To exclude sibling from wedding due to their lifestyle choice?

[Salitnan]

This will be incredibly identifying to anyone who knows my family and quite controversial but it’s such a bloody niche situation that nobody can relate to and it’s hugely stressing me out. I’m not writing this as ragebait or to troll, it is a genuine situation I am dealing with.

I’m getting married next year. My partner of 5 years is from a very traditional, right-wing Eastern European country. My partner however is very tolerant and chill, as are most of his immediate family who also live in Western countries.

We’ve decided to get married in his home country, as it’s very affordable there and we can have a beautiful package in an area of outstanding natural beauty, and he can invite his dear godparents who he adores (and they adore him) who are scared of flying.

This is all well and good but one of my family members is presenting an issue. My brother (who is an adult in their mid-20s) has a learning disability. This is not a problem, but in the past year they have come out as transgender. This has been a massive struggle for us as there were no signs previously and it came out of nowhere, and they have insisted they are going ahead with the transition and they self-harm if anyone misgenders them or politely reminds them of etiquette in public places regarding toilets, or wearing appropriate clothing for a social situation etc. It has been extremely hard work for my aging parents, he lives with them full time. The learning disability alongside being transgender makes them massively vulnerable and they get stared at in public and often started on when in the city centre by lads, and they aren’t aware of their vulnerability. They insist on dressing incredibly provocatively (wig and heels, provocative clothes) as they say they feel insecure otherwise, and when I have tried to explain to them that women don’t necessarily dress like that, they self-harm. They insult people in public, not to their face, they will say it to my mum (will whisper in her ear “he looks like a twat”), but sometimes people have overheard and started on him and my mum has had to explain about his disability and fend them off.

I’m already in therapy to deal with complex feelings towards them from how they dominate my parents lives and how I felt neglected as a child due to the focus on them and their vulnerabilities. The recent coming out as transgender has brought up a lot of old resentment I had towards him which I had buried, and I’m trying to have the therapy so that I can have a bond with him going forward, but I can’t help but feel a sort of anger at him, and I hate myself for it.

Back onto the wedding topic - I’ve realised I simply don’t want them at the wedding. My fiancé’s family are nice people and wouldn’t be a danger to my brother but many of my fiancé’s extended family members are from a small isolated village in a Catholic Eastern European country and he will be stared at like a hawk, whispered about. To he quite frank he will stick out like a sore thumb with his clothes and hair. As awful as it sounds I will be embarrassed by him and on edge, and won’t be able to enjoy my day. My partner says he’ll notify everyone in advance that my brother will be there and what to expect but I just really can’t be doing with the stress of it all. It’s not just family it’s the the staff in the hotel, other members of the public around who might be drinking, and they will need to stay in the country a few days around the ceremony so lots of opportunity for things to go wrong. They have severe social anxiety due to their learning disability and have been known to sneak alcohol as a way to deal with this and this further increases their vulnerability as they lose their filter and say their mind in front of people.

I did try to compromise and said to my mum I’d be happy to have them if if they would be willing to tone down their dress in order to come to the wedding - dropping the wig and toning down their clothes, but they have become angry at this suggestion and have refused.

I’ve told my mum it may be the case that I can’t invite them, and therefore my parents can’t come either as they are his carers. My mum says she understands and we can have a do later on back in the UK.

I just want my day to not be dominated by him. I also don’t want to have to change the wedding plans that me and my partner are happy with just to suit him. Am I an awful person?

The authorities will not take over the care of this man . He can function in the real world but chooses not to . Presumably he can buy womens clothes and go out OK. What can the authorities actually do ? There is no help for people who really need support . The most he would get would be signposting to LGBT XXXX support groups .

You are all hyping this up endlessly.....very traditional, very catholic, my future in law, my brother bla bla. Sign your marriage papers and start your married life and chill out.....it is all about drama queen feelings

The drama llama being the brother!

Exactly this. Sooner or later your mum is not going to be there as his carer, so why not try to make it sooner so she can relax in her later years. Are Soc Services involved? They need to be, and your parents need to say honestly that they can't cope with his behaviour any more. It’s no good saying he won’t let anyone else be his carer - it’s not all up to him.

