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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to think that once you have paid your childcare, its not really worth working.? Is it that you just don`t want to look after your own kid. prefering to stick them in daycare as soon as the shine wears off, it really bugs me!

1003 replies

discusturd · 17/08/2008 17:48

Some go from 7-6 and never see there parents, I know I will get slated but in the nursery I work some kids hardly know who their parents are.

OP posts:
juuule · 21/08/2008 17:46

Our first cm did.
Carried our first dc whenever he needed to be carried.

hercules1 · 21/08/2008 17:46

You know you dont have to follow a set of rules that say you cant work if you do ap. My children never had any problems when I went to work, it affected noone, least of all them.

hercules1 · 21/08/2008 17:47

I wouldnt expect a cm or nursery to ap. But I would expect them to meet their needs.

hercules1 · 21/08/2008 17:50

You seem to have such a narrow view of parenting. Children are highly adaptable.

blueshoes · 21/08/2008 17:51

Happyhoney, the proof is in the pudding. AP and enlightened and responsive childcare seem to work really well.

hercules1 · 21/08/2008 17:52

THe childcare I've used has always been great. DH, grandma, montessori, childminder.

happyhoney · 21/08/2008 17:53

hercules1,

I think I am a better parent than i lot i have met.

hercules1 · 21/08/2008 17:54

Great for you. Me, I just struggle like most.

happyhoney · 21/08/2008 17:54

blue,

yep and i have fab kids - thanks

juuule · 21/08/2008 17:54

The childcare I used wasn't always great which is one of the reasons I decided to sahm once I had a choice.

happyhoney · 21/08/2008 18:03

hercules1 - prehaps you fall into the carer will do a better job than me catergory then. As much as i at times doubt my own abilities - I know hat is best for my kids and think a lot of parents now have lost their marbles ie child wants/ child gets.ffs.

hercules1 · 21/08/2008 18:18

Actually I went to work because I couldnt bear to be at home 24 hours a day with my kids.

You're confusing I think giving children what they want with giving children material things and not setting rules or boundaries. Sling wearing, cosleeping etc doesnt mean giving into every whim and giving children what they want.

hercules1 · 21/08/2008 18:19

I think my childrne would laugh at you saying our parenting means child wants/child gets.

happyhoney · 21/08/2008 18:22

hercules - prehaps the people I know who have brats do not ap but are just pandering idiots.

Tittybangbang · 21/08/2008 20:21

Sorry to resurrect this thread but I've been out all day and wanted to respond to what blueshoes said earlier.

"As you have just said, your own position is far from ideal. (?Among adults, the strongest predictor in both men and women of an individual?s altruism ? the ability to care for others - is the level of care taken by the father in their childhood.?) to outweigh the negative impact on all of you of your husband?s long hours?

My husband does do long hours during the week, like most professional men in their 30's I know. The kids are late to bed and late to rise so they a couple of hours with DH in the evening most nights, even if he is late back. How much time do you get with your little ones between getting back from work and putting them to bed? Two hours is pretty good I'd say. Luckily he also engages so fully with them in the time that he IS at home that they have a very close relationship. I've been the subject of a lot of envy from my friends over dh's brilliance with his kids. He also has them completely to himself for at least 3 full days a month plus one or two evenings a week, as I work at these times, so this is good. He comes from a long line of brilliant dads. His own dad worked double shifts for 20 years when he was growing up - he came here from the West Indies to work for British rail and needed to do this to keep his family. When he was little DP saw very little of his dad during the week, because the length of hours that FIL worked, but they have always had a very loving and tender relationship. But yes - it is a bugger that so many children have dads that work such long hours. Perhaps if more parents knew about the possible impact of a father working long hours on their children there would be more political pressure to change working practices in the UK.

On the other hand you might get the sort of responses you've seen here to discussion of the research findings about nursery care: lots of scepticism ("how can this research take everything into account - it's a load of rubbish") and defensiveness ("are you trying to make me feel bad about the fact my dp works such long hours - what do you suggest we do!") so perhaps there wouldn't be much point.

Wanted to say - I do find it quite interesting the way you see things blueshoes. Your comment about me spending 'vast amount of time' with my dc's, and saying that maybe I think "not going to full time childcare will have a positive enough effect on your children" suggests to me that you see having your babies looked after by other people full time while you work is somehow the parenting 'default' mode, while caring for your babies yourself is some sort of luxury indulgence or optional extra for posh people. I looked after my babies myself because I didn't want to be separated from them, and because I could - simple as that. I also (now) think it probably made their first few years happier and less stressfull.

