to want my muslim dh to participate in christmas?

[firstontheway]

It's never been a problem before, we've discussed what will happen when we have kids etc, and we agreed that although we will be raising little one to be muslim, one half of her family (mine) are extremely lapsed christians and therefore she can celebrate both eid and christmas. With the priviso of course that we explain what christmas is, why as muslims we do not see it as a religious event, but as a nice opportunity to visit grandparents/swap pesents/ eat nice food etc etc.

However things seem to have changed now our first baby is on the way (not even due till March!) and he seems to be backtracking a bit and suggesting it's not allowed within the islamic faith and from next year we should think about 'dropping it'. Which I understand if I was suggesting my parents took her to church or something, but they would never go against our religion like that, nor would we present it as a religious festival (at least until she is old enough to understand nativity plays etc at which point we teach religious tolerance ). Am just a bit upset as my parents would be DEVESTATED if we didn't go to them for christmas... they live a while away from us and while we see dh's parents all the time, it's really special when we see mine, and isn't family what christmas is all about anyway?

Probably a bit premature, I'm hoping he'll change his mind when we go to my parent's this year and he sees how fun and wonderful it is. But just a bit hormonal and upset.

Am feeling much more positive about this now, thanks all!

Will just show him this thread! And explain exactly what so many of you have said, that we will celebrate it as a cultural and family based holiday, not a religious one.

very difficult one for you firstontheway.
I live in probably the most extreme muslim country (Saudi arabia) so can see where he is coming from. However, I am catholic and can see it also from your (and your family's) point of view. Its nice to read some of the posts about muslims who accept christmas and respect the religious beliefs of those of us that do believe and celebrate christmas and it sounds like your husband is very tolerant of that to a point. In Saudi, I think you'd be hard pushed to find any muslims who would tolerate christmas, let alone allow their child to become involved in it. I think the other posters who said about it being good for children to learn about and experience different religions/cultures are quite right. I was brought up catholic and went to a catholic school therefore knew no different until I was a lot older. Before we moved to saudi, my DC's went to a fabulous school where they learnt about all religions and each term concentrated on a different religion. My children (and therefore I) learnt about diwali, hannaka and of course ramadam. Bearing in mind that your DH did originally agree for your daughter to learn about christianity/christmas it would be a shame if he changed his mind now. I know it is a long way off but have you considered what school your DC will go to? Will it be a multi-faith? Hope you can reach a compromise along the lines of going for a nice meal and exchange of presents (as I believe happens at iftar during ramadam and at eid) and not make too much of a fuss of it? Good luck to you

I have worked with many Muslims over the years. All have accepted gifts from me, and many have given me gifts. I have never had the impression that Muslims frown on Christmas.

Wasn't Christmas a pagan festival anyway?

I think it's good if parents in multi-culti-multi-faith families can feel strong enough to partake in all the cultural aspects of the family (that will ultimately deepen the child's self-knowledge and identity) without feeling that it is somehow a competition for the child's soul, or that it will undermine the way the parents bring a child up. IME it isn't, and it won't.

tissy, thats nice to know but clearly you've never been to Saudi! Christmas is banned here! we have to smuggle in all our christmas stuff and its been known to have anything christmasy confiscated at customs (its a common occurrence to have your bags searched as you arrive)A really good friend in Dubai is married to an egyptian muslim and he is a bit more relaxed about christmas which is nice, but sadly here, it is not that way. Sounds like OP's DH is quite relaxed about it too which is good from her point of view. I'm sure there are loads of muslims out there that do accept it, but there are also lots more than don't

Converted Myself 12 years ago, all my family is Roman catholic. We do not celebrate each other holy days but I always call them and wish them a happy Christmas/easter... They always send present for the DCs when it is Eid. We do gift chocolate to our close neighbours after Ramadan and they bring us nice sweet stuff as well near Christmas time. I think it is OK to aknowlege (not sure of spelling) everyone's faith, but as far as celebrating each other festivals it would be pushing it a bit far and certainly conflict with your/their conviction?

Could he be a bit hormonal?.

As someone who married interculturally (sort of) I know there were all sorts of things about his culture that didn't worry me much until I was actually expecting, and then they seemed to hit me with full force. Once the children started growing up it worried me less again, because I can see that they are still my children iyswim.

If the only people who celebrated christmas were devout christians, then it would be a very small holiday indeed!

Things evolve - just as christmas started as a pagan festival, then the catholic church took it over, it is now a cultural holiday rather than only religious.

My DP is Muslim but its never been an issue for us. We celebrate everything!

TBH, I know one or two English Christian women who have converted to Islam before marrying Muslims and it's never been really something I've 'got' iyswim. I respect my DPs religion and he respects mine - we've been together years so we're doing something right. I wouldnt change my religion for anyone TBH.