Maybe he can even make a start by going into respite care while your parents go to your wedding. I appreciate that he won’t want to, but I don’t see why his preferences should be allowed to dictate the lives of everyone else.

Absolutely this!

It’s dangerous to even consider it.

I’d have 2 smaller celebrations in both countries and invite half of the family to each one.

I really feel for you OP.

Have your wedding free from the stress of your sibling.

I would have a small celebration with your parents and sibling at home.

But I would also be having a very clear conversation with your parents that you cannot and will not take responsibility for them when they are no longer able, and - regardless of whether they agree to respite care, the long term reality for them is in some sort of supported living.

The sooner that your parents say they can't cope and steps are put in place to facilitate this, the better. Then your parents can have some quality of life, you can have a better relationship with your parents, and probably your sibling, once things have settled down.

Because a 6 ft 2 heavily built person with brain damage who can be violent and unpredictable needs specialist care. Not your parents. Not you.

I have three children with SEND and although they manage life with support, I worry constantly about their futures. But it's not anyone else's responsibility except mine. (Dad not in the picture).

If I thought they would be better in a supporting living facility I would be putting steps in place so it was a gradual and positive transition, rather than something that might have to happen in extremis. If one of your parents became seriously ill, for example.

Until you live in a situation it's very easy to say statements like "you should accept them at your wedding". I understand why you wouldn't want to have them there. 🤗

This is a common suggestion on mn. Thing is, most kind and inclusive people do tend to consider close family and their needs to. Particularly with LD and disabilities.

'Your parents may well understand, and no doubt they've had a lifetime of being left out and having to miss things because that's the shit reality of being a full time carer for somebody very vulnerable. But that doesn't mean they aren't incredibly upset'

Agree, they'll be resigned to it. No doubt bewildered and hurt but of course will grin and bear it as they'll be well used to doing.

So sorry you are faced with this dilemma. You and your soon to be DH are the most important people, everyone else is a witness/bystander. Have the day you want and live stream to your parents.

I suggest you have a blessing and meal with everyone who couldn't be with you on Your day on returning home.

The brother, whether it's due to his condition or not, seems to have no comprehension of anyone else's point of view or feelings, or has any notion that there even are any. Add his lifestyle choices to that, and you simply can't bring him into traditional, conservative, right leaning company. It would be utterly disastrous.

He sounds incredibly manipulative and fully aware of what he is doing when he self harms in front of you. Can you walk away when he does it and say something like do what you want to yourself but that's the fact/I'm not changing my mind etc depending on the situation? This sounds like a complete nightmare. And since it's such a burden on your parents and making them miserable, is there any way they can surrender him to state care and refuse to take him back into their home? I don't mean to sound harsh but that may be the only answer, that or assisted living for him in an assisted living community. Regarding the wedding, I would suggest you simply elope. You simply cannot have him there, as you very well know, and it would be unfair and unthinkable for neither of your parents to be at your wedding. Eloping or a registry wedding with no guests may be the only fair and equitable solution, even if it's not what you want.

I know that anything trans related tends to be a hot button topic on MN, so I am a bit hesitant to respond. But giving you the benefit of the doubt@SalitnanI would say that embarrassment may be the least of your concerns. Depending on the country, your sibling could be in genuine danger, either from the local population or potentially from the legal authorities. For that reason, I would not include them in the wedding for their own good. Don't minimise the potential danger.

It's okay to prioritise yourself sometimes, OP. Your parents will have to understand that while they may allow your brother to rule every aspect of their lives, you don't have to follow suit.

You can't be comfortable with your sibling there, and as you say, your mother wouldn't be able to fully relax and enjoy the occasion while keeping an eye on him, anyway.

Plenty of people have more than one wedding celebration. There's nothing strange about it, especially in marriages between people with family in different countries.

In the larger picture, I'd want to make it perfectly clear to your parents (if it's not already) that you won't be sacrificing your own happiness to care for your brother, so they need to plan accordingly and make adjustments now. Your mother won't be physically able to care for him forever, so it would be kinder to make some changes now when it can be done gradually rather than waiting for a moment of crisis when there are limited options available.

