To think when the state pension is removed, the social contract is broken?

[JulyJulyNovember]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8e2yp1gg37o

It seems likely that in due course, the universal state pension will be withdrawn. At this point, I don’t see how there will be any incentive for young people to build wealth here.

I don’t think poor pensioners should be homeless, but I don’t think they should be provided for in large, unsuitable council houses or in nursing homes where places cost thousands a week. We are moving to a more individualistic world.

Nobody is going to reduce pensions for existing pensioners - pensioners vote.

It's people who are not yet pensioners who will have vastly reduced years of state pension and pensions with lower real buying power, because younger people vote less often and crucially because people vote on issues they believe are relevant to them today, not in ten or twenty or more years time.

Why has this thread been derailed so regularly by posts having a rant about real or imaginary emotive scapegoats which have nothing to do with pensions?

The issue is the ageing population and the fact that the current way pensions are funded can't support such a large pension age population. This is why the age gets pushed back.

Sorry, are you suggesting i'm imagining that we send millions out of this country?!! It's perfectly relevant seeing as its all related to how tax payers money is being spent.

What would you like to do with them? Leave them to die in the street?

Agree! That’s exactly how I feel.

Well if we can't harvest any organs ....

For the sake of MNHQ this post has been rated "Highly satirical" in line with recent events.

(Last time I posted like this I had a flood of PMs wanting me to stand for Restore.)

Hilarious as well as worrying.

Problem is if the state pension was removed that is what would happen to a significant number of older people and yet most people on this thread seem quite happy with that.

Yes. Worrying isn’t it?

"Decrease the surplus population", to coin a phrase.

Hang on, another incoming PM ....

They're not all the McCarthy ones. There are lots of smaller blocks. One near me is just 18 flats and nothing to do with any "big chain" owners. It's just like any other small block. Service charges etc are pretty reasonable and not really that much more than normal flats as there are no special facilities, no warden, no communal lounges, no on site laundry etc. It's just what would otherwise be normal flats, but planning permission stipulated over 55s. If you didn't know, you'd wouldn't know they were over 55s only.

Nope, no one is suggesting the pension credit is removed which is the "fall back" for those who don't have full state pension.

There should be a worse standard of living for those who refused to work than those who did work. Some form of communal housing. We certainly shouldn’t be paying housing benefit for them to live where they like. That’s too expensive.

It's the same for younger people. There are young professionals living in squalid HMOs because they can't afford flats, yet there are some unemployed who pop out a sprog and get a brand new council/social flat. It's just not right at all.

Working really should be guaranteed to give you a better standard of living than not working, and retired workers should have a better standard of living than those who havn't/barely worked. (Severe disabilities excepted).

Bleeding young people dry how? By expecting them to get a job???

You’re talking utter rubbish. I work with many professionals under 30. None of them live in a squalid HMO, they have all bought their own houses and they all work hard.

Bring back the poor houses I say! Send them down the mines, take their kids off them and force them to eat gruel.

You lose the ability to work long before you get to the point of "severe" disability though. Moderate disability is usually enough to make earning a living impossible. The majority of disabled people I know who are unable to work fall into the moderately disabled category. You don't tend to be eligible for any government support for milder disabilities.

You have to be paying in for a certain amount of time.

The two subjects are unconnected.

Pensions are paid entirely out of the National Insurance contributions of those currently making payments.

Overseas aid is not.

https://ifs.org.uk/publications/challenges-uk-pension-system-case-pensions-review

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/up-rating-report-2026-report-on-the-national-insurance-fund

Multinational profit shifting (tax avoidance by multinational corporations) costs the UK around £14 billion in corporate taxes a year (significantly more than the overseas aid budget every year). In addition to that straightforward tax avoidance costs the economy at least £0.8 billion. https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/measuring-tax-gaps/7-tax-gaps-illustrative-tax-gap-by-behaviour

Overseas aid is only 0.3% of gross national income, compared to 5% directly on state pensions. Additionally 1.5% of gross national income is spent/ lost on tax relief for private pensions (including people earning over 100k who salary sacrifice into their private pensions in order to qualify for means tested benefits).

Overseas aid contributes to stability (there'd be more illegal immigrants fleeing civil war, famine and extreme poverty without it), creates trade and opportunities for British companies, and it s considered politically relevant to keep the UK's dubious status as a global player with a seat at international decision making tables as well as to keep countries considered a threat from stepping in and making struggling countries reliant on them.

You have the wrong scapegoats - try looking up instead of down.

No you don't have to "pay in" a single penny. You can earn "credits" for lots of reasons, i.e.

Being unemployed
During years of child/caring responsibilities
When working part time, earning over the first NIC threshold but below the second at which NIC becomes payable.

People with a mix of all the above at different stages of their "working" life can quite easily get full state pension by virtue of "credits" without actually paying any NIC contributions.

Like a work house kind of thing?

Can I ask where you live? I have two sons, both professionals. Neither of them live in a squalid HMO.

It’s part of the standard made up MN narrative. None of our four kids live in HMOs, three of them are owner occupiers. They’re by no means unusual.

Also house shares (as they used to be rather less emotively called) have always been normal for students and young professionals starting out in expensive cities. I lived in a house share in London for a couple of years in the early '90s, as did most of my university friends who moved to London or other bigger cities after graduation.

Your oldest child is over 50. Nobody is suggesting that 50 year olds are living in HMOs / house shares. How many of your children are actually young professionals just starting out in their career (i.e. those most likely to live in HMOs / house shares)? Given your age, I'm thinking none.