To think that a comfortable middle class existence is basically unattainable for the vast majority of people.

[joelm1776]

I was thinking today about how much someone would actually need to earn per year in order to have a traditionally financially comfortable middle class existence. This, to me, means having a family one parent being able to look after the kids, being financially secure and having some pleasures in one's life on a regular basis but not necessarily any extravagant pleasures ie. not having multiple holidays a year, or luxury items or fine dining meals out. I know these things are fairly subjective, but I would like to think that my judgements here are quite middle of the road. I'll show you my working:

2 parents and 2 child household

1. £17,000 per year in mortgage payments for a 3 bedroom house (average price of a 3 bedroom house in the UK is about £275,0000)
2. £8,300 per year in supermarket shopping
3. £5,500 rough estimate for running 2 cars per year (one for commuting one for short journeys) including fuel, tax, MOT, insurance and maintenance.
4. £5,000 utilities, internet and council tax for 3 bedroom house
5. £1,000 per year on clothing (£20 per person per month)
6. £2,500 repairs and long term replacement fund for house.
7. £2,000 student debt
8. £6,000 one family meal out at a mid-range restaurant per week
9. £1400 2 night out for drinks with friends per month for each parent.
10. £3,000 one week family holiday to mainland European destination per year.
11. £1,500 pocket money for kids
12. £1,200 sports clubs and gyms memberships
13. £1,500 general household items excluding clothing and food
14. £2250 large purchase fund (e.g two cars lasting 15 years each, 4 smartphones lasting 5 years each etc)
15. £2,000 saved for other contingencies

Total = £60150 net + 7.5% saved as a pension = aprox £64650
Total gross = £94000

so basically you need to earn £100K even if you don't live in London, and only the top 5% of uk earners earn around this amount and most of those people probably work in London.

I know the the mortgage figure ignores the fact that people often have equity from other properties, but that makes the calculation a bit too complex

I know of two SAHMs, one living in a 1.9m home, married to a banker and house probably bought with a combination of family money and income, she was a high-earning finance professional before giving up work. The other is living in a house purchased by her family and I suspect is receiving in-work benefits of some sort to top up their income.

The class system will always have fewer the higher you go in it.
The majority of people will be in the working class. You can even break down each class into different sections too.
But no, not everyone will be middle class.
It is a bit like someone middle class saying not everyone can be upper class.

Mind. Do not confuse class with wealth. There are plenty of working class very rich millionaires. Who do not become middle class because they are.
There are plenty of middle class people who are hard up.

Class has a lot to do with values and interests as much as cash.

But it has never been the case that many families were middle class in that sense. Last year 6.4% of pupils were in private schools. Same as in the 70s.

Education: Historical statistics (see page 9)

I agree with this. @joelm1776 What you are describing or aspiring to I would consider more of an upper middle class existence. But then there is a contradiction because some of your figures are a bit low.

An income of £100+k, is the situation of a small % of society, who can afford all you list and more. But as I said in a PP, extended family contribution often plays its part.

We are in the higher income bracket and I do see as you say @Boxoffrogs21 a more consumerist expectation of families aspiring to middle class lifestyle today.

We rarely eat out anymore, granted we are older, but even in our younger days eating out regularly wasn’t something we needed to do, we did that on our luxury holidays or very special occasions.

I see my DD and her young family, middle class, wouldn’t bat an eyelid at eating out once a month and spending £200. That money could be much more useful somewhere else.

Don’t forget the falling birth rate. 2 kids no longer happens for a lot of professionals. Cheaper.

Lots of kids = social housing helps. Cheaper.

Yes most of my friends with massive houses and low mortgages (in our late 30s - early 40s) do so from inherited wealth. Our mortgage on a small 2 bed house in a not so nice area runs until we are 65. Hopefully can pay it off before then though!

Hardly ever bother with takeaways anymore. Overpriced and underwhelming. Would rather pay to eat out but that's often disappointing too.

Yeah we only had one car in the 80s too. But how are we supposed to manage that now when DH and me both need to drive to work which is in the opposite direction? We live rurally so public transport just isn’t a realistic option. Then you have the weekend stuff, one of us would be stuck at home if the other needed the car?
I would love to take public transport to work actually but it would need to be reliable and convenient, it just isn’t in my area.

Our mortgage is more than that. We earn high salaries but we live in a big city and that’s where the high paying jobs are and the mortgage is set accordingly. Add in private school fees for the child of ours that has SEN and we’re £5k stone before we even start on the rest.

In the past schooling would have been adequate and housing costs lower, and we would have been much better off. It is what it is though.