I'd put my foot down if I were you - xmas is about goodwill, peace to all men and all that - doesnt matter if you're christian or muslim!

hi

am a practising Muslim myself and i have 2 lil boys, i would strongly advise that you consult a trustworthy scholar on this issue for ur answer, i havent celebrated christmas in 9 years but when i was a child we did it all tree going to grandparents for dinner and santa etc. i think that you need to think as a mother what identity u want to give to ur kids my own have never had christmas infact only last year did my oldest discover it existed.

maybe you could visit ur family the day before or the day after etc

Jesus is a prophet but in the Quran Allah speaks of how he told mary while she was delivering to eat the dates from a close by date palm tree pointing to the birth of Jesus being in the summer and not December.

I hope u can find a solution, take care

bridget

If you live in the uk, then it seems difficult to avoid it.DH is from a muslim country and I'm from a catholic country but neither of us are "believers" of any religon. Doesn't stop me from giving Xmas present to my children, having nice food, watching them in the nativity play (ok, it gives me the creeps to here dc talk about prayting to god etc...).
Anyway, don't think any of DH muslim friends object to sending xcards, receiving /giving presents etc.

DH not too interested in celebrating Xmas, but he is also not interested in celebrating Eid.

tbh I think that when you take on a rligion and turn your back on your original religion then you shouldn't expect to take the bits you like with you to your new faith.

Christmas isn't a part of islam. And as Kewcumber just posted, while it's perfectly accepted to acknowledge the birth of Christ, it is not acceptable to have santa and trees and all that - and those are the bits you really want aren't they?

I think it's fine to acknowledge that there are others in your family that celebrate Christmas, but if you're planning to raise your baby as muslim then it would be unreasonable to expect that she celebrate Christmas.

I can't help wondering whether you're totally comfortable with your conversion to islam?

My neighbours who I am friends with are Sikh, they are very 'strict' Sikh's (for example they had an arranged marriage and met for the first time on their wedding day, attend temple all the time et al).

Every year they have a xmas tree and celebrate christmas. They say they do this for their kids and they find it fun.

As an atheist I too 'celebrate' christmas because I live in the UK and it is such a major part of life here. So imo YANBU

wannabe - what is father christmas got to do with Christianity, was he Jesus's grandad

Firstontheway, and so it begins the clash of cultures. Before it get to heavy ask other members of his family what they think in very general terms to help you out with this.
I was born a Muslim and my Muslim Dad would celebrate everything and anything as he loved family and friends get together and was very close to my mum's sister. She was only 10 years old when they met and he loved having a little sister. He gave her away at her wedding,cried when she said I do and has always treated her husband as a brother (grew to be close as well) My father is dead now and I am still close to my Spanish side as my Pakistani, now Canadian family. Those Christmas, Eid, Easter, bank holiday get togethers are still deep in our family history and cherished

Hear hear starbear

Many people celebrate christmas without even the slightest of nods to religion.

Maybe the OP can customise it. You can't get away from it in the UK, but why not play down the religious side, and emphasise the family bit??

BTW, if you go to your parents at christmas, you are not neccesarily embracing christianity, but you are sharing a day with beloved family members, which will bring joy to them.

I have only read OP, Im not a muslim but have a friend that is. Her dh came inot the religion before they married and they do acknowledge Christmas, do pressies and go to inlaws for christmas. I have never quite understood it.
You are either your religion or your not. I know that sounds harsh but i think religion isnt something you can choose the good bits and leave the rest.
We dont celecbrate christmas, dds dont do christmas. We dont do dinner, pressies and the children dont "celebrate" it in anyway.
Why cant your LO go after christmas??
Saying that DH parents were so upset when he came into my religion, they disowed us and dont see our girls

Your 'friend' is you, then?

no not me. LOL
Just so happens that both have a DH that converted. My friend and her dh do christmas in a watered down kinda way (dont mean that to sound bad, just cant think of a way to put it). We dont do it at all.

If you're prepared to celebrate eid and tell your child all about it then why can you not celebrate Christmas aswell? Why does it have to be all or nothing?

See, thats what I don't understand about religion, why does it have to cause so many problems? Treat others as you wish to be treated and I don't think you'll go far wrong in life.

bridget 001 - would make sense that the Koran has jesus born in summer as per the Catholic calendar, the feast of the immaculate conception is the 8th of december!

Um, some one really needs to work out the maths here...

In any case, think Christmas is more a traditon than a religious festival...

Hedgewitch - thanks for explaining the pagan traditions. Always wanted to go to Stonehenge during the summer....

"You are either your religion or your not.
Why cant your LO go after christmas??"

What if the situation was reversed, and her parents had converted - would it be so horrible if a Christian family goes to Muslim PILs' for Eid dinner?

Both are occasions for families to come together. You don't have to swallow the whole religion thing to participate in them.

well sorry but imo religion isnt a pick and choose. If a christian "choose" to go to Eid thats their choice, works both ways. I personally wouldnt be able to do it, but each to their own.
I was simplely suggesting a different answer other than, go or not.