A lovely family? Is this normal?

[anon876543]

This is hard to write. I’ve seen great advice on here and I am asking for it, for my family. Please be kind as it’s taking a lot to write this even.

Married 20 years, 3 teenagers close in age.

I’m finding things difficult. I felt that I knew what I was doing when they were little and now I feel out of my depth. We are all adjusting maybe through puberty x3, I’m going through menopause and I think my DH is struggling also.

Especially with repeated redundancy rounds and that his career hasn’t quite been what he’s dreamed of and worked so hard for. Long story.

I think DH is struggling, no social life. No hobbies. Just work and parenting. Rising bills and interest rates on a big mortgage coming up.

Thats the background. But he’s being very snappy with the kids. And very irritable..

He found some sweet wrappers in our eldest boys’ room and was so cross, he came downstairs and whilst he was studying at the table, he grabbed the neck of his t-shirt from behind and threw them underneath.

Oldest just told me this tonight.

He said that he heard him arguing with the youngest and think maybe that he shook him.. and that he knew even though he was studying that it would be his turn next- because Daddy was in a bad mood.

Sundays are always a horrible day and I wish H would just go off, meet some friends, go to the gym, play golf… anything. He says that he can’t as the house is always a tip.

No one has been physically hurt… but this can’t go on. Yet they listen to my H and don’t listen to me so I’m afraid on so many levels of trying to do this on my own.

I’m honestly lost and feel that I’ve lost what is normal? No family is perfect and LTB isn’t straight on my list either..

Please forgive me @anon876543 for derailing your thread.

what do people think of abusive behaviour (as above but actually, worse in some ways) when the teen is displaying horrendous behaviour of his own? Drugs etc.

your teens haven’t done anything wrong, op. They don’t deserve to live like that.

I guess I’m asking if any of it could be warranted if the teen behaviour was extreme enough.

Come on guys, he threw some sweet wrappers down the back of a 17 year old tshirt....that's not abuse, that's action and consequences. What kind of little weakling are you all raising.
Maybe shaking tge youngest one also depends on if it was a violent shake or grabbing his arms firmly.
No wonder the world is turning to crap and kids are out of control.
Parent your kids, this poor man is frustrated because the house is a tip and his wife is worried and stresses and it's possibly part down to 3 teenagers.
Get a grip.

You're married to an abusive and miserable cunt. Get him away from your children, it's your job to protect them from a POS like this. Prioritise them.
It doesn't matter if your 'D'H's career isn't what he expected, he's abusing your boys. One knew that 'he was next'....?? Fucking hell.

I think the examples you've given are very unclear/hearsay.

I used to shove my teens' rubbish down their tops if they left it around. It was a sort of lack of patience/lesson. No one found me intimidating though.

If he's shaken someone, that's obviously bad.

To be in your forties with a large mortgage, repeated redundancy (are either of you working?) and everything else, sounds like hell. Throw in menopause and teenagers are no, this isn't going to be fun.

Can you have counselling with your husband? Would that be a useful first step?

Huh, it was only after seeing your post I realised I read this bit 'he came downstairs and whilst he was studying at the table, he grabbed the neck of his t-shirt from behind and threw them underneath' completely wrong. I thought he grabbed the kid by the neck and flung the kid under the table. 😬

I think a lot of people forget that parenting is for life not just for the toddler years. Parenting teens is a whole different ballgame.

It sounds like yours are doing OK if they're studying and the worst thing your DH found in their bedroom was sweetie wrappers!

It also sounds like your husband is at the centre of what's bringing you down. What you've described physically isn't on.

And as for the Sunday dread, we all get grumpy but it sounds like he's really making things worse for himself and everyone else.

Do any of your teens have hobbies and sports? Our weekends have a lot of fresh air watching and playing team sports, walking dogs, seeing friends at the sports clubs etc. Of course there are still chores and homework in the mix but on a low key weekend we have meals with the wider family, watch films, read books.

