To think telling a child to "cover up" because of male teachers is ewwww?

[FreeeeeeeeFreeFalling]

DD and her mates were wearing fairly standard vest tops at school for an own clothes day. All dressed exactly the same. DD singled out and told to cover up (I suspect because she is slightly larger chested than the others), which she found humiliating. She was told "there are male teachers around" as the reason!
They are 16.
I kind of think if male teachers can't keep their eyes to themselves, they shouldn't be teachers, right?!

AIBU to think this is a bit off?

Not in my workplace. I've seen someone sent home to change from a vest top - a man, incidentally - clothes that are too revealing are not acceptable for either sex.

You should absolutely complain about the teacher who said that.

It's misogyny clear and simple - your daughter, a child, has been made responsible for the potential predatory behaviour of adult males who are also bound by the position of trust they hold.

It's victim blaming in advance.

I totally get that in some workplaces you have a dress code, but not in all. And this was a non-uniform day. The op has not stated any guidance was given of what to wear or not. And people are simply saying ‘it’s not approapriate’, that is what I am arguing. Not whether she broke school rules or not 🤦‍♀️

I think telling girls to dress more 'professionally' is fine, but using men as the reason is really grim. People get outraged at all men being painted as perverts, yet this is the message children are being sent.

I bet the OP would be the first one on to the school to raise a complaint if her daughter came home saying a male teacher was leering at her.

I feel sorry for male teachers. It must be a minefield these days.

How often do teenagers get to ‘make a stand’? Fair enough if she has used one of her few opportunities to do so, more likely she just thought she looked nice.
And I absolutely think mumsnet is the perfect place for me to ‘take a stand’ on this issue. Call out outdated norms, ask other to question them and articulate my point. So no, I have not missed the point, but I suspect you may have.

And she would have every right to do so! No matter what her daughter wears

Jesus christ. Poor adult men, not knowing its wrong to gawp at children.

When I was in year 8 I wore a short skirt to school because I was a kid and thought I was being grown up. My male history teacher who was only a decade older than us made a big song and dance out of it in class and asked the “cool girl” in the year if she’d dare wear a skirt like mine to which she obviously sneered and said “of course not” … I was completely
mortified. He then asked if I was worried about boys looking up it on the stairwell.

Looking back it was super super weird and made me deeply uncomfortable at the time. You’re right to be concerned here OP, I think it’s gross. I recommend the song Above the Neck by Sofia Isella as a side note, it explains precisely the dilemma women and girls under the male gaze constantly find themselves in.

Poor men struggling not to be paedophiles.

Well obviously, many school rules are hard and fast ones because they previously had more leeway and kids took the piss so a blanket rule that’s clear to everyone and easy to understand (for students, parents and teachers) are brought in.

Because “smart casual” ended up with scruffy and/or overly revealing clothing, most moved to insisting on suits over the last 15-20 years. Everyone knows where they stand with “suit”.

Luckily both my dcs schools still have own clothes days, but 2 local secondary schools have stopped them altogether.

Struggling not to get accused of being a paedophile because they glanced at a girl with her boobs out.

I’m not a man and I don’t want to teach anyone whose underwear is on show, breasts are on show, midriff is on show, regardless if they are male or female,

I think its more about the fit. A well fitting vest shouldnt show anymore cleavage on a bigger busted girl than a well fitted vest on a smaller chested girl - but unfortunately some girls with bigger busts wear things that are basically too small for them because they want it to look fitted on their waist and hips and as a result it's too small on the bust area and showing a lot of cleavage.

Could it be OP that a bigger size vest that can accommodate a bigger bust without ending up with inches of cleavage on show is the answer?

I've got a big bust and do need to wear a bigger sized vest.

It must be difficult not to look at a child’s breasts, yes.

I sincerely doubt any school is going to take a single girl saying this once too seriously (yes, they’ll investigate, but there won’t be much evidence). If multiple girls are saying this, I’d say there is a teacher problem, not a false accusation issue.

Remembering what it was like at school, I think left to their own devices with no oversight, many girls would wear completely inappropriate clothing for non uniform or even uniform day. Most schools have to tell girls to unroll their skirts on a regular basis and my understanding is this has been happening for decades.

So yeah school kids need to be told to make their outfits appropriate.

Not fair to single your daughter out though.

I agree and my DC’s school has a no crop top/no mini skirt / no mini shorts sort of rule which is fine but it isn’t to stop leering old men staring at them ffs.

So no swimming for girls because....male teachers? This is appalling OP ...if you see children as sexual temptation you shouldn't be teaching.

Controlling your attraction to someone is not something that the person being looked at is responsible for...

Young men with trousers slipping around their hips, visible knickers, ...nope no reaction in me ..because I don't have a sexual attraction for children

Agreed. I teach adults but they’re 18-22 usually and not even remotely attractive to me, still like kids really. If a man can’t help but stare at a child’s body, well we have a word for that.

But you’re not making the stand you seem to think you are.

A quick Google shows that many US high schools don't allow revealing tops (including vest tops)

I think a lot of people are missing the point that these are not professionals in an office, they're teenagers and teenagers like to push boundaries!

I frequently roll my eyes on own clothes day- boobs (bralette style tops worn with zip up hoodies over) bums (Nike pro shorts) and bellies (crop tops). Would I ever comment? No! Some of the parents will know how their children are dressed, some of them will not.

The majority of my colleagues - male or female- are the same. We're at work because we enjoy teaching teenagers (well most of us). I have heard this insidious attitude of cover up for the males though and I hate it - it does a major disservice to the boys and the male teachers and it reinforces a bloody patriarchal mindset of men controlling women.

In an ideal world women would wear what they want without it being critiqued. It would also be ideal if it was situation appropriate 🤣 but teenagers are navigating new systems and trying to find their places and I don't think two days a year for own clothes day is a problem.

Incidentally, I have no problem saying to girls to be careful if they're bending over to open a window and something is on display, or to pull their skirt down because it's caught in their blazer- they typically respond well to this because they know it's not coming from a place of judgement.

Jesus some of the comments on here. It's a vest top, not a bralet. Not a corset. A vest top.

I have massive boobs (double G 😭) and had big boobs growing up. Unfortunately when your boobs are that large, everything looks very top heavy and looks more revealing than it should. A vest top isn't revealing, so I don't get some of the comments. Also having the tops of your arms out isn't revealing. We're not Victorian. I thought vest tops usually cover everything? If you're larger chested, you may naturally have some slight clevage, but it's literally part of your body. We should be allowed to exist in our bodies without feeling bad or worrying about men's feelings. I'm a lesbian, and I somehow survive without feeling uncomfortable or acting pervy no matter what someone is wearing.

If a man can't cope seeing a woman in a vest top, they have no business stepping foot outside.

The Teachers have the problem.then with attitude,My mum/Dad says whilst trying to keep some semblance of order so they can teach.