AIBU to reconsider a long friendship over support for education tax?

[CoconutRumcake]

A close friend of over 15 years last night unashamedly said she supported the children’s education tax. To put this in context, she is godmother to my ds and has seen first hand what damage this has done to children and families as well as her own sister losing her job when the school closed. She had maybe drank too much and has apologised over text this morning, but I really can’t shake the feeling that I don’t want to be around her.
AIBU -try and move past it
YANBU -it’s run it’s time

The children pay the tax ? How much do they earn ?

Well that is exactly what happened.

Charities have tax breaks but have to do charitable work to be eligible.

All other businesses with turnover beyond a certain amount have to charge VAT.

It was decided that as private schools are businesses and whose primary purpose is not charitable work, but provision of education in exchange for fees, they should have to charge VAT.

It is the ending of an exemption that was based on a false assessment of the true nature of the business.

In answer to your original question, you can draw a line on a friendship at any time. If having a shared view on this more important to you than the friendship then distance yourself.

If it helps, I would not make a friend the other way, roles reversed. That is my choice. I do not agree with private education.

Where I would come unstuck is if we were friends pre children and I had to decide whether to stay friends once you announced your school plans. Not entirely logical I know. I am curious wether you were friends before you started privately educating your children or not. If you were friends prior she may well have been biting her tongue on this for a while.

Oh the irony. That’s a pretty fact free post there.

this had nothing to do with claiming VAT back. In fact, they now CAN claim VAT back.

So you aren’t interested in discussing whether or not you abu to cut a long term friendship over differing opinions at all, you just want to lecture us on how taxing PE is wrong and semantics.

@CoconutRumcake she supported the children’s education tax

You mean the wealthy family tax.

Again, no there isn't a free alternative for an increasing number of children whose needs are not met in state. Those children either come to a school like mine or sit at home if their parents cannot manage it. I would love it if schools like mine were not needed. I would love it if the state invested in education to make the private sector commercially unviable and not needed. Until they do, and this policy is not achieving that, its simply hitting the most vulnerable in the sector. The 'toffs' are all happily untouched at Eton.

Ah, they’re not taxing children’s education ..they’re taxing the choice of children’s education. Makes sense now, down with evil children’s education choice !! Labour can count on my vote.

There is no education tax.

Hope that helps.

It is VAT added to the fees charged by the school.

The school is a business with a turnover above the VAT threshold.

Why should they be exempt when other businesses have to pay?

If you choose to send your children to private school then surely that's always a risk when their enrollment depends on your personal finances. And it should have been weighed up when the decision was made to send them there. Especially if your finances are so precarious that an extra 20% is going to make a huge difference.

Private schools aren’t filled with SEN children. That’s a small proportion of the 7% of children attending private. I feel much worse for children moving schools regularly due to insecure housing or difficult custody issues or any number of other concerns more regularly affecting disadvantaged children.

The private schools near me don’t take any child requiring 1:1 support. They’re in state schools, special schools or out of education altogether.

I asked earlier how this harmed your children and a number of other questions. You have ignored me. I note you are choosing who and what to answer and avoiding any direct questions you do not like.

FACT: your DC would / could have bursaries to cover any additional cost you couldn’t fund. These would come from the generosity of others giving to their charitable foundation.

FACT: if as I think you mentioned your DCs school shut because of poor leadership and financial planning, other private schools are in your area.

FACT: I am chair of governors at a fee paying school, I really do understand every part of private school finances and the different models various private schools work with. How VAT and tax works for the school “business” , its charitable arm and overseas.

You understand the NHS is free at the point of use yes? And you pay for it via tax? The same with state education. Those who opt out are choosing a luxury and therefore taxed at the normal rate, raising vital funds for the education of all. You are at best misinformed, at worst a total bigot.

It would help, but as ridiculous as it sounds we do unfortunately now have one. Don’t worry though, it’s just for children’s education.

I don’t think most people think that! Have you seen the growth in Germany and France? It is not 2016. The EU is not in a good position and I say that as a remainer.

Why aren't they suitable?

It is a tax on education paid by the children for education services

You've repeated this a number of times, however, I want to check, even though you've not explicitly stated this...

are you intentionally using the term 'tax paid by the children' in a wider, non-fiduciary sense, whereby the 20% VAT discincentivises a sub-cohort parents, who would have previously sent their children through private schooling??

If so, this is a very liberal use of the term tax - where missing out on private schooling may or may not limit these children's opportunities later down the line, whether economic or non-tangible.

that's the only way any (future) 'tax' would be paid by the children for education services

Just have a laugh and a joke and keep it light is much better.

I'm afraid that it is you who doesn't understand the policy. These schools did not have charitable status but a loophole in the law meant that they were treated as if they did. Now that loophole has been closed and they are treated like the businesses that they are. They have decided to pass the cost of VAT onto their customers which has put their fees up.

Well I guess you arent near me then.

It’s not a tax on education, it’s a tax on you choosing your education provision. Tax on buying a new Mercedes is higher than tax on buying a Mini. If you can’t be friends with someone with different views to you then that’s a you issue. I have a friend who a Tory and supports Trump - we couldn’t be more poles apart - but he is a nice person, works very hard and in everyday life is the exact person you want by your side. People who cannot separate politics (and this would barely even qualify as a political issue now, it’s not new either) from friendship are going to be lonely and, to be honest, quite ignorant. It’s on us all not to live in an enclave of our own beliefs and understanding. Of course there are lines that cannot be crossed - I’m not about to chum up with a neo Nazi. But the fact that you’d knock a longstanding friendship on the head because someone thinks VAT should apply to private education shows you up.

I was under the impression that the VAT exemption would continue for SEND children. And private SEND provision isn’t automatically better than state provision. There are legal and practical limitations and much depends on the child’s own needs

While it’s true that private settings have smaller class sizes and more flexible funding, it’s also the case that they are not bound by the same statutory duties under the Children and Families Act as state schools - EHCP carries different enforcement and legal rights in the private sector.

In addition private schools often don’t have enough staff trained for conditions such as severe ASD or ADHD and therefore not sufficiently equipped for children with complex needs, and often parents find that their children are asked to leave in cases where behaviour is a problem.

https://www.tes.com/magazine/analysis/general/finland-schools-down-in-education-rankings

because their little darlings might have to mix with the ‘common’ kiddies!! The horror