Aibu feeling uneasy about men taking little girls to the toilet in the womens toilet?

[Fasdmama]

I've seen this a few times and I dont know what is the right thing to do.
So the other week we were at the cinema. I took my daughter to the toilet and as I was waiting for her a man came out of a cubicle with a little girl and went to wash her hands.
It got me thinking.
I feel uncomfortable a man in the womens toilet. I understand how you'd potentially feel uncomfortable taking a daughter into the mens toilets.
And the only other option in this situation was the disabled toilet but morally thats wrong.

I dont know what I feel is right in this situation so wanted to know other people's opinions.
So yabu: its right for a man to take girl into female toilets
Yanbu: he should take her somewhere else...but where?

The argument that, because single sex spaces aren't perfectly single sex, we should do away with them is a facile one.

I think most of us would agree there is no such thing as a perfectly single sex space untainted by someone of the opposite sex ever setting foot in there.

That doesn't mean spaces can't be functionally single sex and we take a sensible and balanced approach to risk management.

well have to agree to disagree. Emergencies are fine, a cleaner is fine (as long as a sign is put up outside so people can make an informed decision).

that’s the end of the exceptions to me.

Nope we aren’t . I don’t believe in special treatment and putting my child above everyone else . Thats not how I was raised nor is it how I raising mine . They are being raised to be respectful and thoughtful towards others. A man who is a sexual being entering a female space is the epitome of selfishness .

and I don’t believe little girls are entitled to a cleaner bathroom any more than little boys for sure

Are cleaners fine though? Male cleaners have been caught installing cameras in women's loos.

https://www.theargus.co.uk/news/17923072.steeve-frivolle-used-cameras-spy-women-crawley-toilets/

So there are probably a lot of people out there who would strongly disagree with your approved exceptions.

Fair enough, but I stand by the argument that most parents wouldn't take that stance.

Why do you think men are "sexual beings" (and how on earth are you defining that)?

A cleaner has no choice but to go in there that is literally their job. The dad has a choice of going to the men’s . There is NO need for a dad to be in there with a little girl .

Well I mean, anyone can install a camera when a venue is closed surely? No one has control over that.

that is a different issue to a male cleaner seeing people coming out with blood on their hands?

Because they have gone through puberty and have sexual urges and sexual desires . Small children do not . Do you not understand that is it not obvious ?? Can you not see the difference. It’s exactly the reason why women don’t mind a 4 year old boy in the changing rooms but would be upset by an adult male in there . .. does this help you understand better ??

It still means there is a man who is (in your words) a "sexual being" is in the women's loo. If he is a threat by way of being a "sexual being", does it matter if he has authority to be there?

Because they have gone through puberty and have sexual urges and sexual desires

So do women. Why don't you describe women as "sexual beings"?

Should everyone be allowed in then cos cleaners are allowed in ? Because they are allowed in ALL men should be allowed in ? Yes ? By your argument this is the case

@Limeandfigs a cleaner is an employee and there are signs around saying male might be cleaning . Women can choose to go elsewhere if this is a problem for them.

a dad is NOT an employee and it is not the same

Well I mean, anyone can install a camera when a venue is closed surely? No one has control over that.

Which is why I said spaces can still be functionally single sex and we take a balanced and reasonable approach to risk management.

that is a different issue to a male cleaner seeing people coming out with blood on their hands?

That is a different issue, yes, and it's also completely irrelevant to a chain of discussion about someone installing cameras in a women's loo and why that means men should stay out.

I haven't argued anything of the sort.

I'm pointing out, once again, that there is no such thing as a perfect or ideal scenario when it comes to public toilets.

For some people, even male cleaners going in to a women's loo means it's no longer single sex. For others it doesn't.

What do you mean by "the same"?

The same risk profile? How do you know that? An argument could be made that the male cleaner is more of a risk because he's taken a job that gives him regular, unremarkable access to women's toilets.

Disabled toilets - no excuse for them to be in the women’s bathroom at all.

Should we allow dads in with little boys as well then ?

It’s not the same because there are warnings everywhere giving people a choice. Is that not obvious .

Problem is people think disabled people should be prioritised for disabled toilets. I don't disagree with that and is reasonable most of the time. However, if you have a small child desperate for a wee or a baby screaming and we don't want men in women's spaces, then disabled people will need to wait their turn if someone is ahead of them who isn't disabled.

Does the choice impact the risk that a male cleaner could install cameras?

Who is "we"?

I have no authority to allow or deny entry into any public loos.

no but women are informed a man is a cleaner and can decide to not take the risk if that’s how they feel

Ok so basically you think a free for all is acceptable because there are no rules

We used to be sensible about this.

A child who is too young to use the toilet unattended is not going to be traumatised by walking past a urinal - even if it’s being used.

A man helping his young daughter in the women’s toilets is not going to be there for his own gain and most women in the real world will be able to understand why he’s there, even if it’s not ideal.

A man with an erection stuffed into fishnets and a leather mini skirt is an entirely separate matter and he should be nowhere near the women’s toilets.

I don't know why people think dads with a very young daughter are in the slightest bit interested in them 😂 a male cleaner is much more of a threat. The dads I know would feel extremely embarrassed being in the ladies and like my DH would use it as a last resort if the men's isn't suitable/rank.

Going into the ladies isn't DHs first choice but he isn't going to take DD into somewhere dirty to use the loo if it can be avoided.

DD is of course female, so is entitled to use the ladies anyway. I would expect adults to be more flexible than children. Children are allowed to occupy spaces.