To have kicked an old man’s dog?

[itsme189]

This morning I was walking my 2 very small elderly dogs on lead in the woods near me where it’s nice and cool for them.

they love people but they don’t love when dogs run up to them and get all in their face, valid I wouldn’t like that either. If a dog on or off lead just walks past or gives them a quick sniff they don’t mind. I always tell people not to let their dogs come right up to them.
Theyve never bitten just growled and I just don’t want to risk anything.

there was an old man walking a large greyhound type dog off lead and he’s miles away from it it runs at us very fast so I stick my leg in front of my dogs and the dog doesn’t stop runs straight into my leg. He then excitedly throws his foot on top of my smallest dog he squeals in pain and my other dog starts growling and showing teeth.

so I picked them up and then the big dogs starts jumping up at me to get to my dogs so I kick it away.

Old man then starts screaming at me for “abusing” his friendly dog and a lady walking passed then said to him “I saw her kick the dog”

and now I don’t know if I did too much but I was so overwhelmed and worried it would become a fight and there’s no way my old boys would do well in that situation. To make it worse the lady made a post about it in our local Facebook group (luckily no pictures) and everyone’s saying awful things but they only know one side!

For the record the dog was not hurt didn’t even squeal!

I don't like dogs but don't approve of kicking them. But it was self defence. Dog was out of control.

YANBU!!!! The man was wrong for allowing his offload dog to approach your on lead dogs. Boils my piss it does. Dogs are not human and do not NEED to say ‘hello’.

Scooping the dogs up was completely and absolutely the WRONG thing to do. Apologies if anyone else has said this, I read the OP's posts and the first two pages.

The dog running at you wasn't showing aggression, from your description. It's a tall clumsy lout, again, from your description. In situations like this the correct thing to do is to shout loudly at the other dog's owner "Control Your Dog" while using your own body as a shield against your own dogs getting injured. Picking up a smaller dog leaves their belly exposed for another dog to bite at. It's happened. Your dogs weren't in danger from being attacked by this louty dog, and kicking out at the louty dog was unnecessary. Use your body. And your BIG voice. Ultimately it's the fault of the other owner in not controlling his dog but you are also in the wrong for choosing violence (and your protests it wasn't a hard kick mean nothing, you chose violence). Your dogs had momentary annoyance, dogs sniff and size each other up. You completely overreacted.

As an aside, the Jif Lemon squeezy bottles fit nicely in a pocket; aggressive dogs (not louty dogs) won't enjoy getting a mouthful (or eyeful). Last resort only.

Literally these all over the place now. But it's fine according to people here? FFS.

Also want to add if OPs dogs react like this and get nervous, they probably should be wearing a muzzle. Along with people keeping their hyperactive dogs on leads.

The entitled owners are all over this thread!

TheHungryHungryLandsharks

Best advice from whom?
I do wonder where the actual evidence behind this advice comes from.
It's one thing not to pick up your dog to avoid getting bitten yourself, but a child?
Who seriously recommends that you try and calmly walk the aggressive dog back to its owner when it has its jaws clamped around your child.

You did the right thing OP. You can’t be responsible for idiots who have dogs with no recall off the lead. If your dogs would have got hurt I bet he wouldn’t have paid your vet bills!

By law a dog off the lead which runs up to a dog on the lead is considered to be dangerously out of control. I had a similar experience, but only shouted at the offending dog, and the ignorant owner became very indignant. If you encounter this dog again report it to the local dog warden.

Dont be so ridiculous. Bloody hell why are you turning it in to violence against women?So dramatic!
Yes big dogs can be overzealous and often do stand on smaller dogs. But most of the time they dont actually cause damage.

The dog at ‘fault’ was the greyhound and the shit owner was the rude entitled man. Let’s not victim-blame here.

Picking your dogs ip will reinforce their own Behaviour issues and anxieties.

yes big dog needs training but so do your dogs/ to reduce growling, nervousness and anxious reactive ness

I don't actually own any pets!!! Through choice having grown up with them as sadly I can't commit to the work of owning one.

Nope. If you can’t control your deadly weapon, then keep it on a lead. You are the worst kind of dog owner.

It's dog owners with your attitude that cause a lot of upset for other dogs and their owners, because they can't be bothered to train their own dog well and then get defensive and start blaming the innocent onlead dogs, minding their own business, for not being 'socialised'.

Any dog who runs up into another's dogs space, can't read signals to back off, jumps up at people and has poor recall, is the dog who needs further training and socialisation - not necessarily the dogs walking on lead beside their owner.

There can be any number of reasons why a dog might be on lead, in this case the OP's dogs are small and elderly.

Irresponsible dog owners seem to think it's ok for their dog to rush up to intimidate and hurt onlead dogs.

Responsible dog owners know not to let their off lead dog run up to an onlead dog.

It's clear which category you, and some other posters on this thread, fall into.