I cannot stay in the house all day, I go stir crazy and get cabin fever and I need a daily walk like I'm a labrador or something. My DH often doesn't want to come with but I go on my own with the dog or take my youngest as he loves an outdoor explore, or sometimes it's me and my audiobook. I know that doesn't solve your DH not wanting to get out and about but I'm just trying to say that you can get out and about WITHOUT him and despite him. As can your teens.

Has your DH had any interests, sports, hobbies, friends outside of work and home in the past? Have these come to an end or ended badly or just fizzled out?

Actions and consequences is telling him to go and clear up the wrappers.
It sounds like done in anger. If you were sat working downstairs and your husband storms in and yanked your t shirt back and stuffed something under it to teach you a lesson it’s not acceptable so why is it acceptable to a teen. Sounds like dad was on one and everyone on eggshells trying to stay out of way.

No making excuses but I suspect money is a big factor. Lots of parents when deciding to go for 3 children think about funding younger years not teens.
Feeding and clothing teen boys is expensive. If he’s only just realised kids will get min loan at uni and the required parental top up is over £6000 a year plus expectations of driving lessons/car insurance if that’s norm in your circle he may be struggling. Not excusing his moods and abusive ways. He should be talking to you and you working together.

Getting physical is never acceptable. Your DH needs to leave

Some questions really.
Why would sweet wrappers in a bin upset him so much ?
Is the house a tip ?
You think he is struggling. Your DH. When did you last really talk together ?

This resonated with me although my father was never physically violent. For a long period of time in our teenage years his business was going badly and he used to be in a rage at home. Stress of the responsibility of paying staff etc. He was a good and kind man but during that period my brother and I wouldnt know what would set him off shouting at us and we dreaded him coming home. There wasn't a day for a period of time where I wasnt in huge trouble for something minor. It stopped when he sold the business and I left for uni and we had a lovely relationship after that. But its given me a life long fear of male raised voices and I suspect a fair few issues which I don't want to delve into. If my brother or I also had a sniff of a physical thing to worry about I think it would have been significantly harder. My mum had had an alcholic father who also used to shout (I recently found out) so also has that fear of a shouting man. She left my Dad and while I was lucky to repair our relationship, my brother never did. I think its harder for a boy as they naturally will want to test boundaries with their dad and a father needs to have the self control to be a good father amd not to overreact.

Sounds entirely plausible to me, I'm afraid. Even if OP is on a wind up, which I don't believe she is, this stuff most definitely happens and it's not unusual.

Angry, narcissistic men who think they own their families...

I think it comes down to how willing your DH is to recognise that he has a problem and that this behaviour is detrimental to his family. If he can't cope with a conversation about it and just goes defensive then that makes for a harder decision for you OP.

I think it's normal to go through a bad patch as adults and teenagers can really push our buttons. The question is does the person recognise it as a problem and make a change.

Hi OP
Hand hold and virtual hug.
I understand what a lot of PP are saying and I don't disagree with a lot of it BUT I think there's a bigger picture here and as a family you're obviously all struggling, so I think this needs some calm yet firm boundaries being set as a starting point and use this incident (which sounds like it is an unusual turn of events due to mounting stress) as the spring board as it obviously can't be repeated.

I would start with trying to have a calm non judgemental or accusatory conversation with your DH alone. You 2 are a team and in order to get your home running smoothly you have to be united and on the same page (look at me with the advice, me and DH often end up at loggerheads over the DC and general household tasks 😂) if you can both talk openly and honest it may just help with the stress a problem shared and all that.

It sounds like your DC are all old enough to be helping out and taking some responsibility also so I would lay some ground rules with them following this and stick to them. There's no reason why they can't be helping out around the house and whilst your DH reaction was OTT there is no reason for DC not to put his rubbish in the bin it really irks me when my DC leave sh*t all over their bedrooms tbh. Keeping their rooms clean and tidy is a minimum in my book.

