To have kicked an old man’s dog?

[itsme189]

This morning I was walking my 2 very small elderly dogs on lead in the woods near me where it’s nice and cool for them.

they love people but they don’t love when dogs run up to them and get all in their face, valid I wouldn’t like that either. If a dog on or off lead just walks past or gives them a quick sniff they don’t mind. I always tell people not to let their dogs come right up to them.
Theyve never bitten just growled and I just don’t want to risk anything.

there was an old man walking a large greyhound type dog off lead and he’s miles away from it it runs at us very fast so I stick my leg in front of my dogs and the dog doesn’t stop runs straight into my leg. He then excitedly throws his foot on top of my smallest dog he squeals in pain and my other dog starts growling and showing teeth.

so I picked them up and then the big dogs starts jumping up at me to get to my dogs so I kick it away.

Old man then starts screaming at me for “abusing” his friendly dog and a lady walking passed then said to him “I saw her kick the dog”

and now I don’t know if I did too much but I was so overwhelmed and worried it would become a fight and there’s no way my old boys would do well in that situation. To make it worse the lady made a post about it in our local Facebook group (luckily no pictures) and everyone’s saying awful things but they only know one side!

For the record the dog was not hurt didn’t even squeal!

@itsme189 it sounded from your first post that you held your foot out and the dog ran into your foot. That is not kicking it.

You asked for an alternative, and I would recommend keeping a loose lead in your hand. If a strange dog runs up to you, swing the lead from side to side in front of you, so the the end of the lead goes around your left arm, then back and around your right arm. Don't look the oncoming dog directly in the eye, but stand your ground, try to look like you are paying it no attention. 99% of the time this will stop the oncoming dog.

Lastly, I would try hard not to pick up your dogs. That will teach them there is something to worry about and will likely make them react more strongly than they otherwise might. Tricky though if you believe they might be injured by the oncoming dog, so I understand why you did it.

People seem to think that socialising a dog means letting it meet every other dog on the planet when it really doesn't. It is such a shame when owners allow their dogs to rush up to every dog it meets. Any dog will consider a dog that does that to be rude.

But the dog didn't attack. That would be a lot of dogs getting a kicking if I was to kick every dog that I felt a little bit nervous about. There are so many dogs that do this and no it's not right and it used to make my blood boil at times when I took my baby out in a pram to a park and there would be dogs with their heads getting close to my baby sniffing near my pram but at times it was unavoidable and the dogs need to be on leads near people. But It's not ok to claim the dog could have attacked to give a dog a kick. The man was also at fault.

It’s crazy isn’t it? Some people do actually think that, because they of course know their dogs and their oh so friendly intentions and that they just want to play blah blah.

I got bruises all over my forearm once from a dog simply jumping up. Not an aggressive scary dog, just yet another one with a twat for an owner who didn’t give enough of a shit about other people to keep it under control. Same old same old.

I suspect this has already been said but in the case of a greyhound, it really shouldn't be off lead unless you have trained an absolutely solid recall (which is rare).

TheHungryHungryLandsharks, I doubt there is a parent in the land who would remain calm and walk the aggressive dog back towards it's owner if it was attacking their child. Of course they are going to pick the child up.

If she picked her dogs up in order to protect them from the physical harm the out-of-control larger dog had already done to one of them, and the large dog was jumping up at her trying to get at them, what was she meant to do? Wait until it had succeeded in knocking her over because she had no free hand with which to support herself even if there had been a convenient tree to support herself against? Or use the limb she did have free to keep it away from her and her dogs until its frankly useless owner managed to get his act together to prevent it from assaulting her?

You have every right to protect your dogs, who were on a lead. They're old and vulnerable. He chose to walk his dog off lead and was far away from the incident when it happened so he had no control. This is 100% his fault. Maybe he'll learn to leash his dog in the future.

Ignore the pearl clutches. They'd have done the same thing given the circumstances.

Rubbish. A lot of dogs don't like other dogs running up to them and sticking their face in theirs. My dog is socialised and friendly but he hates dogs doing that. If he is offlead he just runs away but on lead he can't.

Any decent dog trainer/behavourist will say most dogs do not like it

Fine to kick a dog who's attacking you or a person/animal you're in charge of. You did not do too much.

It must be only dog owners who say you must never kick a dog a crime against humanity. I think OP did exactly the right thing - the dog was invading her space.

But you didn't include that in your OP. You went straight from picking them up to kicking the other dog.

Ultimately op, these things are hard to assess without having been there. How high was he jumping, DID you ask the dog to stay down, DID you call to the owner etc, how hard did you kick him , how aggressive was the dog. Was he just enthusiastic etc.

