To think some older women having tax payers funded ivf are hypocrites?

[Spiderbug]

There seems to be a substantial group of people who are ok with calling teen mums a waste of their tax money but then leave child bearing too late and expect the tax payers to foot the bill for their multiple ivf cycles which costs the tax payer up to 100 million a year.

Hypocrites!!!

How many times are you going to say "im happy" we believe you!! You are happy!! Well done you! Kudos!!😆😂

Sorry my mistake it wasn’t you it was @SerenaCat93 who called my job crappy. I mixed you up with someone else and tbh I think you’ve mixed me up with someone else I haven’t said anything hateful.

This is totally different scenario for one thing I know people who excelled at exams by cramming at the last minute . My sister read her entire chemistry book the day before what would be the equivalent of our A levels and got an A1 after doing no study. Besides what If someone has factors that prevent them from studying such as difficulties and home , not being in a position to study etc. these people are often allowed to defer their exams . Etc etc . I could go on forever about your stupid pointless metaphor that has nothing to do with having children at all!

I think the type of cosmetic work is quite curtailed, as IVF has been. And that’s fair in lots of cases. But nobody is or ever was getting a ‘boob job’ because they just fancied it, so all the PPs comparing IVF to that are foolish, and I you comparing the two seemed to be playing into the same narrative, that the only psychological pain that matters is not having children. Maybe I misunderstood you.

I mean how many times am I going to be accused of being bitter and jealous of people who went to university?
By someone who obviously doesn't keep up with current events or they’d know many graduates can’t even get a minimum wage job let alone the career they were hoping for.

just to be clear I’ve never had primary infertility and I have 2 kids so I don’t know why you think I’m in pain or why you think I think my “pain” is greater than others . I don’t . I’m not advocating that funding for cosmetic surgery should be pulled so I don’t know where you get the idea I’m lacking in empathy .

Of course I don’t know anything about your life, you’re a stranger on the internet. Just like you don’t know the ins and outs of the lives of people you say ‘deliberately delayed until they ran out of viable eggs’.

I don’t know why you’re so desperate for an answer to your analogy. I’ve already said I think it’s inane and I couldn’t care less if people study for their exams or not, moan about them or not. Just like I have no interest in what age people choose to procreate. It’s irrelevant to me. And should be to you.

I’ve no idea of your child bearing circumstances obviously, but this very much sounds like you think the pain of not having children is greater than others, given that you’re dismissing the idea that cosmetic surgery might lessen people’s psychological pain.

‘Wanting bigger boobs or whatever isn’t the same as the pain of longing to become a mother and not being able to.’

Great. But I’m sure you will see that many people using these drugs for non-clinical reasons do end up seeking NHS treatment. And that’s ok, because that’s what we all pay for.

It’s not though . I stand by what I said . I am not the one advocating for funding to be pulled for the type of cosmetic surgery you have suggested . Which would be funded here in Ireland . Brazilian butt lifts and boob jobs aren’t funded . And I wouldn’t put ivf in the same category as that . Is that not quite simple for you to understand

Since you have no idea of my circumstances you shouldn’t be suggesting I am in “pain “ or lacking empathy then

That posters analogy is apt for SOME people. There’s a certain type who do insist their 20s and even early 30s are for partying, sniffing coke, sleeping around, building their career etc and see late 30s as the ideal time they want children when it’s not always possible. Then they resent younger mums accuse them of all being benefit scroungers etc

Of course there are people who have been trying for a baby for years and have endometriosis PCOS etc. but denying the above type of person also exists is pretty silly.

I don’t think I did suggest you were talking about yourself to be honest, ‘your’ generic. But your post did seem lacking in empathy, which is why I found it odd for you to criticise others for that. As a said a couple of posts ago, maybe I misunderstood.

I see what you mean - yes, overall I'd have more reservations! I'm glad society has moved on from that.

But my point remains that adoption isn't the straightforward alternative to having bio children that some people make it out to be. It's a completely different (and very valuable) thing to be able to do.

