To think compulsory national service for young people could be helpful for many?

[Jane379]

The recent thread on benefits generational cycle got me thinking...could compulsory national service period help some young people, including ones like these?

Or would it make things worse?

I've never yet seen a compulsory national service proposal that adequately deals with, or even acknowledges, the Northern Ireland situation.

Not to mention how many inter generational benefit claimants are there? You can’t just decide working isn’t for you and that’s that for life.

Yanbu

But

Little Timmy is autistic/ADHD/asd/anxious

Etc.etc

Oh I would have hated this. I did 2 jobs whilst I was doing my A levels, so it wasn't like i was afraid of hard work, but would I fuck as like have done national service. I didn't like having my time dictated to.

I'm not actually sure who'd do it, either. About 40% of all the classes I teach have diagnosed, under investigation or should be adhd/ autism/ anxiety/ emotional difficulties. Would they all have to do it? Or would it fall on the other kids?

And I think I've read that NS didn't work for many kids, back in the day, as too many of them were ill equipped or just too arsey.

France has a notably higher unemployment rate at 8.1% than the UK's 4.9%. The US's 4.3% is not that far off ours.

150,000 houses were built in the UK last year. Construction in other areas such as infrastructure (eg HS2) and energy (eg Hinckley Point, windfarms etc) is also continuing.

The UK's manufacturing and construction industries are roughly comparable to France's. Which, let me remind you, kills THREE TIMES AS MANY WORKERS as we do.

Any other bullshit claims you want to throw out?

This!

This sounds like a good idea. Might I ask what country this was? I understand if not.

Voluntary programmes could be a decent idea, if we did them properly.

I will respond to the rest of this tomorrow, these are important points...need to go to bed now..

But for now : as pp said, Sweden, Greece, Denmark, Norway, Cyprus have national service. Why would it have not worked well for Britain in the past? What makes us different?

 There may be valid reasons why it would work for them and not us, I'll think about this more tomorrow.

People with genuine conditions should be accommodated. The question is how many are genuine?

It's hard to know as there could be valud reasons many have increased (older paternal & maternal age, EDCs to name two) but there could also be potentially large numbers who do not actually have anxiety..

150,000 houses is nothing we need millions - we have thousands of people on long term benefits rather than unemployed so would not appear in the figures
added -I don’t know why you are so agitated about the points I have made -my initial post was about my friend who couldn’t afford to take on a trainee due to the cost of insurance -he was an antique furniture restorer - chances of death whilst at work are quite low there I should imagine

Agree, the hypocrisy of trying to enforce something on young people that you never had to do yourself. I'm in my 40s and think life is so much more stressful for young people now than it was for me, with fewer opportunities. Young people need opportunities for reasonably paid employment and affordable housing, not national service.

Of those 5 countries, 1 has a border with Russia, 1 is too close for comfort and 1 got invaded and had a chunk of their territory occupied not very long ago, so in terms of differences that's a pretty big one. If your population think being invaded is a realistic threat, of course that colours how they feel about the compulsory national service.

Yes we should have this - as in other countries -

I do think it would be good for some, less good for others, but I think there are some kids who would benefit from being away from their families and learning to be responsible, unfortunately it would put other young people who want to go to university and then start families back a year and the age at which people can afford to marry and have children is already rising.

Great ! Then do it.

This is a good point...

Agree, the hypocrisy of trying to enforce something on young people that you never had to do yourself.

It is hilarious, and also let’s put the poorer people out there, mould them into what we want to be. I know you don’t automatically mean army but as someone who’s dated someone from the army and met a lot of his tightly wound colleagues, I wouldn’t assume they’ll become better people

Might you elaborate on this? I have recently been researching NI but shamefully didn't consider that angle on this...

'put the poorer people out there, mould them into what we want to be. '

• It's not 'poorer people' I'm referring to but people locked in a generational cycle of dependence on benefits (without work). I agree army can have negative mental health effects though...agree also with pps that national service program should include options other than military.

An optional national service programme for 16-20 year olds lasting 12 months initially with an option to enlist for a further year could be a good idea but it must be optional and paid.

Do you have a basic understanding of how universal credit works OP?

What If we go to war? Your kids can go first yeah?

This. I'm a former secondary school teacher and couldn't agree more.

National service could give young adults purpose, structure and discipline with a sense of feeling like a part of the community and making a difference. A friend in Germany many years ago drove a school bus for SEN children so it doesn't have to be military. However, this is unfair for those who want to progress with their lives and don't actually need it to learn the above skills.

It shouldn't be a replacement for poor parenting.

Well go join the territorial army and come and report back, until then leave my sons and daughters alone . (I don't belive for one second you will and you know you won't)