To exclude sibling from wedding due to their lifestyle choice?

[Salitnan]

This will be incredibly identifying to anyone who knows my family and quite controversial but it’s such a bloody niche situation that nobody can relate to and it’s hugely stressing me out. I’m not writing this as ragebait or to troll, it is a genuine situation I am dealing with.

I’m getting married next year. My partner of 5 years is from a very traditional, right-wing Eastern European country. My partner however is very tolerant and chill, as are most of his immediate family who also live in Western countries.

We’ve decided to get married in his home country, as it’s very affordable there and we can have a beautiful package in an area of outstanding natural beauty, and he can invite his dear godparents who he adores (and they adore him) who are scared of flying.

This is all well and good but one of my family members is presenting an issue. My brother (who is an adult in their mid-20s) has a learning disability. This is not a problem, but in the past year they have come out as transgender. This has been a massive struggle for us as there were no signs previously and it came out of nowhere, and they have insisted they are going ahead with the transition and they self-harm if anyone misgenders them or politely reminds them of etiquette in public places regarding toilets, or wearing appropriate clothing for a social situation etc. It has been extremely hard work for my aging parents, he lives with them full time. The learning disability alongside being transgender makes them massively vulnerable and they get stared at in public and often started on when in the city centre by lads, and they aren’t aware of their vulnerability. They insist on dressing incredibly provocatively (wig and heels, provocative clothes) as they say they feel insecure otherwise, and when I have tried to explain to them that women don’t necessarily dress like that, they self-harm. They insult people in public, not to their face, they will say it to my mum (will whisper in her ear “he looks like a twat”), but sometimes people have overheard and started on him and my mum has had to explain about his disability and fend them off.

I’m already in therapy to deal with complex feelings towards them from how they dominate my parents lives and how I felt neglected as a child due to the focus on them and their vulnerabilities. The recent coming out as transgender has brought up a lot of old resentment I had towards him which I had buried, and I’m trying to have the therapy so that I can have a bond with him going forward, but I can’t help but feel a sort of anger at him, and I hate myself for it.

Back onto the wedding topic - I’ve realised I simply don’t want them at the wedding. My fiancé’s family are nice people and wouldn’t be a danger to my brother but many of my fiancé’s extended family members are from a small isolated village in a Catholic Eastern European country and he will be stared at like a hawk, whispered about. To he quite frank he will stick out like a sore thumb with his clothes and hair. As awful as it sounds I will be embarrassed by him and on edge, and won’t be able to enjoy my day. My partner says he’ll notify everyone in advance that my brother will be there and what to expect but I just really can’t be doing with the stress of it all. It’s not just family it’s the the staff in the hotel, other members of the public around who might be drinking, and they will need to stay in the country a few days around the ceremony so lots of opportunity for things to go wrong. They have severe social anxiety due to their learning disability and have been known to sneak alcohol as a way to deal with this and this further increases their vulnerability as they lose their filter and say their mind in front of people.

I did try to compromise and said to my mum I’d be happy to have them if if they would be willing to tone down their dress in order to come to the wedding - dropping the wig and toning down their clothes, but they have become angry at this suggestion and have refused.

I’ve told my mum it may be the case that I can’t invite them, and therefore my parents can’t come either as they are his carers. My mum says she understands and we can have a do later on back in the UK.

I just want my day to not be dominated by him. I also don’t want to have to change the wedding plans that me and my partner are happy with just to suit him. Am I an awful person?

Don't let all these people who are trying to shame you succeed. Your husband-to-be's family are just as important in this equation as your own. Your mum has already proposed the perfect solution, and you should take it.Go have your lovely wedding, like she wants you to; then she won't have to feel guilty that this is yet another thing your brother has spoiled for you. And have a small private blessing ceremony when you come home, just for your family circle.

Your brother does sound like a very manipulative person. The self-harming and the transness are two sides of the same coin - the way he forces everyone around him to bend to his will. Sooner or later, though, he will have to get used to it. Your parents will not be able to care for him forever. You don't say how old he is, but it'\s never too late to start learning. He'll be happier when he learns to be manipulative, too.

I'm unable to edit my last comment but wanted to add in Scotland I would consider making an Adult Protection referral if not open to services currently as this could instigate that. Unfortunately I'm unsure of English equivalent.

I don't know many women who would want to spend a lot of time in the company of a 6ft 2 bloke who insists on dressing in an ultra sexualised parody of a woman who threatens violence it you point out that you don't like it. Brother or not.

Wow, what a snarky overreaction. Her brother is a violent male who manhandles her mother and holds a knife to people's throats and also leaves violent notes in toilets.
Maybe read all of OP's posts before responding.

And as many others have said, he won't be able to fly and he will most likely be arrested in the other country.

Quite aside from the wedding (which I wouldn't be inviting him to as he can't behave/dress appropriately) I really think you need to start having some difficult conversations with your parents about the future OP. I would be making it crystal clear that you won't be picking up his care when your parents can no longer look after him and pointing out that unless they start transitioning him into supported living now he is going to be left high and dry when anything happens to them. With a bit of luck that might also mean they actually get a bit of peace while they're still young enough to enjoy it.

To be fair, her sibling sounds really dislikable.

My thoughts too. You are prioritising your in-laws over your own parents and I find that very sad.

Oh god no, do not feel guilty at all. It's your day and you both deserve to enjoy it and not have it hijacked. Your mum gets it. Don't you dare invite them darling xxx

He is disabled though as a result of being deprived of oxygen at birth.

He CANNOT go to the wedding in the UK! Not even for a little while. You're not getting it! She can't have him there for a few reasons. He will cause problems with her new inlaws for one, and two, he is a violent male.

So saying you'd have it in this country is irrelevant because they CANNOT BRING HIM to any wedding, point blank!

