To exclude sibling from wedding due to their lifestyle choice?

[Salitnan]

This will be incredibly identifying to anyone who knows my family and quite controversial but it’s such a bloody niche situation that nobody can relate to and it’s hugely stressing me out. I’m not writing this as ragebait or to troll, it is a genuine situation I am dealing with.

I’m getting married next year. My partner of 5 years is from a very traditional, right-wing Eastern European country. My partner however is very tolerant and chill, as are most of his immediate family who also live in Western countries.

We’ve decided to get married in his home country, as it’s very affordable there and we can have a beautiful package in an area of outstanding natural beauty, and he can invite his dear godparents who he adores (and they adore him) who are scared of flying.

This is all well and good but one of my family members is presenting an issue. My brother (who is an adult in their mid-20s) has a learning disability. This is not a problem, but in the past year they have come out as transgender. This has been a massive struggle for us as there were no signs previously and it came out of nowhere, and they have insisted they are going ahead with the transition and they self-harm if anyone misgenders them or politely reminds them of etiquette in public places regarding toilets, or wearing appropriate clothing for a social situation etc. It has been extremely hard work for my aging parents, he lives with them full time. The learning disability alongside being transgender makes them massively vulnerable and they get stared at in public and often started on when in the city centre by lads, and they aren’t aware of their vulnerability. They insist on dressing incredibly provocatively (wig and heels, provocative clothes) as they say they feel insecure otherwise, and when I have tried to explain to them that women don’t necessarily dress like that, they self-harm. They insult people in public, not to their face, they will say it to my mum (will whisper in her ear “he looks like a twat”), but sometimes people have overheard and started on him and my mum has had to explain about his disability and fend them off.

I’m already in therapy to deal with complex feelings towards them from how they dominate my parents lives and how I felt neglected as a child due to the focus on them and their vulnerabilities. The recent coming out as transgender has brought up a lot of old resentment I had towards him which I had buried, and I’m trying to have the therapy so that I can have a bond with him going forward, but I can’t help but feel a sort of anger at him, and I hate myself for it.

Back onto the wedding topic - I’ve realised I simply don’t want them at the wedding. My fiancé’s family are nice people and wouldn’t be a danger to my brother but many of my fiancé’s extended family members are from a small isolated village in a Catholic Eastern European country and he will be stared at like a hawk, whispered about. To he quite frank he will stick out like a sore thumb with his clothes and hair. As awful as it sounds I will be embarrassed by him and on edge, and won’t be able to enjoy my day. My partner says he’ll notify everyone in advance that my brother will be there and what to expect but I just really can’t be doing with the stress of it all. It’s not just family it’s the the staff in the hotel, other members of the public around who might be drinking, and they will need to stay in the country a few days around the ceremony so lots of opportunity for things to go wrong. They have severe social anxiety due to their learning disability and have been known to sneak alcohol as a way to deal with this and this further increases their vulnerability as they lose their filter and say their mind in front of people.

I did try to compromise and said to my mum I’d be happy to have them if if they would be willing to tone down their dress in order to come to the wedding - dropping the wig and toning down their clothes, but they have become angry at this suggestion and have refused.

I’ve told my mum it may be the case that I can’t invite them, and therefore my parents can’t come either as they are his carers. My mum says she understands and we can have a do later on back in the UK.

I just want my day to not be dominated by him. I also don’t want to have to change the wedding plans that me and my partner are happy with just to suit him. Am I an awful person?

Someone going out if their way to dress and behave provocatively and deeply unpleasantly shouldn't take priority at his sister's wedding. Just occasionally you're are allowed to put yourself first those with mental health problems and a disability don't always come first and if Op's parents choose to always put OP second which they do by allowing the brother to dictate all terms then the compromise they suggested sounds perfect.

I think you go have your wedding with your dp's family in his country and have a nice reception with family at home when you return. Decorate. Wear your wedding attire. Have your entrance announced. A lovely backyard party would be safe and comfortable. 🩷💐

This is such a difficult and complex situation OP. It must be difficult trying to plan a great day for yourself and your partner and having the big issue of your brother to consider and handle.
Much better articulated and reasoned advice provided by others.
FWIW don't invite your brother and have a ceremony in UK to which he is invited.

