Do you agree with school absence fines?

[Dreamyseptember]

I honestly don’t have a strong opinion either way. I work term time so I can only go away in the school holidays anyway, plus I’ve never been keen on mine missing school.

However, I can totally understand why for many people they want to go on holiday during term time. A family holiday can be a magical experience, visiting somewhere new, spending proper time together, experiencing new things, getting away from the daily grind. And for many this would be unaffordable in the school holidays. The other thing is that parents can’t always get the time off work.

I do think it’s important for children to attend school, I know they missing large chunks at school can mean them falling behind, miss out on learning as well as time with friends.

But tbh, I know people whose children missing large chunks school frequently anyway. Any sniffle, tired day, weather too hot or too cold and the parents are ringing them on sick. There are other children who attend 100% of the time and is one week away for a family holiday, possibly at a time of year when learning is wrapping up anyway, going to really make that much difference.

When I was at school in the 80s/90s it was quite normal for children to disappear for 2 weeks for a holiday abroad and no one batted an eyelid.

I’m sure that there are lots of arguments either way but do you think it’s right and fair that parents are fined for taking their children on holiday during term time?

Yabu - the fines are correct
Yanbu - it should be the parents decision

I'm on the fence. When I was a primary teacher, it was annoying to have children away for a whole week but generally didn't create huge issues. If it were really true to that missing a week of school had a massive impact on learning, all the children who miss school due to illness would also be falling terribly behind. That generally isn't the case. A child missing two weeks is much more disruptive and rarer so I'd say that's more of a concern.

The real problem - at least in primary school - is children who miss a Tuesday one week, a Friday the next week, three days the following week etc etc. Essentially parents who are flakey as hell and are either too scattered, ill or drunk or high to get their child to school consistently. A child who barely attends will suffer hugely in the long run - fines generaly make no difference in those situations as parents don't pay them at all and they need help much more than they need punishment.

I will add that closing schools in 2020 has not helped. It's a bit ridiculous to say that children must not miss school and then close schools for months on end.

It used to be like that when mine were at school, I'd go away at Easter and October, it meant booking before the start of the official holidays, would save the equivalent of my spending money. Being spread over two different years, meant very little missed.

Most children do absolutely fine. If they don't a week or two won't do a lot anyway.

You just punish families not able to pay the fines or expensive holidays. Most likely rich people make and pass the laws.

Easy metric for government to show education is improving and education target is being met. Also, cash flow to local councils.

Harder to show real impact quickly on :
SEN support what is in place, changes and improvement.
Funding for teachers and TA.
School building work and repairs.
GCSES subjects and specialists teachers.
A levels subjects.

The holiday companies need taking to task for increasing prices unreasonably during school holidays.

No, they disproportionately affect poorer parents and break the bond of trust between school and parents.

My ds missed months of school due to a mh crisis. Luckily we live abroad and weren't charged, only helped. I know parents in the same situation in the UK who were threatened with fines making an already stressful situation much worse.

Yes and no. I do think in primary school you should be allowed 5 days off but invariably parents will take the piss

secondary school no

By making sure they don't miss out on their education and stops them having a belief the rules don't apply to them.

I don’t agree with fines. That’s the system we have though so I don’t agree with whinging about getting one if you take a term time holiday.
We haven’t taken DC out for holidays but she did have weeks off through illness and being in hospital and she, we and her teachers didn’t think she’d missed anything major. They were extremely supportive of her absences, no stress about attendance at all and they suggested a staggered return so she continued to miss half days, no complaints at all.

What would be the point of that? What would you care?

Those poorer children are ones who need to be in school more! A quick google and from my own observations in school children from poorer families are more likely to be lower achievers so holidays in term time makes it even worse!!

Oh lord.

I do agree with this and think that teaching children that school isn’t optional is a good thing.

However, it’s the fines and heavy handed approach that criminalises parents who just want an affordable holiday with their children.

I feel that there is a middle ground between just allowing school holidays, and criminalising and fining parents.

The fines were introduced in 2013 and from what info I can find, they haven’t made any difference to attendance. They certainly haven’t stopped persistent absences.

When I was at school there were no such thing as fine and there weren’t huge numbers of families taking term time holidays. Some children did go and they were allowed to tell everyone on their return. I don’t recall this ever being a huge issue or those children doing terribly at school.

Oh yes young children get that from getting moved to another school by school system for no other reason than a few weeks off on holiday. I see..

No. Its worth pointing out here that the fines don't just apply to holidays, they apply to children who are grieving the death of a relative, children who are neuro diverse, children who are refusing school because of mental I'll health and bullying, and it's almost always the Mother who gets the fine and gets sent to court, not the Father. There is no evidence it helps the country overall, and lots of evidence to show it is cruel and damaging. Australia doesn't have fines and it's normal to go away. Their society hasn't collapsed as a result.

Maybe they need to stop punishing Mother's and look at how they should change schools so that kids actually want to attend.

Doesn't help low paid families 2026.

The point you made "if children are allowed to take holidays during term time, then so should teachers" is a bit ridiculous.

The difference between the students and the staff is that the staff are employed by the school, they are paid to be there teaching the students. Also, the staff are adults who would be the ones booking holidays, not children who realistically have no say on when the holiday is booked.

I don't think there is anything wrong with a child missing a week of school to go abroad, it's easy enough to catch up. Home educating parents prove every day that learning can actually happen outside of a classroom.

So work with parents to keep their kids engaged with learning. Fining them doesn't increase attendance but does negatively affect the family.

You should get an allowance of say 5d per year you can take without issue. Just inform and use them.

Switzerland has something like that.

No, I strongly disagree with school absence fines.

Every time one of these threads comes up and, as you yourself have pointed out, it's highlighted that fines do very little to deter absence and are simply a money making exercise. If the Government actually cared about children being in school, they would invest in education and healthcare. That's the real crux of the matter.

my two have left school now but I never took them out of school for holiday. I’m very against it personally and that stems from being taken out of school myself for holidays as a child (not every year but a few times) as my dad had to take set holidays. I hated it. Teachers with their 13 weeks off a year made snide comments and although I was/am very intelligent and left school with all As in my highers so it never impacted me academically it made me stand out. Whether it’s the same these days as it seems more common who knows. I also hate going on holiday outside of school times and places still being overrun with kids. That said I don’t think I agree with fining.

I work in Higher Education so it's clear education occupies a high value in my and my family's life. But I deeply believe that family experiences such as holiday are at least as important as formal education for a child's wellbeing (if not more). Also, what about children of mixed origins, such as mine? I'm originally from Europe and going home to see family with my kids is much more than just a vacation, it's connecting to roots, culture and some of the most important people in our life. If we couldn't afford to take them during school holidays, I would absolutely take them out of term, providing it's not exam time.

Why is it ridiculous? The children aren’t getting the fines the parents are.
1 child missing 1 week isn’t going to make much difference but multiply that by 30 children at different times of the year and it’s very difficult to catch everyone up!!

Weve taken our children out a few times (longest 5 days). The money didnt come into it... it was around their fathers time off work. Which was rhen authorised, as he us in the Army, and Military parents can get an exemption... which is unfair, as other jobs can have similar issues.

I dont think the fines have much effect on the larebts paying £10k for Florida or Thailand etc.

Presumably the idea is it’s a deterrent so parents don’t do this?