass door to jump through! He said they're constantly taking calls about their patients who are inpatient in the main hospital or the maternity hospital asking how to treat them!

Looking back on things and the difference between PND and Birth Trauma I'm quite cross they never got that I wasn't depressed. They were constantly asking me questions about whether I wanted to harm her, which is PND but NOT Birth Trauma. You're right it's different but it's the same frustrations I think.

We haven't got a birth plan because of all the false starts and not knowing what's happening. The hospitals plan is CS at 38 weeks, taking me in a day or two before to take me off the Clexane. Last time I started the doctor said I could deliver if she was coming properly, then came back and said "Sorry I didn't realise you had a classic [I don't, I have an inverse T] scar, we'll just do the CS either way". The lack of control is making me frustrated. Even if at the end of the day I don't have any choice I have to have one, I'd like someone to sit with me and discuss it with me like I have a say in the matter and let me say "OK, the risk is too high" and not be told it. TBH my own research seems to suggest the risk isn't that high, it's between a normal VBAC and a VBAC of a classic scar and both are lower the chance of needing a CS anyway without it being a VBAC.

Sorry if that got waffly!

treedelivery · 02/12/2008 23:28

You need your consultant. Have you had a proper meeting - not clinic time - with the consultant in charge of your care?

Ignore everyone else but that consultant - they are Dr's and midwives yes, but only the one who takes ultimate responsibility to the trust can really enter into this with you.

Anything remotely 'classical' - including the T will terrify the beJesus out of many staff as we only see it, generally, on patients from overseas. You need the consultants opinion on how the chances of a sudden uterine rupture are changed by this scar as opposed to the lower segment. There may not be that much hard data on this I dunno, as it's increasingly uncommon. Then the reasons you had this type of section - were they unique to that pregancy or do they still 'hold' and how that affects their opinion on your best path.

I am assuming your happy with the 38 week plan rather than the standard 39?

You could also ask to have the section done by your consultant - and also to meet the anaesthetist who will oversea your op. That might help a bit too?

And none of that meeting should include any reference to any sort of mental health or PND unless you want it too.

IMO that is!! DO feel free to tell me to piss off and mind my own!

TinkerBellesMum · 03/12/2008 00:41

My section was done by one of the hospital directors (my OH and Mum were told whilst I was in that he had been on his way to his car when they'd run after him to call him back, Tink was delivered at 7:20pm he had come back and stayed behind just to look after me) and he wrote in my notes (we were naughty-- looked last time I was in) "This lady would seriously benefit from a future elective section" and everything has gone from that. My first appointment it was said "you had an extension so you'll be booked in for a section at 38 weeks". No one has ever discussed it with me (apart from in Liverpool but that was because the benefit to a 24 weeker from a natural birth was greater than the risk of rupture at that stage) it's always been said like it's a given. My consultant has always said the same, but I've not seen her more than just at clinic, I'm not sure if that would be something that would normally be dealt with later, I'm 31 weeks and Thursday will be the equivalent date to when Tink was born.

I think 38 weeks is because of the Heparin, they want to get me off of it without me going into labour first.

I spoke to the ladies at caesarean.org and they said the problem is there are so few women who have this type of scar that it's hard to put a figure on it. It won't extend as high as a classical, it's purpose is to give them a little extra room (I don't think they'd planned on a 4lb 2oz 31 weeker!) so it's not more than a nick. The risk will be higher than normal but not as high as a classical because the vertical scar isn't as big.

Reason for last section was 31 weeker, coming footling, 2cm to delivering feet in an hour and my waters hadn't broken (not got my head around that bit, he said it was a risk ) and they gave me a GA because they didn't know what was wrong with my back with no time to find out (physio said good job they didn't), they didn't have time to mess around and I'd had Heparin in the morning. The reasons for a CS aren't necessarily there this time - apart from the potential risks of rupture - but all the same GA reasons are if it's unexpected and at least my back will be a problem if it's planned. I'll happily deliver with no pain relief so they can monitor the breakthrough pain better rather than go through a GA again.

The only thing I want them to remember or consider about my mental health is that I'm still traumatised from my last birth and just to try and reduce this birth adding to it. Last time none of it was expected and they couldn't have done anything different. I guess it's not often that a crash section is expected. In my antenatal class we were talking about the different types of section, she explained elective and emergency then said the third one is a crash. I put my hand up and said "that's when you suddenly get a room full of doctors and MW's, three doctors explaining at the same time consent forms which you have to sign whilst someone is cleaning your nails, removing your jewellery and putting a line in your hand, two MW's dressing each other and you, one MW explaining to your family what will happen and where they need to go, then within 15 minutes you're under GA and baby is out" (all in one sentence because it's the only way to really convey all that!) She just said "Yes".

Sorry, I do tend to waffle when it comes to Tink's birth, I think it's another symptom of the Birth Trauma.