Sorry missed that. Normally non verbal is used to describe people who don't talk at all. This sounds more like situational mutism but I appreciate that OP is closest to her own situation and describe it how she wants.

This. You can’t assume they’ll live to 100
and even if they did they wouldn’t be able to care for him. They should make plans while they can. And if they won’t then I wouldn’t feel guilty OP.

I'd definitely not have him at the wedding and I'd also go extremely low contact and not feel bad about it.

When your parents are no longer able to care for him what will happen?

'Them' and then 'him' ? Make your mind up, it's one sibling.

Do you really want to marry into an intolerant, narrow minded family? I am presuming your fiance does not share his famiy's ethos.

You could get married quietly here, have a small wedding, and then have a big celebratory do in his country which none of your family would expect to attend, having been to your wedding.

Think about it.

Really unfair and betrays a complete lack of understanding of the reality of OP's situation.

There is quite literally nothing of value in this post.

Why should anyone tolerate a sexist, emotional abusive individual?

She doesn’t want to get married here though. She’s allowed to choose where her wedding is.

Can you have 2 wedding celebrations one with husband
the other could be at home for your family and anyone who couldn’t make the away one?

100% agree with this. Adults with mild LD that I have worked with in the past can use smart phones, go on social media and read (at least basic reading skills) but struggle in many aspects of life in terms of decision making around their welfare and finances and struggle with life skills/independent living skills. Managing relationships appropriately for example is a huge one.

I’m so sorry OP, this sounds like such an incredibly difficult situation. As you say, your parents are living under a sort of tyranny with him. I think they need to hit the bulelt and put him unreported care so that they can come to the wedding. It’s not fair on them or you for them to miss it. As PP have said, the day will come when he needs care, so why kit start now (on a respite basis)?
Although a UK celebration is a good compromise too. Do you have any close friends who will come to the Balkan wedding?

OP I've read all your posts and this is a bigger problem than only your wedding day.

First off it's fine to not like your brother, and to be angry at your parents for a childhood where you were second to his needs. And still that pattern continues. You're left with two shitty choices for your wedding
1 Your brother attends and drama ensures
2 Your brother doesn't attend and consequently neither can your parents

Well he sounds unpleasant (not the learning difficulty or the fact he's trans, but the aggression, the rudeness, the inappropriate clothing, the manipulation, the self centredness etc) so it would be crazy to invite him and allow him to spoil your wedding day.

You've said that there's no plan for his care after your parents become unable to care for him/die. You also say he refuses respite care. And that he becomes angry and/or self harms by skin picking or biting himself if it's discused. It sounds like your parents are scared of him becoming angry, violent towards them and causing harm to himself. This is not a sustainable situation.

He absolutely needs to become used to being cared for in a different setting now, in a gentle incremental way, for the best interests of him and your parents. Can you imagine the emotional and physical breakdown facing him when circumstances mean that he needs to move into a care home/supported living situation on a permanent basis with no preparation or warning after a crisis with your parent's health or death.

I understand that outside care is not what he wants, but it's what has to happen. The self harm as you've described is very low level. The violence is blunted (literally, it was a butter knife) and a written threat. He's doing enough to scare you all into maintaining the status quo, not enough to cause real damage. It is incredibly manipulative and actually quite intelligent. Does he have a social worker? Do your parents? They need physical and practical support to get the ball moving and deal with his resultant tantrum in a safe way for everyone.

That's the only sane and safe thing that can happen. Him being trans, your wedding, your feelings about him are all incidental to the cluster fuck that's rolling towards your family in the next few years. And if he's able to tolerate a couple of days of respite care by the time your wedding roles round so your parents can attend that's a bonus.

It sounds like a really complicated situation, but you don't have to invite anyone to your wedding that you don't want to. And apart from anything else it doesn't seem like your sibling would be safe in that environment anyway. Can you have the wedding abroad and a second reception at home maybe even with a wedding blessing or something to make it feel more like a proper event so your parents don't feel like they missed your wedding. It's not uncommon at all to do something like that for all sorts of reasons. Or even better, as others have said, arrange some respite care. Your sibling is going to need to get used to different carers anyway as your parents are getting older, so better to start to get used to it sooner rather than later.

@Salitnan What an awful predicament. I am really sorry.