Yes, I agree with you OP. My parents are absolutely middle class, very good at money management and my dad in particular did extremely well in his career, reaching the top of his field as a professor.

Both earned probably in excess of £120k combined income (or something like that, as obviously I don't know the exact amount). A lot of my friends when I was school in Bucks probably had parents earning much more, especially as some of them lived in extremely wealthy naice areas like Amersham and the Chalfonts.

I remember saying to my best friend how it'd be great to have a lifestyle like our parents, and she literally laughed out loud in a very wry way. Things certainly didn't result in a typical middle class lifestyle for me, but I'm not uncomfortable. Certainly not anywhere near on a par with my upbringing, with foreign holidays, no money worries, and combined income of £100k.

So yes, to enjoy a good middle class lifestyle these days definitely requires at least the amount you say.

The social contract that promised you could work hard, earn an average income and have a comfortable lifestyle has dissolved. Anyone arguing it hasn't is in some form of denial. And by all estimated metrics, it's not going to get better, only worse. The 'cost of living crisis' is not a temporary blip. Enshittification is here to stay. IMO the only option is to do the quite radical work of adjusting your expectations, wanting less, consuming less - finding joy and fulfilment outside consumerism. (Appreciate the privilege of being able to lower your expectations - there are cohorts of society who probably feel they can't go lower.)

We’re ‘comfortable’ and we probably have one meal out a month these days. Just too expensive to eat out, even in ‘basic’ chain restaurants and it all adds up. I’d rather go out once a month somewhere special.

I would dispute that competent money management is the monopoly of the middle class.
Many working class people are very capable of managing money.

We have created a confusing system of incentives for having children, whereby those on higher incomes are very incentivised to have fewer children (no child benefit, no free childcare, cost of private housing, cost of school fees etc).

While those on very low incomes are incentivised to do so as the state will subsidise you for each extra child you have.

Yes there is a difference in expectations around lifestyle in this equation - but it seems counterproductive in the long run to make having a family (or a big family) really unattractive for the middle classes.

I think life will only get more expensive, higher taxes, food costs & utilities

Yes the Il de Re is definitely middle class!

It's not all about how much you spend.

@MidnightPatrolbirth rates are low across all incomes though I believe. Big families are just really rare these days.

Yes, absolutely, although my working class FIL is certainly not good at money management as my MIL does all the finances - he wouldn't have a clue if she wasn't there! 😐😳

My son (now 27) worked from 14. He bought a three bed terrace in a smart SE town this year. CS job £75k. He saved his own deposit and the house is his. He brilliant at DIY having laboured at a building company. However he lived with us for free for two and a half years to save his deposit, no package holidays. He went overseas to friends.
As a child we paid for his prep school and sports clubs. He went to the local academy for secondary and chose a commutable university.

We had a very lavish lifestyle in the late 1990s and early noughties. We had a large country house (8 bed). Mortgage £3200 a month!
Both my husband and I were brought up in council houses. However my mother was highly educated and spent the family money on middle class activities (horse riding, ballet, museum trips). She always worked often out earning my father.

We did the same. Meals out once a month for our DC. Borrowed houses for holidays.
Charity shop clothes when I fell ill and couldn't work. Senior recruitment is not happening. £150k jobs are far and few between. I'm too old to get such a job now but I think people need to save for the hard times. We're in a global downturn and few people are acknowledging it.

Unless we tackle the lack of growth. Growth would mean you earn more and the government gets more in taxes. Do you think the cost of living has risen to unnaturally high level, or is it more that the total lack of real terms wage increase in the past 20 years has meant where people used to naturally keep up with rising cost, we are losing out. Our lifestyle is getting worse because the economy isn’t growing like it used to.

Always has been out of reach for the majority. That's why the working class has always been bigger than the middle class and the average salary is in the 30ks.
If you're asking do more people have to make some sacrifices like not having a SAHP or luxuries, then yes. But the life you're describing has never been the default for the majority in the UK.

There was someone, early 30s no kids who was on £50k and was bemoaning the fact that he couldn’t afford the payments on his BMW 3 series (don’t know what that is but sounds expensive). My mind was blown. Who on earth thinks they can afford a new luxury car on £50k?

Having the choice though is

@Secretsquirrel2 when you had your lavish lifestyle did you save little? Not meant as a criticism but I do think there is a difference particularly with some of the middle class (perhaps upper middle) that money is saved/invested & often there is a big family safety net to tap into if times get tough.

I make it work in London single parent with one kid with a couple of holidays and camping on a lot less