But the way your OP was written - picking your dogs up and kicking the other dog sounds as though you were rather hasty in kicking - esp if the onlooker commented on you kicking it.

He should have been on the lead if he isn't controlled, but that is an issue to convey to the owner, more than kicking the dog.

Smaller dogs especially can feel threatened.

I don't like humans jumping on me!

But I'm still not sure about the kick. It could have been one of several things ...

I see you’re choosing to ignore the point that the OP may have been preventing her dogs from attacking the greyhound in defence?

OP said her dogs are elderly, have been known to growl at other dogs and she asks owners to keep their dogs at a distance.

the owner of the greyhound either didn’t try to recall his dog or the dog didn’t listen, therefore should not be walking off lead.

she didn’t “give the dog a kicking” she kicked the dog as it jumped up at her to reach her dogs. There’s a huge difference there

Is it necessary to add a d in front of the word dog? Abbreviations are meant to make words...shorter, yanno? Not longer....

I agree that there’s not much left you could have done!

The man should have had his dog on lead if it didn’t have instant recall or he wasn’t able to keep up with it. His dog was out of control and that was what caused the issue.

Obviously you shouldn’t be kicking a dog unless you’re left with no option but it’s difficult to react perfectly in the heat of the moment. Perhaps it would be better to have got your hands on the greyhound’s collar rather than using them to pick up your dogs, but then I also realise you would still have needed to hold the leads.

I do know of a greyhound that was killed in non dissimilar circumstances where a person kicked the greyhound to make it back off, so it’s important not to use more force that is necessary. I think there’s a distinction between a push with the foot and a kick, and you should have been going for the former if anything, and calling for the man to control his dog.

The safety of his dog was on the man though because he was nowhere near it to manage the situation.

sigh @Mistymaglets

You really didn't read what I wrote, did you?

I was quoting what OP said about her dogs not liking other dogs beyond a 'quick sniff' and how quickly that toleration can suddenly fray and the real risk OP is putting on her dog every time it happens. I was offering her advice to protect her dogs long term because as long as she keeps allowing interactions (completely separate from this incident) the more she is risking her own dogs.

That advice was separate to my advice about the Greyhound, which I advised on earlier in my comment...

Muzzling her dogs, that are not 100% friendly is the best thing OP can do. It's what responsible owners do all the time, regardless of size or age of the dog. It's also what most trainers would likely recommend.

Separately, the age of OPs dog has nothing to do about this. You're anthropomorphising how dogs interact with each other which does the situation no favours and only highlights your lack of understanding about dogs.

@LancashireButterPie probably not. But it's still the best advice. Whether or not people follow or continue to pick up their children or dogs and thus possibly endanger them more is up to them. 😊

Yes, I've said this further up the thread.

90% of dogs do not appreciate being rushed by uncontrolled effusive dogs.
An excitable/ excited dog is not perceived as happy or playful by others.
It's perceived as unstable and therefore threatening.

A very small percentage of dogs will match the energy. Some will tolerate. Others will lightly correct and some will directly react aggressively to protect their space.

They are dogs , not teddy bears.

I would do exactly the same to protect my dogs. Senior dogs should not have to deal with over exuberant dogs off lead no matter how friendly they are. If you cant get a recall then dont let dogs off lead, simple. It is only courteous to put your dog on a lead when you meet another dog, people and especially children. It wont hurt a dog to be on a lead but it may if he gets into a fight for getting in another dogs space. I think its down to lazy owners not the dog but at the end of the day our dog looks to us to protect them.

Tells you lots about the attitude/stance of the poster though... especially on a thread about an aggressive animal, referring to it as a "ddog"

Don't understand how it would have the chance to be kicked when it was on a lead?

What a strange opinion.

Calling a dog who jumps at strangers and other dogs ‘playful’ is the hallmark of bad dog owners everywhere. See also, ‘oh he’s just being friendly’.

You’ve done nothing wrong here and most people would have done the same thing

I'm choosing to ignore nothing. Please re-read.. the dog didn't attack. It's not ok to kick a dog hastily like that. That's why the woman that witnessed everything was appalled too. Ok if you want to analyse everything I write.. a strong kick can be worse than kicking. But OP never said it was one kick! So kick / kicking, whatever word you want to use 🙄. If you think it's ok to kick a dog hastily as you're nervous, then that's on you. As per my post, I believe of course the dog should have been on a lead.

Another crap owner! Getting a bad name for all dog owners.

I agree, there is not enough detail in the OP for us to say.

Where, for instance, was the kick directed?