Do you agree with school absence fines?

[Dreamyseptember]

I honestly don’t have a strong opinion either way. I work term time so I can only go away in the school holidays anyway, plus I’ve never been keen on mine missing school.

However, I can totally understand why for many people they want to go on holiday during term time. A family holiday can be a magical experience, visiting somewhere new, spending proper time together, experiencing new things, getting away from the daily grind. And for many this would be unaffordable in the school holidays. The other thing is that parents can’t always get the time off work.

I do think it’s important for children to attend school, I know they missing large chunks at school can mean them falling behind, miss out on learning as well as time with friends.

But tbh, I know people whose children missing large chunks school frequently anyway. Any sniffle, tired day, weather too hot or too cold and the parents are ringing them on sick. There are other children who attend 100% of the time and is one week away for a family holiday, possibly at a time of year when learning is wrapping up anyway, going to really make that much difference.

When I was at school in the 80s/90s it was quite normal for children to disappear for 2 weeks for a holiday abroad and no one batted an eyelid.

I’m sure that there are lots of arguments either way but do you think it’s right and fair that parents are fined for taking their children on holiday during term time?

Yabu - the fines are correct
Yanbu - it should be the parents decision

I disagree with them because

1. they disproportionally impact disabled and SEN children whose needs are being so poorly met in the educational system at the moment that it’s insult to injury to then fine them
2. where there are more ‘truancy’ type issues it’s a poor way of trying to fix them
3. holidays in term time have no impact on attainment. The evidence is that poor attendance is associated with poor attainment but since this is also linked with SEND we can’t really say there is ANY causal link between a family holiday and attainment.
4. Fundamentally parents know better than schools what their children need and I don’t think state parenting is a good concept.

To be honest I didn’t actually look this up before starting the thread.

I keep seeing people on SM going mad about school fines.

I am a massive believer in school attendance, however I do also think that family holidays are a hugely valuable experience.

But now that I have read that the fines don’t even make any difference to attendance, I think that they are bloody ridiculous.

Attendance should be about the children’s well being and education and nothing more.

Likely but will it make any difference? Most likely not.

It would help in the future. And for next year people need to start saving! DH and I are already saving for our holidays next year.

Oh and my kids have fantastic attendance. I have also never taken my kids out of school for a holiday.
They have missed a week of school due to a bereavement and it was absolutely the right choice .

It’s challenging enough managing a class without having to spend time, energy, and the disruption to the other children, of teaching little Johnny long division separately because his parents chose to take him to Benidorm for two weeks in February when it was being taught the first time. Even more fun when he gets a sniffle and has to stay off for another two weeks. At this point little Johnny has missed a month of school - around a 9th of the school year, half of which was entirely avoidable.

We know that performance is linked to attendance. Why wouldn’t you want to give your kid the best chance of doing well for the sake of a few hundred quid? If the fines make at least some parents think twice then that can only be a good thing. If they removed them I can only imagine that attendance would become patchy across the board, especially from the kids who probably need to attend the most.

Sadly a lot of the parents whose children are struggling don’t give a stuff no matter how much we engage with them! Their parents saw no importance of education so neither do they and will continue down to their children’s children sadly.

You can't control holiday prices. Won't happen.

Other countries do it. Yes. It can be done.

If Johnny struggles in school he will struggle no matter he is in Benidorm a week or two.

And there is a very, very, strong link between attendance and performance.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/67c96d7dd0fba2f1334cf2ed/The_link_between_attendance_and_attainment_in_an_assessment_year_-_March_2025.pdf

I didn't say it should be the teacher's burden to catch the child up. I think it would be more practical for everyone involved if the parents emailed ahead of time saying my child will be missing from x date to x date due to us going on holiday. What will you be studying, I will have them go over it before they get back. It would take the teacher 5 minutes, the child's education wouldn't be disrupted.