I wouldnt want a manipulative violent attention seeking man anywhere near me either. Youve had to grit your teeth your entire life whilst an attention seeking manipulative abusive bully is pandered to but you absolutely dont need to put up with it anymore and you shouldnt feel the slightest bit of guilt.

This is your wedding and he would clearly do something to overshadow it if he were there. As for the self harm every time something happens that he doesnt like, its just another form of manipulation and control. He knows exactly what he is doing.

I feel sorry for your parents but they need to start making it clear to him that he is no longer the one in control and stop pandering to his ridiculous and abusive behaviour. If he becomes violent then the police need to be called and he needs to be removed from the home and social services involved.

Having a learning disability does not excuse or entitle him to threaten anyone or to behave in this way. Its time that your parents started looking at respite care and other care provision and accomodation for him because they wont be able to look after him indefinitely and shouldnt have to spend the rest of their lives tiptoeing round him and nor should anyone else.

And do you actually think he’d agree to leave or the parents wouldn’t just continue to implore op to allow the behaviour within the #beeekiiiind command?

yet another example of the “why can’t everyone else move everything to satisfy one selfish arse” theme!

I'm struggling to see what is actually likable about this sibling?
People with LD aren't a monolith, some are lovely people and great to spend time with, others are manipulative and cruel.

I think OP should have a ceremony in her DP's country, maybe live streamed for her parents and a party back in the UK.

Your parents should be able to attend your wedding without your brother. They need respite. Up to them if they're willing to do that, I doubt they are but that is their decision.
Otherwise enjoy your day, no-one needs that kind of stress on their wedding day.

The op is the most important as its her day, and shes had a lifetime of her needs being placed second.
The mum should be looking into care options for the sibling now anyway as they're in their 70s and they will soon not be able to care for the sibling properly and the wedding would be a good time to try some options, and mum could do with a little break away for her daughters wedding.

But having the wedding in the UK doesn't stop the sibling becoming violent does it? The parents can't just leave - the follow up posts make it clear that they can't manage the behavioural issues, given that the OP's dad was threatened with a knife.

So what you're really saying, is that it doesn't matter whether OP's wedding is ruined because guests are threatened, or the police have to attend, or someone is injured. Her feelings, or that of her fiance, don't matter. The sibling and parents must be prioritised at all costs. You're just covering it up and belittling OP's concerns by referring to 'scenic venues'.

Have a heart. Honestly.

You should absolutely have the wedding you want. A smaller celebration that includes your parents back home would be a great compromise so everyone can be included.

The people saying OP shouldn't exclude him are completely glossing over the sexually inappropriate nature of his behaviour. Dressing overtly sexual and entering women's toilets as a large man dressed that way can easily be interpreted as sexual harassment. The aggressive behaviour he has previously shown alongside this will make him terrifying to random women he comes across and he could be a physical threat to them if they don't react in the way he wants.

I'm gender critical and know a fair few trans people who I get along with perfectly well. Some I would happily invite to my wedding. That is because they act and dress like normal people as do I despite the fact we have political and philosophical differences.

I would not invite someone who acted in ways that make others feel threatened or uncomfortable. I'd include in that a straight married couple I know who lean heavily into poly stuff, dress quite provocatively, post erotic pics online and are always trying to get people to shag them. I keep them very much at arm's length.

It's the behaviour, not the identity that would make this an easy decision for me.

Edit: I would also expect his sister's wedding to be very triggering for a man like this. His sister, an actual woman, being a beautiful bride. Something he will never be. He won't be able to cope with the jealousy and will likely cause significant problems.

You are absolutely right not to want him at your wedding as it sounds like the day would end up being all about him. I think although you feel you are therefore excluding your parents you are not. They are enabling his controlling and abusive behaviour towards them and accepting that he will not attend respite care is part of them doing so. I’m not saying it’s easy for them of course but equally you are also their child.

I'm a mother to children with learning disabilities. They have extremely difficult behaviour and so I completely get where you are coming from. As they are still children we have got very good at whisking them away at family events when things start but I know when they're adults it won't be possible to do this. You do not want to spend your wedding on eggshells wondering whether your brother will self harm etc. I think you should have your planned wedding abroad and then a small, private celebration with your family afterwards.

There's not a great deal you can do to make the situation easier on anyone. You don't want him to attend your special day for fear of what could happen and this is totally understandable. It's a shame one of your parents couldn't attend.

So her fiancé is presumably also prioritising his in-laws by having the wedding in the UK, and also assuring that his other family members cannot attend?

Putting to one side the issues with the brother, this is a common problem for couples marrying who come from different countries. One of them has to compromise. It is not a ‘destination’ or ‘overseas / scenic’ wedding. My DH is from an EU country. We married in the UK, so my DH’s family and friends travelled to us. We later held a small reception in his country for those relatives unable to travel.

There is always going to be a loser in this scenario, but if the brother attends the wedding, be it in UK or the other country, OP will also be a loser, due to the added stress.

Reading your OP, I wouldn't invite him. You can be a little self-righteous - it's not a bad thing. If this one person will cause upset for you and so many others and they aren't willing to compromise themselves for others, I don't understand the dilemma.

Also, someone said it mustn't be a learning disability- it is perfectly possible to have a mild LD (IQ less than 70 but not less than, I think 50) and behave like this. I recognise some of the behaviours, mannerisms and vulnerabilities OP is talking about with people I know with an LD or borderline LD. They are significantly disabled and very vulnerable, even if they can talk and have capacity to make lots of their day to day decisions.

Surely the solution is to have the wedding abroad and a blessing in this country?

Why should her parents, specifically, be ‘top of the list’? Along with her brother, who she doesn’t want there no matter what country the wedding is in?

What is ‘top of the list’ is what OP and her husband want for their wedding.