I do think that of you let your out of control dog off lead, you have to accept they might have to deal with some natural consequences. You have to take the rough with the smooth when it comes to having a bit of freedom. I'm sure the greyhound would happily take the risk.

I'd be putting in a comment re his dog pelted up to yours, looked massive/you thought it might hurt your elderly dogs, so yes, you stuck your foot out and will be reporting it to the dog warden (fat chance, unlikely you even have one!).

I'd be very worried if a much bigger dog ran up to mine. A much smaller one did the other day and went berserk at my very friendly ones who tried to run away but idiot terrier with zero recall was hanging onto my dog's arse! I was furious, owner couldn't get it back, my DH put his leg out to try to remove it, no kicking and she went mad. It was her dog hanging off mine who tried to run!

I'm currently reinforcing recall because mine can go deaf and I absolutely think it's awful if they run up to another dog, it's just not fair on other dogs/owners. If they are in a situation where I think they won't recall, they stay on the lead, don't care how friendly they are.

You are in the right trying to protect your dogs. The man should have called it back to him and not assume it's okay, you don't know if it's coming to attack yours. He is responsible for his dog, he should keep it within range of himself so you would know it has some semblance of training.

You were both somewhat in the wrong. The man should not unleash his dog if he can't control it. We shouldn't kick animals, but if you genuinely felt your pets were in danger you probably acted from instinct to defend them. But tbh this sounds like the kind of dust-up that will inevitably happen from time to time with dogs.

Nope.
Keep your dog under control- if it cannot be recalled get it on a lead and keep it on.
Dogs are entitled to go out for a walk without having other dogs up in their face.

Oh, Op. you’re getting a lot of sanctimonious and holier than thou bullshit answers here, but you acted perfectly reasonably in the spur of the moment. Elderly small dogs do not tolerate bigger bouncier dogs getting all up in their business, and it’s understandable as they could easily be hurt, and one of your little old guys was hurt by a big, stupid and clumsy dog. ‘Playfulness’ is not an excuse, a dog may be elderly, have painful arthritis, sight or hearing impairment, a congenital joint problem, a heart problem and a whole host of other reasons why they won’t want a big, lumbering hound being ‘playful’ around them. It’s deeply selfish and inconsiderate to not take this into consideration. This was not a you problem.
The dog obviously had no recall and was poorly socialised, and as a long dog being walked in woodland that is an issue in itself as it could go off after anything, next time it could be a mother deer with a fawn, livestock in a nearby field, a squirrel or rabbit that darts across a road. Dogs need to learn not to be stupid for their own safety.
You did nothing wrong.

OP of course you have every right to keep your dogs safe, but as you've discovered, picking them up doesn't actually achieve that. In principle it makes sense to focus on how you can increase your control and calm down the approaching dog. Picking your dogs up decreases your control because your hands are full, and it teases the approaching dog because the other dogs are just out of reach, so although it's an instinctive thing to do it makes things worse on both counts.

To de-escalate the situation you need to calm down the over excited dog, not increase his arousal. For whatever reason, the dog's owner wasn't doing this, so I would have tried to do it for him.

Could you have have focussed on getting control of the approaching dog? If he was close enough to kick, was he close enough for you to grab his collar? Could you have thrown a handful of treats in his face to distract him? Do you carry a spare lead that you could loop through his collar or round his neck by looping the lead through the handle to make an improvised slip lead? I'm not saying that you should try these with a genuinely aggressive dog but they might well work with one who genuinely just wants to play but doesn't know how to read the signs that your dogs don't.

You did the right thing.
I hate it when people let their dogs off the lead AND THEN HAVE NO CONTROL OVER THEM!!
Then claim that their jumping often biting excitable dog is really harmless!
Your little dogs could be a toddler, baby in pushchair, in the countryside a sheep in lamb or an elderly person who is knocked over and breaks their hip.
If people cannot control their dog/s immediately (and very few people can) the dog should be on a lead.

This dog wasn't aggressive though and even if it was, the advice is the same.

The advice comes from almost all dog behaviourists, trainers and those in the dog world. It's the advice on my local breed clubs page. It's the advice the RSPCA, PDSA Battersea and Dogs Trust give...

It's standard advice that has been offered for decades: do not pick up you dog or child if you are being attacked, or harassed, by another dog. Animal friends say: You should never pick up your dog in an effort to protect them, as this will encourage the attacking dog to leap at you.

You can google if you want to learn more about it.

Personally, I advise heading toward the owner if the dog is aggressive and there's nothing you can do to get it away because chances are if you walk away the dog will follow and then you're putting more distance between the dog and the only person who can control it by putting a lead back on it. Why would you do that? Surely you'd want the dog to return to the person who has its lead? It's pretty logical really.

You were so right to protect your dogs. If you had to use your foot to get the dog away so be it. Over friendly dogs are a nightmare. Mine is over friendly and never of lead around other dogs. Hope you and your dogs are OK.