Unfortunealy I doubt such a collaborative approach would be possible as teachers seem extraordinarily irrationally annoyed that their students can go on a cheap term time holiday. I dare not suggest that envy is the cause of such an odd response.

Any conclusion in the 47 pages for a standard child taking a week extra holiday in term?

The approach serms to work outside England.

I think it's using a sledgehammer to crack a nut, and the fines are targeting the wrong people

Four years ago, we took our year 2 daughter out for 4 days for a trip to Lapland at Xmas. We were fined. AT the end of the school year, her attendance was 98% as they had been the only absences all year.

Yet I know 2 of her best friends had attendance at around 89-90% because they were off with the sniffles/coughs/colds ALL THE TIME.

But we've also taken the odd day or so before half terms to get better flight prices, and quite frankly,. we've just phoned the school and said "she's been sick...as per your 48hr policy she can't come in..." to avoid the potential fine. When I knew full well, those two days were a) class treat and b) dedicated PE days so she wasn't missing any actual learning at all.

I think there's a big difference between taking a day off either side of half term, and taking 3 weeks in the middle of term to go away. But the system doens't correlate to that.

Same. I preferred it when it was left at the headteachers discretion.

The holiday companies should have to pay the fine, because they're the reason people take their kids out during term time.

The fact a UK caravan holiday Mon-Fri can be £179, but then £659+ for the same thing a week later when it's half term/summer hols, is awful.

Greed.
Unfortunately, money makes the world go round...

Yet when your child can't attend due to unmet send needs/no suitable placement, no one gives a shit if they miss weeks, months or even years of education. One rule for parents another for schools and LAs

Some do care about their children’s schooling but they also feel entitled to a cheap foreign holiday every year. These are the cheeky fuckers that ask the teacher to set work for the child to do while away as if they’re doing the school a favour, expect it to be marked on return and then send in souvenirs for show and tell as if the rest of the children are going to be interested in the holiday their classmates were having while they were working hard in lessons.

Did you admit it was for a holiday?
I'm wondering how the school knew to fine you.

Lying is not ideal, but I think for the sake of 4days, my family would've had a "violent stomach bug"

We always go in the holidays.

However I think a much better approach would be to allow 5 school days holiday a year not everyone would use it anyway.

To combat the sickness excuses use the truancy officers to check in on children who are magically off too long to go and check on them once it hits 3/4 days in a row.

Then fine the shit out of the parents if caught lying having already used their 5 days. Do it in proportion to wages rather than a set fee.

Much like some court fines can be wage dependant.

And we forget about the parents not being cheeky fuckers dont we? Not all parents are like this.

Agreed.

A relatives child has basically been neglected of an education because of SEN.
The whole system is a mess and a money making wheel

I'm a secondary school teacher and have no objection to a child being taken out of school IF the parents make sure all school work missed is completed.

e.g. school agrees a week off school, child is told what work needs to be completed that they will miss, and child brings evidence of that work having been done to school.

I think that's more than fair.

If the child doesn't complete the missing work, THEN I think there are grounds to fine the parents.

My cousins spent 3 weeks travelling round India with their parents. They kept a journal of their travels, did the maths/English work the school asked them to, and then did a presentation to the class when they got back.

EDIT: Can I have a week off school to go on a cheaper holiday too though? I'm currently working today planning lessons.

Literally no one thinks it’s ok for
children to be out of school
due to a lack of suitable places. The two things are completely unrelated.

A belief that children should be in school during term time doesn’t magically make appropriate school provision appear out of nowhere.

I understand this at secondary. But I have to say for the majority of primary aged pupils I just don't see a big problem in losing two weeks of learning. That happens all the time - illness, teacher absence. My child missed a week when the school closed in the heatwave. Some kids are unschooled until secondary these days! I just find it hard to believe a couple of weeks affects long term outcomes in any meaningful way.

As for staff, I don't think that's the same, they can choose to work in a school, the problem is the fines aren't optional.