I don't have much advice but just wanted to celebrate your future DH who sounds like he is willing to have your brother attend the wedding and deal with the consequences, presumably out of his immense love for you. I would have expected many men, especially those from a conservative country, to have been the one saying "not in front of my family" so I am really impressed that he is not that person.

Just trying to think outside the box, but would there be any way you could invite your parents and brother to the wedding ceremony, but then pre-arrange with them that they will do something else lovely rather than join the wedding lunch, and then do something really lovely with your husband and them the next day, with lots of photos (though not in your wedding dress, clearly)? I suspect your parents would understand so the issue would be to manage your brother's reaction, but it may be possible to manage if you work together. Especially if the wedding ceremony and the lunch are at different venues so everyone leaves the ceremony and it is not so obvious when your parents and brother do not turn up at the lunch.

I understand your brother has mental health issues, but if you and your mum go in hard with the message that women dress a certain way for a wedding and it is disrespectful to you and your DH for him to wear inappropriate clothes on your day, and then help him find something that feels feminine to him but will be more toned down for you, that may help you all to get through the ceremony, have a few photos, and then have your parents extracate him before the alcohol begins to flow and any arguments begin.

I know there will be people on here who will lambast me for even considering finding a middle ground. If you really don't want to, then you just need to be honest with your brother.

Finally I dont know what it is about men and taste in women's clothes, but I agree that the number of trans people I see and think you would actually look a lot more convincing if you asked an actual woman to show you how to apply makeup and what clothes to wear. I remember years ago my DH and some of his friends decided to go to a fancy dress party in drag. They insisted the look they were going for was glamour but my God, they looked like the roughest bunch of prostitutes you could ever imagine.😂

It’s a truly unmanageable combination to be honest. someone who has a sibling with just a learning disability, or is just transgender won’t be able to fully understand. It’s the combination which has become utterly disastrous

That all sounds so hard op. I would not invite him to join you in your European wedding. I would have something else at home that he can join with.

I really feel for your mum and dad too. I would find that so hard to watch him have such a negative effect on their lives. Your poor dad, taking a 6'2 man dressed as a prostitute out to play crazy golf. My dad would never be able to deal with that so all credit to yours for trying so hard.

I have no suggestions or answers but I recognise how sad it all sounds. I think you're entirely reasonable in how you explain your feelings.

No it isnt, couples can get married where they like . You must mean it's "tradition" for some women to get their own way more.

But she isn't embarrassed about his disability and gender. Shes embarrassed at how he chooses to dress himself provocatively and inappropriately and is concerned for what may happen in a culture/situation where people may be less tolerant.

Read the posts properly.

It depends very much on which one. If it's one of those now in the EU, then legally they're likely to be fine. Elsewhere....? Probably a different matter.

I have relatives in an Eastern European Orthodox country. Those citizens in the capital city pride themselves on embracing diversity, etc. Elsewhere? Not so much.

I'll add that if the wedding is taking place in a Slavic speaking country, the likelihood is that the sibling will be constantly misgendered in the local language, given that Slavic languages are heavily gendered (even to the extent of the past tense of verbs). Of course, they're unlikely to be aware of it, but...

I’ve read your posts and I feel so sorry for your parents. Your brother is at the point in his life where he needs to be in supported housing and they can visit rather than being his carers. He can’t understand the social rules of society, this isn’t about trans, it’s far more complex. If he is in residential care then they can attend your wedding. At some point they need to step back whatever he is saying, and once he’s settled he might even prefer it. My dsd lives in residential care (very different disability) and it’s really good being just visitors rather than care

But just a thought, would thry be willing to wear a special outfit(s) for the wedding, feminine but not revealing ? Embracing the gender identity by taking them shopping

Congratulations @Salitnan .

As I said in another post, people are more likely to be understanding of his dress etc in the capital city, but your brother's out-of-control behaviour will not be tolerated anywhere.

In fact, from what you've said about his mental health issues and learning disability, I don't see how he could cope with the wedding in any country at all.

You might be able to hold a second very small 'wedding breakfast' when you return home?

But why, it sounds like she’s had to spend her whole life bending over backwards to accommodate her family. Her wedding is the one day about her and her partner, why should they have to make sacrifices?