To think when the state pension is removed, the social contract is broken?

[JulyJulyNovember]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8e2yp1gg37o

It seems likely that in due course, the universal state pension will be withdrawn. At this point, I don’t see how there will be any incentive for young people to build wealth here.

I don’t think poor pensioners should be homeless, but I don’t think they should be provided for in large, unsuitable council houses or in nursing homes where places cost thousands a week. We are moving to a more individualistic world.

My original pension age was 60. It's now 68. I really can't see me ever getting a state pension.

I think this would be utterly disastrous

The article is highly misleading. The vast, vast, vast majority of Gen Z don’t have meaningful private pensions. There is not some big generational movement where younger people are so great at saving. They are trying to get by, trying to move out, saving up for a house deposit if there are lucky.

Whoever did this would not be in government very long. Would be similar to poll tax outrage.

I think there’s going to have to be a state pension still, it just won’t be as good as now. Younger generations can’t save much, houses are expensive, childcare expensive, everything is expensive. Most will have a private pension of some sort but it won’t be enough.

This tbf. Neither of my parents made it to 68, and only - grandparent did so I doubt I’ll make it.

It’s already one of the shittest, lowest pensions in Europe.

Well yes why wouldnt they move abroad where they could maybe earn more and build a pension and be able to retire.

obviously uk wastes so much money.
foreign aid/wars etc.

We arent maintaining anything and infrastructure, huge pot holes. Closing schools for heat (even when some have air con..)

But mainly the cost of housing so many people with housing benefits. Locally it is over 2k a month for renting a 3 bed! So 24k a year. But right there is 2 pensions. A housing situation where young cant afford to buy due to ridiculous prices. Then obviously those renters wont have house money for gov to raid for care homes…

I am pro assisted dying. I dont want to live forever. Nor do i want to spend a whole house amount on care home ..

i think better than the 25% tax added to pension contributions would help. As currently most get a state pension so oay tax at 20% on all private pension (excl the 25% of fund). Even if you just gave everyone 40% tax added for a few years.

The high earners can i think put in 40k a year so 16k extra a year going in.

I remember my very sensible Dad saying to me when I started working properly in the early 1990s that I'd be lucky if I got much of a state pension. He's long since dead, but he was not wrong! I'll finally get a state pension when I'm 67 - if they don't change it again, and it won't be something I would want to have to live on. I'm so grateful I heeded his words and paid into personal and work pensions over the intervening decades.

I'm not really sure what constitutes the "social contract" anymore, but I do think at some point we need to decide what kind of country we want to be. Low tax & a free for all like the US or higher tax and better welfare like some of our European neighbours. I suspect I will still be asking those questions when I shuffle off this life in 20-30 years time (if I last that long!).

It’s very good if you add the amount you get to a decent private pension though. People are going to have to see it as a top up rather than their whole income. If anything I doubt the triple lock will stay much longer.

Part of the reason its so low, is the total spent on pensions is also all those who didnt work or have years missing or werent in country and get pension credit up to the amount! And then other benefits like free xyz instead. I dont expect any other cound does that..? Though it will be because the pension is actually really the lowest you could live on so..

And my parents / grand parents lived to late 80s.

Edit hit save too soon
Pensions were designed to help you in your last 2 or 3 years of life, not 30 plus for those who live to be in their 90s.

I think there will still be a state pension. I just don't think it it will be the pot of gold at the end of rainbow it is now.

It is very sensible to have your own pension provision - why be dependent on the whims of others?

So was mine

But you know what we are investing so we can take earlier retirement at 62 because we are where we are and I understand that the state pension is unsustainable as it is, so in order to keep it for everyone we have to raise the age and people can make personal arrangements if they want to stop working earlier.

I don’t see it being totally withdrawn.

i do see the triple lock being abolished, and amount going down and age going up.

the social contract has been fraying for decades

The problem is over population.

The National Insurance Act 1946 ,established a contributory state pension for all citizens.

It set the pension age at 65 for men and 60 for women and was financed through mandatory national insurance contributions from workers.
This act aimed to provide a safety net against poverty in old age, ensuring a basic standard of living for retirees.

However, Life Expectancy in 1946 for men was 72.7 and for women 78.4 so the amount of time that people could enjoy this new payment was 7.7 years for men and 18.4 years for women.

Now life expectancy is 79.1 years for men and 83.0 for women. This is one reason that we have a problem and why the age for claiming a State Pension keeps being raised....

The whole thing is broken. When they set up the pensions after the Second World War, they knew it was an unsustainable situation- not the state pension so much but the public sector private pensions- but those who were adults between about 1975 and 2000 essentially squandered the state’s assets and that wealth has moved into fewer and fewer hands.
The inverted pyramid population that we have means that more and more older people need support from a smaller and smaller working population. The triple lock (necessary when introduced, now really not necessary except for the very poorest, similar to the fuel payment) makes pensions even less affordable.
At the same time the state pension doesn’t really provide enough for people to live on.

And when people say “let’s cut welfare” they usually don’t realise that pensions make up the biggest part of that spend- more than half.

The whole thing needs reconsidering and rethinking, because at the moment it’s not working and it’s costing an unsustainable amount.

(I’m 48 so at the moment can claim my state pension at 68, but I fully expect to be working far beyond that- if I get to that age.)

Yes we’re doing this too, planning to retire at 60 so investing for that. We’re not going to rely on the state pension as who knows what it will be like then, and not going to manage working until 68+.

This, it’s hardly “contributary” if the only people that’ll end up getting it are those who haven’t contributed anything!

I doubt I'll get state pension before 70+. Hope I can at least access my private pension at 60+. Have a tiny S&S ISA which I'm hoping will provide a little support if I want to step back from work before I can access pensions.

But I know I'm lucky to be able to save at all really.

I’m 48 and it’s never occurred to me there’d still be a state pension if I ever retire.

The existing social contract seems to be about bleeding young people dry, destroying their hope and then gaslighting them into thinking it’s all their own fault.

I’d be happy for that to go.

That's Britian today - the less you "contribute" to the country, the more you're "entitled too".

Dh and i reckon will we just move to universal basic income