Inheritance vs helping out

[FizzyPopLove]

My mother died and left her five children her house in her will.

She said for one year, her eldest son, my brother, could continue living in the house. He lived with her when she was alive for a bit of rent. After that one year, it was to be agreed between us five siblings what should be done about the house.

It’s now been seven years. He still lives there rent free. We have not pressured him to leave the house so we can realise our inheritance. Perhaps we should. He has bought out one sibling so he now own 2/5s of the house.

The house is really not looked after. He doesn’t seem to see what needs doing. He is resistant to finding a smaller property that is more suitable for him living alone.

My ds has found a job in the same city as the house and I thought it might be a good idea for him to stay in the house too for six months whilst he passes his probation period, saves up some money etc. My brother is reluctant to enable this. He’s worried ds will stay for longer than 6 months. It’s a 3 bed house.

AIBU to be cheesed off? He’s saved up thousands of pounds by not paying rent or a mortgage and the rest of us siblings have all paid mortgages or rent for all of our working lives.

We have been really not pushy about realising our inheritance but I feel he could be open to helping out ds1 in this way?

Of course you're annoyed, most people would be. Could you approach him along the lines of you want to support your son and so if it's not convenient for him to stay in your mother's house you'd like him to sell or buy you out so you can support your son financially. Unbelievable he's not willing to give to his nephew the same advantage that he's been enjoying. I would write him a letter and copy your siblings in on the letter. He's taking the piss, I guess he thinks of it as his house. It could get complicated the longer he lives there with your siblings inheritance etc. Good luck

This is a complicated mess of a situation.

You as the co owner have the right to live there, but your adult son is a third party and does not have that right. You could invite your son to stay, but then your brother would also be free to lock him
out the first time he leaves the property.

If there isn’t consensus between the siblings, then you’ll need to pursue obtaining your share legally.

How do you know they will get on? Bro has been living there alone for years. Could get messy.
You and your siblings arguably have a right to move in but DS doesn't. Better to get the house sold.

It’s reasonable for you to charge him rent. It’s reasonable for you to want to sell up. It’s reasonable to want him to buy you out if he won’t sell.

It’s NOT reasonable to insist upon moving another adult into a 69 year old’s home against his wishes, just because you’re part-owner but haven’t previously acted upon that and when you’ve given him the impression for 7 years that you’re fine with the current arrangements.

It is very hard to insist on him leaving . We had similar in that the remaining son never lived anywhere else and was there in the house when his mother was elderly. Everyone was then glad that he was there .

I think your mother was probably hoping that you all would just allow him to stay there . Realistically, unless he has huge savings , it's unlikely he would find anywhere to live with his fifth of property.

I think regards your son , that I would point out how much it would help him and that you would appreciate it . Your son wouldn't be around too much as he would be at work . Assure him it's a short term thing as I am sure your son does not want to stay any longer than necessary. If you belabour the fact that you have a share in it , he could get stubborn. BTW if your siblings are well off , why didn't he buy out your share of the house ?

The Will should specify who benefits from the estate.

If it says you are one of them you can force the sale of the property.
It cannot be made for you not to benefit from the Will.

I would not let this carry on much longer.

Either your son stays there. Or he starts paying you 1/5th of the market rent for the property that you can put towards your son’s rent elsewhere.

Of course. More sensible than DS just rocking up with his bags one day!

On the family harmony point, I think it's worth pointing out that there probably isn't any way of dealing with this that isn't going to strain it. After all, if you decide to continue with the status quo, you're probably going to feel pretty fucked off about your son having to pay rent in a city where you have a right to occupy a home you part own. With both DB and the other sibling owners.

To that end, I don't know if I'd be putting a 6 month cap on it either.

Yes but he has been repaid for that by not having rent for the last 7 years!!

I think you need to involve your other siblings.
Dear rich siblings, I hoped DS would be able to stay with brother for 6months whilst working his probationary period in new job. Brother has refused point blank. I don’t want to force the issue & put DS in an unpleasant living situation, so that means I need my share of the inheritance from the house so I can help DS out. Would you two want the property sold or prefer to buy my share? Brother says he can’t afford to buy me out, so it’s either sold or one/both of you buy me out. How should we proceed?

It’s foolish to support your brother to live rent free whilst your own DC struggles. Surely the rich siblings will understand that?

OP you can't be forced into a co-ownership indefinitely to the benefit of your brother.

The average yearly cost of rent is £16,000 per year. Your brother will have saved on average £100K living rent free in the house for 7 years. That's absolutely mental.

