To think neurodivergence is more common than neurotypical?

[PrincessOfPreschool]

I'm expecting to get hammered for this and it's only based on my sample size of family, extended family/ in laws, friends, people I work with, children I work with but...

I know a LOT of people who I would describe as 'neurodivergent', I think more than I know who are 'neurotypical'. Some of these are diagnosed (more of the younger generation, a few of my generation and none of my parents' generation - in their 80s). Obviously it's a spectrum so only a very few are significantly impacted in their daily lives (unable to go to school or work) but I can definitely see strong traits in my generation and older, many coping mechanisms being used throughout their lives. I do have quite a high awareness due to training in my work, and knowing friends family with ADHD and autism.

I wondered if it's just my family and the people I know, or if neurodivergence is actually really common to the point of being equally, or even more common, than neurotypical. Why is called divergent if it's actually quite typical?

What's your experience?

This is very interesting, do you remember where you heard this? Was it just from someone else or from some research?

I hear adults frequently say “I’m ND, not diagnosed though.”

Someone “diagnosed” me the other week simply because I expressed having a strong feeling about not letting people down in my line of work. Apparently going out my way to please my clients mean I have a “ND quality” about me.

It absolutely is a spectrum, but it feels like any tiny little personality trait is enough to place you on the spectrum these days.

You’re saying they wouldn’t meet the threshold for a diagnosis and therefore I should STFU? Lovely. I suspect their probably would meet the threshold but I wouldn’t drag them through it as I don’t think long term it will be needed. They will be fine.

But if they will be fine then they don’t have a disability surely?

I think the reality is there is an overlap because we’re talking about emotional and social traits, not a physical or medical diagnosis where it’s more clear cut if you have the symptoms and condition or don’t.

So many people will have ND traits while not actually having a clinical diagnosis.

The traits of ND are not exclusive to each condition.

I just don't see it. I have ASD and ADHD. The traits were obvious from an early age, but because of the generation I grew up in it wasn't recognised as that. I was only officially diagnosed last year. My children all have ASD and ADHD. They are very different from each other. Out of 330 children in DD2's year, only a handful needed markedly different provision in secondary school and she was probably in a group of less than 5 who ended up leaving and going to specialist education (despite being cognitively able).

The proportion of children with EHCPs is around 5.6% now. That has increased from 2.4% when DD1 was getting her Statement of Special Educational Needs, but it's still a small proportion. When she went to special school at the age of 4, only 0.4% of girls her age went to special school. It isn't common.

It's not that easy to be diagnosed (properly) with ASD. It uses bolean conditions - the criteria are AND not OR. So the pool gets smaller as you work through the diagnostic criteria.

• criterion A: persistent deficits in reciprocal social communication and social interaction

AND

• criterion B: restricted, repetitive patterns of behaviour, interests or activities

AND

• criterion C: symptoms must be present in the early developmental period

AND

• criterion D: symptoms cause clinically significant impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning

AND

• criterion E: these disturbances are not better explained by intellectual disability or global developmental delay.

It was criterion E that stopped DD1 from getting her (obvious) ASD diagnosis until the age of 15. Until she had developed enough cognitively for her learning disability to not explain her behaviour, they couldn't diagnose ASD. At 15, it became obvious that learning disability at her level didn't justify the level of difficulty she was facing with social relationships and understanding social norms. When the assessors casually walked in late to the library we had driven to on a Sunday morning, with Costa Coffee frappes in hand, she glared at them and said "DD1 not like kept waiting!"

After her ADOS the assessor came to me and said "Why would you want an ASD diagnosis? Learning Disability is the holy grail - cradle to grave. ASD gives you nothing!" But it was vital for DD1 because her ASD traits were disabling her more than the LD. There are hundreds of young people who have LDs and are perfectly content in their existence. DD1 is tortured by it and the world not operating as she thinks it should. Last night she was sobbing that the BBC has removed most series of Swashbuckle from iPlayer without informing her. She turns 21 next month.

Anyway, ND is not 'the norm'. People with ASD/ADHD do tend to gravitate though, because their thought processes (not necessarily opinions) can align more closely. I can sniff out a person with ASD (diagnosed or not) in minutes. I have a friend whose DD showed strong ASD traits. I said it wasn't surprising because she also had strong traits. She was horrified and said she definitely did not have ASD. Fair enough. Three years later, having gone through all the pre-diagnostic work up, she said she was really confused because they were picking things up about the DD but she 'just takes after me'. Yep.... Then the realisation hit her and she understood what I was saying. Now she realises that the reason she always struggled at school and work isn't because she's defective. It's because her brain has always worked in a particular way and she's never forgiven herself for it.

I know lots of diagnosed people. It likely depends on if neurodivergence is in your family and what your profession is.

But I don’t think that my experience means that there are more ND than NT people.

Whatever, more awareness training would be useful, as even people who are not ND can possess ND traits, and understanding self or others can only be a good thing.

No significant effects mean they won’t meet the criteria for autism though. A bit quirky and like play a certain way doesn’t make someone autistic. Behind academically points more to a LD, or just how they are as not everyone can be average or above average academically.

Years ago it was simply different personalities. Some children struggled with some stuff, others struggled with other stuff. I’m in my 60s and I can think of 2 kids in primary school that might have been labelled ND now. I went to 4 different primary schools.

You’re talking yourself around in circles. Not everyone who has a disability needs to claim disability. My partner could register himself disabled with the condition he has but medication enables him to currently lead a normal life. That doesn’t mean his condition isn’t there 🤦🏼‍♀️

There is no such thing as registering yourself as disabled.

This is my experience too actually in my friendship group.

Well they wouldn’t. Their difficulties don’t have a significant impact on life- you said it.

Surely you’re either legally disabled because your condition is protected under the disability act or not, you don’t just register yourself disabled.

The stats are actually 1-2% for autism and 3-4% with adhd and many will be the same people having both. Your point is still strong though, being ND is vastly less common than being NT.

The stats vary a lot by age. 3% with autism for under 20 year olds, 0.03% for over seventy years olds.

Honestly the statisticians should resign in disgrace as every teacher I know reports a ND rate of at least 20% and more like 30-40% with more ‘to be assessed’.

And mine. A lot of PTSD and cPTSD and anxiety too.

It would make someone autistic on here. The default now is it’s autism unless you have concrete proof otherwise.

They really don’t, most teachers I know have kids waiting years because the wait lists are ridiculous.

SEND data does not show 30-40% of kids have autism and ADHD that’s ridiculous. There are many SEN’s needing support in schools that are not autism or ADHD.

Not true at all.

This is a common reaction to the meds. I know people who have had stomach problems, terrible insomnia, awful mood and breakdowns due to it, when asked if the meds might have triggered this experience which they never had before going on them they didn't want to know and said they were life changing.

Really? Because that’s not my experience. And of course, if you have 3 children and one is autistic, there’s a good chance the others are.

You put waiting for assessment in quotes as if there isn’t currently a two year wait for it.

There are those who ARE getting a diagnosis because they've diagnosed themselves and no one is telling them otherwise. It becomes their whole identity.
They've put plenty of hours in online to know exactly how they need to present and what they need to say to address the criteria and receive their much wanted diagnosis 🤷‍♀️

Very well said!