"And to suggest that one compromise is more damaging than another is naïve at best and downright insulting at worst"

That sounds good but is nonsense really. It's not at all naive or insulting, it's perfectly rational. I don't for one minute think that my dc's getting 10 hours less in DH's company from Monday to Friday than I'd ideally like would have remotely the impact on their experience of very early childhood as them spending 50 hours a week away from either of us in group care - effectively spending the majority of their waking hours for the first 3 years of their life in the care of people I personally know very little about.

The first is a minor compromise; the other would be a completely different way of life for all of us, but most of all for our children.

MrsMattie · 21/08/2008 20:22

What a thoroughly stupid thread! I think reading it just caused hundreds of my brain cells to spontaneously combust. Grow up, people.

Tortington · 21/08/2008 20:24

i think fathers should have equal time with their children.

therefore i think the govt should pay for mothers and fathers to stay at home with their children until they are 21

Tittybangbang · 21/08/2008 20:28

I'd vote for you custardo.

What would you call your party?

juuule · 21/08/2008 20:28

Mrsmattie - I think it's been quite a good thread. Stupid maybe in parts but there's been potential for people to gain an insight into a variety of viewpoints which might or might not be helpful for some. I don't think that's a bad thing.

prettyladybird · 21/08/2008 21:11

tbb, thanks for all your views on this thread.
i have found your post very interesting and informed.
i totally agree with you

frankie3 · 21/08/2008 21:17

Everyone is so angry and defensive on this thread. I guess discusturd is just presuming that most mums here earn low wages - my wages do not cover childcare costs for 2 children so it is not worth it financially for me to work full time, I just work part time, locally, fitting it around school, help from mum etc. But obviously if many of these mums earn a bit more, then according to their circumstances they can work as much as they have to or wish to.

blueshoes · 21/08/2008 21:30

titty, you have confused me with some other poster. I said none of the things you have attributed to me.

Although I would agree with the other poster - you are splitting hairs over the meaning of 'compromise'.

jellybeans · 21/08/2008 22:35

' while caring for your babies yourself is some sort of luxury indulgence or optional extra for posh people'. I agree with this. It seems PC to say that only well off or certain types of mums/dads have the choice to SAH. This isn't always true and I don't think it should be a luxury to look after your kids rather than pay someone else to do it. You can end up with the situation of being better off caring for your neighbours kids while your neighbour looks after yours, and some only see looking after others kids as work even though it may be exactly the same job with your own kids. What I think, though, is that is it really progress to have both parents having to work f/t to pay what one wage used to do? Shouldn't technology have freed us to have more leisure time and not work time.Wouldn't it be better for both to work p/t? (or one to SAH and one work...self sufficient unit) Where did the idea of 'full time work' come from anyway? Why is 40 hrs a week being paid to do something for someone else the magic number for self satisfaction? (for those who insist f/t work is the way to a happy life).

scottishmummy · 21/08/2008 22:41

why so suprised that self satisfaction is derived from employment. for me vocational satisfaction,intellectual stimulation,team work,buzz, vibe,excitement of what will happen next,utilising specialist skills and knowledge.that is why i work ft

wouldn't have it any other way

each to their own

i made my choice

i hope other's are happy with their choice

this is essentially a personal choice

almostblue · 21/08/2008 23:05

TBB

  1. My name is almostblue, not blueshoes.
  2. You said that you were unhappy with the hours your husband works. You said you wished it were otherwise, but that you couldn't afford for it to be so. Ergo, you pointed out that your situation was not ideal. You really don't have to defend your husband to me, nor to anyone.
  3. I'm sure your husband is brilliant with the kids; your children wonderfully happy and well-adjusted; and you yourself a fascinating and well-rounded person. Good. I'm also sure that the same could be said for lots of other families both in the same situation as you, and managing life differently. I didn't mention the research about the effect on children of a lack of fatherly input in order to impugn your spouse, but rather, to illustrate the essential pointless of citing such 'research' in this context.
  4. You don't actually know what hours I work, nor how long I spend with my children, nor when I went back to work after their bith, nor how much time they have with their father. That's because I haven't told you. And that's because I see debate based on personal anecdotes as kind of pointless, especially when the subtext is defending one's parenting choices by attacking those of others.
  5. My use of the phrase 'vast amount of time' was a rhetorical flourish. You really don't need to get so het up about it.
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