I'd point that out to your sibling and your brother, whilst highlighting how utterly selfish he is to complain about you wanting to give DS a helping hand whilst he's save an absolute fortune.

That would be enough for me to take legal action to force a sale.

The thing about a Will is that it is a legal document. It has to be executed as the Will says.
You cannot imagine what you think it should say or intended to say. You have to do what it says.
If the Will is unclear in the wording ; whoever was the executor should have obtained legal advice as to how to proceed.

This is a bit of a mess. Sorry OP. It is not just a family matter. It is a legal one.

I assume the Will was done via a Solicitor ? Not a self done version ?

I think you need to get the house back as soon as possible. If he has lived there 7 years undisturbed to do so you’re getting close to him having an ‘adverse possession’ claim and getting the whole lot. Engage solicitor and estate agents and push through a sale however you need to.

Sorry op your db is not helping with family relations anyway. If he had to pay rent elsewhere even as low as 500 a month he’s saved himself over 40k in 7 years he’s taking all of you for a ride. Look at your mortgage payment since this will was to start from you are all being really soft with him you should tell your other siblings they can agree to leave him there but you need the money now and you want it. Your mum didn’t want this otherwise she would have just left him the whole house. He’s literally laughing all the way to the bank.

Gather all your siblings together, mutually agreed to sell the house and give the proceeds to The Cats Protection.

Wills need to be unambiguous and clear, exactly for this reason. The wishy washy wording of your mother...I would be annoyed that she had left you in this mess.

What did she think would actually happen? That an ageing man who lives rent free would gladly waltz out of the door of his home in order to make his own situation worse, to pay out his wealthy siblings?

Agree, I think OP has to start from the premise that the current level of family relations probably isn't sustainable. Time is going to further pass, owners children will be old enough to benefit from house deposits, owners might themselves have care costs not that far away if one sibling is 69, meanwhile the property isn't being well maintained.

The most sensible solution seems to be your wealthier siblings buy you out and let DB continue to live there. Explain to siblings you don't want to see DB out on his ear but you do own a 1/5 share and have been more than leniant letting DB live there rent free for the past 6 years. Unfortunately the time has now come that your son needs to live somewhere and he's either moving or you need buying out so you can help him get on the property ladder/rent somewhere.

I think this is far more likely to happen than DB ever leaving or being receptive to his young nephew moving in.

What has he been saving up for all these years of rent free living? If it wasn't to move out, or to do wonderful things to the house then surely this means he has improved his standard of living at a cost to the rest of you?

DB-DS is moving in on this date. Or we can start talking about selling the house so that I can give him my share to buy somewhere for himself.

Heh DB.. DS will be moving in at the end of June. He is looking forward to sharing with you.

(End of conversation.. )

If pushed.. I have a 20% share in the house, you have had sole use of it for the past 6 years, it is reasonable that my family also get to use it. .. maybe we should see about selling it so that I can use that money ...

You can always buy me out.. or convince Sib1 or Sib2 to buy me out if they can and if they are happy to continue to share the house with you in the way you have for the past 6 years..

Oh.. you want him to pay rent? Let's work out how much that should be, how much you owe and to whom...

YANBU - it is totally fair enough to expect your brother to help out when he's had free run of a jointly inherited property for 7 years!
It isn't his house (even though I'm sure it must feel like it is by now) and he should be recognising that by helping out in the very minimal way he is being asked to help out!

The problem is your in a minority
3 out of the 4 owners aren’t bothered
why don’t you ask your brother to buy you out

This happened in my IL's family, right down to one of the other grandchildren staying in the house while studying. The occupant was informed rather than asked that their nephew was going to be staying there... (they actually ended up forming a close bond), and when the grandparents passed away, the other siblings (after a couple of years' grace) initiated the sale process.
Like my ILs, you have been more than reasonable. He's a grown man who has had years to sort himself out, and he's known it's coming. My ILs did offer their sibling a lot of practical help to find a new place, and to move out. But YANBU to want to sell your part of the house.

It seems to me that you just want to let this go and not claim your inheritance. I find this an odd position particularly when you have children to look after as well but I guess in your family culture there is no drive for family justice.

I would not be able to endure the unfairness of the position and would want my inheritance. I would be polite, thoughtful but very firm and back it up with legal advice.

I think sending your son to live in the house with a hostile DB sounds not nice for your son. How much better to have some money from your share of the house to be able to set your son up? But it will all probably take time and maybe your son is thick skinned and can manage co-habiting.

Your brother will do nothing willingly and will bark like a defensive dog if requests are made. He will cling on. You need your other siblings to act with you.

If they are well off can one of them buy you out?