Be gentle on yourself OP, this sounds like an isolated incident and not one I feel you need to start ending your marriage over but it does need to be dealt with correctly to ensure it doesn't escalate again. I feel for you it's bloody hardwork with DC and 3 teens I don't envy you. Good Luck ❤

Put the wrappers down his tshirt

If it's a long term pattern then figuring out how you can leave realistically and safely is a good idea. You don't have to do it straight away but start finding out what you'd need and how to get it.

If it's a recent change which the OP suggests, it sounds like stress, possibly burnout. I would tell him he needs to go to the GP urgently or talk to one of the men's mental health organisations.

Huh? RTP.

No family is perfect and LTB isn’t straight on my list either

If he's treating your children the way you describe, LTB absolutely should be on your list. He grabbed your son by the neck of his shirt because he found a few sweet wrappers in your son's own room? What was your husband even doing in your son's room anyway?

You're all walking on eggshells and you're all scared of him. Why on earth would you think this is normal? It's not.

Oldest just told me this tonight.
He said that he heard him arguing with the youngest and think maybe that he shook him.. and that he knew even though he was studying that it would be his turn next- because Daddy was in a bad mood.

Your children are literally telling you that their father is abusive and they're frightened of him. You need to leave him.

This all sounds very frightening OP. You haven't mentioned how your DH is treating you?

The sweet wrapper incident is totally OTT and his reaction was unnecessarily, but I am more concerned at the suggestion that he may have shaken your DS. Shaking someone can cause brain damage.

He needs help, urgently. There are lots of helpful suggestions here. If I were in your position I'd probably start with The National Abuse Helpline for guidance as to where to go from here.

https://www.nationaldahelpline.org.uk/

OP my DH has been out of work for almost 2 years, sole earner. He is currently taking care of a disabled wife and 3 kids, 2 hormonal teenage girls who are complete slobs. He’s struggling with the fact he’s never been out of work, UC dosnt cover our bills, the boilers on the blink this week…But you know what, he dosnt take it out on us!

Using the excuse that “no one is physically hurt” is enabling abusive behaviour. So life’s not going to plan, that is no excuse to to verbally and physically attack your children.

You need to sit him down and tell him just because he thinks life’s shit at the moment dosnt mean he gets to treat his family this way and if he dosnt stop you will not only leave but call the police if he lays another finger on your children.

being physical isnt, but if its a repeated behavior of the child parents are going to get frustrated by it at some point. Hard to say without knowing what behavior of kids is like.
Its not really clear whether he just shoved the wrappers down the kids neck, or picked the kid up.

This needs nipping in the bud fast before things go downhill...

1. DH needs to make an appointment with GP to speak about mood, irritability. Maybe a referral for counselling and some medications that impact mood. You also need to have a 'come to Jesus' talk with him about how he's feeling, what's going on for him, the impact etc. and what you will NOT tolerate. Make it clear anything physical with the kids or you = it's over. But talk too about the impact of words and that belittling or emotional abuse won't be tolerated either. You could share you understand things can spiral but we are still accountable for our actions.

2. No more Sundays a home. Come up with a plan - walk, cycle, visiting family, a pub lunch if it's in the budget, something that gets you all, or at least you & your sons, out the house. Don't think about what you can't do, find something and do it.

3. Bring hobbies back - they don't need to be expensive. Something for yourself that isn't work/kids, he needs to do the same. Rambling group, swimming at the local leisure centre weekly, a monthly book club, something. Maybe for your dh committing to meeting a friend monthly at the pub and getting some exercise each weekend.

4. Talk openly with your sons - talk to them about mental health & well-ness, let them know they can come to you with any feelings or experiences, even if it's about their Dad. Try to get them some support elsewhere - a trusted uncle or grandparent? Pastoral Care?

Your family appears to be at a turning point. I'd put everything in now to give things the best chance of heading in the right direction.

Best wishes.

Maybe the proverbial straw? Not infrequently these things aren’t about the sweet wrappers (or leaving the top off the toothpaste) but erupting from a deeper malaise

I’m honestly lost and feel that I’ve lost what is normal?

His behaviour is far from normal. He needs to talk to someone.