I’m not suggesting that you are, but you appeared to be trivialising cosmetic surgery with the ‘boob job’ trope. Equally, unsure why that’s not clear but also much less interesting in engaging with you now so let’s drop it.

No there are also perfectly normal people who aren’t going around sniffing coke who are just single , or studying , or experiencing the world by travelling. I think it is a disgrace to women to say that women should just have babies in their 20s in this day and not be offered anything if they cannot. when the vast majority can still get pregnant in their late 30s . The reason why ivf is still offered until 40 is because the vast majority can still get pregnant before then . I woudnt class getting pregnant at 16 as the equivalent of studying for an exam in any way shape or form. I’ve nothing against teen mums but it’s not something I think should be advocated for in general. Do you ?

The more I read your posts OP the more I think you need to seek a therapist. You seem to have a serious chip on your shoulder and unresolved issues about how you felt you were treated.

Your rant is unfairly targeting women who have to seek IVF, university students/graduates, women over 30 are apparently over the hill and old and career women.

Honestly you still sound 15 maybe ask yourself why your getting so angry and upset at what you see as your injustice and work through that for your sake.

I never needed IVF but have had friends who went through years of struggles your attitude is frankly disgusting. Oh and I became an "old mum" at 32 and 35 for my children and a university graduate who needed my degrees for my work. Infact I'm one of the few in my job without a PhD.

Oh give over would you . You did suggest it. And you are going on a pointless tangent over it not me.

You have a point, Amazing.

It starts falling at 30 and really drops off a cliff at 35 these are biological facts if someone wants to spend years partying, travelling, studying etc good for them but expecting the tax payer to foot the bill for ivf while simultaneously complaining about teenage mums costing the taxpayer money.

It’s like these people have zero self awareness or introspection. Being judged for not having a job at 18 because I had a child by someone who also didn’t have a job at 18 because they were studying with a loan given to them by the government that they don’t have to pay back unless they earn over a certain amount. And with the current unemployment crisis among graduates less and less of them will be paying back their loans.

But you need to understand that there are also some (not all) young mothers who intentionally become a single mum and intend to live on the state and then have another child when the benefit system says they need to return to work. I have a family member who had no other dream than to be a mum and at 16 she succeeded and went on to have 4 kids by three different Fathers. She is 52 now and has managed never to work a day in her life.

Then there are many women who fall pregnant whilst young and single due to their unexpected situation, that's different.

Of course there are some, women who have chosen not to have a child until its too late for no other reason than their clock didn't tick until it was too late. Equally there are many women who didn't find a suitable partner and don't advocate being a single parent and others who have health reasons why they could not conceive.

But you are making it sound very common for older women to leave it too late by choice and its not.

You are contradicting yourself with a competition about who costs the state more when you have cost the state more than such women yourself . Did you decide to get pregnant out of some noble decision to not need ivf when older in case it cost the state ? Did you plan it because you are a pillar of society who didn’t want to burden the state with your infertility later in life ? Nah.. didn’t think so. Seems to me here like this might be a case of someone who “studied for exams “ resenting people who cram at the last minute and end up with the same result as them in the end .. just to shake that metaphor up at bit

I'm not disputing that teenagers who get pregnant face abuse. But you specifically said that older women who were abusing such teenagers were turning to IVF.

Perhaps you could provide evidence of that...

Of course, and I agree, so silly when people say ‘just adopt or foster’ without any real idea of what that looks like.

It starts falling at 30 and really drops off a cliff at 35

I think it’s great that, despite the challenges of being a teenage mum, you went on to become a fertility expert… oh no wait, that’s not quite right…

Fertility doesn’t ’drop off a cliff’ it’s a gradual decline. Even with the most rudimentary education it’s obvious that dropping of a cliff - like so - 📉 would mean nothing happened after it. In 2024, women aged 35–39 were the fastest-growing maternal age group in 2024. Less than 8% were assisted conception. Less than 12% of births to women aged 40-45 are assisted conceptions.

So if the cliff is anywhere, it’s after 45, but even then…