The brother with a brain injury and LD is a drama lama?

Stop mis-gendering them! They are a layyyy-dee (c). Little Britain

...and this, folks, is why post-Soviet countries are not rushing to embrace Western "culture." It's not all about the joys of McDonald's and consumer choice!

It wasn’t difficult to understand.

I assume your comprehension skills aren’t the best as everyone else managed to understand it perfectly fine.

Basically:
OPs DB has LD and is now trans and dresses very OTT.
OP’s wedding is in an area that this is not accepted.
The family are too poor to go to England, so the wedding has to be there.
OPs parents cannot come alone as DB needs someone to look after him.
They will not use respite, as DB harms himself (and potentially others).

I very much hope you have a joyous and wonderful wedding day.

Life is complicated and when a member of family is an abuser, choices have to be made. You will face many times when difficult choices need to be made and people you love need to be protected from an abuser who is also part of your family. Stay strong and please don't take responsibility for your brothers actions and accept your mums choices are hers to make.

I'm speaking from experience and several painful lessons. It will get easier with time.

The brother does sound as if he has been enabled since being a child to become a gross attention seeker and a very manipulative person because nobody seems to have drawn any lines in the sand for him, but bent over backwards to accommodate his every step towards becoming a more and more unreasonable person.

Screw that
He is a dangerous violent man

She isn’t concerned about his disability, she’s concerned about his behaviour when pretending to be a woman, and the resulting impact of would have on her parents. People with disabilities can also behave in an unacceptable manner.

If your parents have t already planned extensively for his care once they can’t look after him… well they are even more neglectful and spineless than I initially thought

yes, a dangerous, violent and manipulative one at that.

As parents to a child with a disability, your parents will have gone through the process of grieving the life they thought they will have had with two children and will have been prepared for the possibility that they won’t be able to be at your wedding. The may have hoped for a local wedding in an environment your brother could have coped with, but they will have known that that might not happen.

They will also have grappled all his life with the guilt they feel around allocating the majority of their resources - time, attention, money, whatever - unequally between their children.

I’m sure they will feel it’s enough that you really wish they could be there. I think the kindest thing to them would be to come home and celebrate again, in a special way, just with them and your brother. Privately, personally, meaningfully to all of you. Your parents will have accepted they can’t be all the things to and for you. These are the dice we all throw when we choose to have children.

As for your feelings towards and about your brother: in my limited experience it’s so important to delineate what’s attributable to the disability and what isn’t. Easier said than done but necessary. Only the people involved can know this. And your parents need to be cut some slack for taking the easy option if that’s what you conclude they have done. It’s not easy being them. I don’t think anyone can say your brother is this or that because it’s so personal, it really does depend on him and his personality. But you wouldn’t be wrong to assert yourself with him in appropriate ways. He may have a disability, but that doesn’t mean he can get away with everything. Firm compassion to ALL, I always think.

Congrats on your upcoming wedding. Hope you have a wonderful day.

Oh love 😔

I’m married to a guy who is from a very traditional, Catholic, Eastern European family, so I know exactly how your brother would go over, and there’s no chance in hell he’d be attending.

Apart from anything else, and parking the trans thing, he just sounds like a completely self absorbed bully who won’t think twice of upsetting everyone, no matter how important it is to you.

It sounds so sad and rough all around, but you don’t have to self sacrifice your own beautiful moments in life to carry their burden. This is (hopefully!) a once in a lifetime event for you and your fiance. My in-laws would be absolutely mortified by him, and I wouldn’t shame them by allowing it honestly. He’s made his choices, he’s unwilling to ever accommodate yours.

So, please, with a clear conscience, make your own choice for once. He’ll survive, your parents will survive. It’s ok to have the wedding you both want without his drama. It’s beyond time for them all to realise he can do what he likes, but consequences will ensue

Absolutely, I’d have money on the fact that the wedding isn’t centred on him will suddenly equal op being banned from her parents home or them seeing her as it’s too triggering for him .