Not to subscribe to the view that "there's a paedophile on every corner" and "you never know who's driving about" and allow my children what I consider to be an appropriate amount of independence?

[MrsSchadenfreude]

I'll start by saying that we live in the country and I might be a little less relaxed if we lived in a town. My children are 10 and 7 and are allowed to:

Go to the post box (5 minute walk, no roads to cross)

Go to the shop (2 minute walk, no roads to cross)

Go to the park (4 minute walk, two roads to cross) and to play there on their own for half an hour

Play in the moat and fields that back onto our house for up to two hours at a time. (They can - mostly - be seen from the house.)

They have been allowed to do all this for the past 18 months since we moved here. We had some friends round recently whose children are older (12 & 13), and were horrified when I told DD1 and DD2 to take them into the fields and show them their "camp" they had made. These children are not allowed out of the parents' sight - we walked down to the river and one lagged behind and the mother went hysterical when she realised she couldn't see her DD (who is 13).

Surely unless we allow them a small amount of independence they will have difficulties adjusting to "real life" as they get older?

ivykaty44 on Tue 30-Sep-08 21:32:05
"Don't forget that that 120 figure, is only children who have been killed by cars. There are many others who have been permanently disabled or injured for a long time, causing psychological damage as well as physical.

That figure is Thirty two thousand and one hundred and twenty children - that would be the population of a large village or small town in the uk - in eight years, wiped out, gone forever.

The reality is that a car driver is far more dangerous. "

And also, do not let us forget that an awful lot of those children were killed or maimed in their parents's cars because their parents thought that's where they'd be safe. Ironic, isn't it?

My children told me the other day that they would like to do Martial Arts. When I asked why, dd told me so she could fight ds better... She learnt about kicking in the privates a long time ago...

I think the tricky thing for children is navigating between being polite to others, and respecting your elders, and kicking up when they have good reason to be scared. Perhaps over zealous stranger danger teaching is one of the reasons why children are so much ruder? If they see adults as threatening rather than supportive perhaps it is not surprising that they behave so badly.

nooka, you can't blame "overzealous" stranger danger for children being rude.
Children can be rude for lots of reasons. I'm sure we were all "perfect gentlemen and gentlewomen" in our youth.

I think Nooka has an interesting idea there.

Another reason why children are rude is that their parents just don't bother to reinforce manners over the weary years it can take.

It's hard work to set an example and remind them. We're writing thank-you letters for my daughter's birthday presents and it's a marathon. She hates doing it but I am gritting my teeth.

If you have a polite child adults tend to view them more warmly. It's in their own interests.

It's only a theory I am sure there are many contributing factors. But we do seem to have lost the idea that grown ups are looking out for children, and should be thought of as people to respect in favour of the predators lurk behind every corner concept. If you are brought up to think that people who talk to you are evil then it hardly helps community cohesion does it?

However I do remember being paralysed by my good manners when approached by my "stranger in the park". My instincts were to be polite, not to scream "go away". Nothing terribly bad happened to me, but it would have been better if I had been more assertive and less polite! On the other hand there were many many times when strangers were incredibly kind to me, and I would rather my children felt that other people generally want to help and not to harm them.

Somewhat tangentially, I remember an awful story someone posted here about their elderly father chatting to a baby in a supermarket queue and the mother turning round and telling him to go away, paedophile.

Guess what views THAT child will have of all adults outside his circle.

Bridie3, That is incredibly horrid!
nooka, I agree that children should be raised to practice good manners and that there are many reasons why they choose to be rude to adults.
I didn't mean to imply that I teach my children that people you talk to (or that talk to you) are evil.
I do try to teach them that if something seems odd to trust your instincts and question authority when it doesn't seem right. It is easier to apologize later than to try to recover from a dangerous mistake.
I guess I just think giving my children the idea to be aware and try not to put yourself in a bad situation isn't going to make them paranoid. I would think it would empower them to make the right decisions if they need to.

Hello, Oh! this thread is still going on so I'll advertise another scheme that I am party to, it is Citizens SchemeNot a link only way I can highlight this. It is run in a number of London boroughs. It is a scheme that brings together school nurses, Police Officers, Fire men and women, Ambulance Service, Road Safety presenters local council technical service staff(e.g local council wardens and public area maintenance). This runs for two weeks and every morning and afternoon Year 5 or 6 (depending on the borough) visit the scheme. There are 10- 12 scenarios children are told that something will happen and they have to figure out how to solve the problem, they can get up to 10 points for acting correctly (e.g as a good citizen and safely.) They walk into a room or bit of playground, actors play out a scene which they have to role play their actions or with school nurses solve the quiz. Mistakes pointed out and reward given. In 10 years I have worked on this I think its the best way and non-threatening way to teach children about safety. My nephews did it twice (because they me!) and when my son comes of age I will let him attend his school one and take him into work with me when I work on this. This has saved childrens lives in fires, with strangers and in Robberies. If you don't have it your local area pls press for it.

Sounds good wehaveallbeenthere, I wasn't meaning to imply that you encouraged your children to be rude! Just that I wondered if overdoing stranger danger concept was part of a general move that undermined community links and thus led to an untrusting society (obviously fragmentation of communities is a big factor, but then where I grew up there were few families that had been there for generations, so people didn't know each other that well, and I think that is still the case today).

nooka, it's all good (no worries), I didn't take any of your comments to be directed at me.
Starbear, that is a wonderful idea. They do that at my childrens school here too.