To think Starmer will be gone by the end of Friday? Or will it be Monday evening?

[SingleSexSpacesInSchools]

Whoever you are voting for today, it's probably not Labour - they might loose 2,000 seats.

How long exactly will it be before he resigns?

@MNLurker1345 I wasn't talking about dissatisfaction with the government. Obviously there is no denying there is a lot of that around because they haven't managed to reverse 14 years of destruction within two years, the media is hostile and one-sided and, yes, there have been some mistakes. There have also been some successes but you never hear about those.

However, I was referring specifically to the calls for Starmer to go. Those are coming from the left of the party and from people who would never, ever vote Labour in a million years, such as posters on this thread. I really don't think that very many of the people who voted Reform on Thursday would vote Labour if only Andy-thinks-he's-god-Burnham was in charge.

That was my point - people who want Starmer to stand down do not have the best interests of the Labour party, or the country, at heart.

I think he will stay for a while and hope he will the constant changing of PM just because they are not popular with the public is not good for the country

PM’s have to make decisions that are not popular and they are not always charismatic crowd pleasers like Boris Johnson or Tony Blair

those that really seem to despise him often make the claim that he is the most disliked PM ever. I think this is purely talk from the media that has been picked up as nothing he has done has been particularly divisive like say Thatcher.

The party lacks clear vision at present but they have a huge majority in HOP, Starmer pushed back on the left of the party and cleaned up the damage the left did to the party. I, like a number of Labour supporters are frustrated that with a huge majority that Labour has it was used better they could make some really radical changes that would be popular but it isn’t Starmers style of politics

for now I think he is better staying where he is and getting on with the job

It’s not just the media. Look at Wales. Labour losing control after 100 years.

‘You lot’ - nice.

It’s funny you mention that. Look at this scenario - many of us who happen to believe that this Labour government is on its last legs, take a financial (long) position, premised on the markets rallying once Labour are out. Labour duly get booted out, the markets rally, and we generate a M2M (paper) gain.

i.e. We assume risk, and yet, according to ‘your lot’, that’s unearned income and/or we are ‘hoarding wealth’, and should be penalised.

Right there, is a classic example of all that is wrong with socialism.

Thank F it will not be with us much longer.

@unistress, you clearly can separate dislike for Starmer from dissatisfaction with the government. Yes, I see that some can hold that
position. Fair enough.

On Starmer, he has to stay. He won’t be resigning this side of the party conference season, I don’t think. His reason, as he said yesterday, is that him leaving would result in chaos.

The UK is in a bad way, but we are
holding up, despite being hugely fragmented. He is managing to suppress the anger and dissatisfaction in his party, if he resigns, his party, not the country will descend into chaos.

Labour is not "socialist" in its current incarnation by any stretch of the imagination, it's slightly left of centre.

It's also not a government on its "last legs" - they still have a massive parliamentary majority, and will have for the next three years.

Hell no, he won’t go!

It could be managed, it’s not actually that hard. But they need someone willing and ready and that seems to be lacking rn unless AB makes a move. That takes a lot and safe seats for Labour are in short supply.

I said about him being the most disliked PM

i am well aware at how badly they have done, I think people are disappointed and have looked elsewhere thinking that party will do a better job I don’t think that is driven by this so called hatred of Starmer people are frustrated that life isn’t getting any better

Labour have come in to fix the country, this will take years and against the world issues had complicated it even more and life isn’t improving for many of us (I include myself) but it was never going to change overnight

Labour has poor PR too, Starmer isn’t someone that connects with the public but him going isn’t going to magically going to improve things

From a fiscal standpoint alone - it’s socialist, believe me. Many of us on MN can vouch for that - via shuttered SME’s, job losses, disrupted children etc.

As to the rest of your post - are you actually listening to what the electorate are saying? Or are you simply another of the deniers suffering acute confirmation bias.

Denial which will not prevent the inevitable.

God, why are right-wing people so easily offended and fragile?

Anyway, you've shown your hand here nice and clearly. You are pissed off that Starmer's government is actually governing for the many not the few. Darren Jones put it beautifully in the house a couple of weeks ago, even though by many metrics it would hardly be considered to be the socialism you fear so much.

I'm sure all those voters in the North East and other post-red wall areas will be absolutely delighted though if your prediction comes true and in a few years shareholders are raking in dividends. I've no doubt that's exactly what they voted for.

Deep dislike for Starmer is an issue that came up on the doorstep, even Labour MPs and canvassers have said this.

Labour have a tough choice, stay with someone who seems to drive a high rise in Reform voting or break with Labour tradition and find someone else.

I'm sure all those voters in the North East and other post-red wall areas will be absolutely delighted though if your prediction comes true and in a few years shareholders are raking in dividends. I've no doubt that's exactly what they voted fo

These areas are voting now for the same thing they voted in a Labour landslide victory for but which was never delivered. Change.

Gas-lighting and further sweeping generalisations - keep going.

You’re wrong - I am for self determination, entrepreneurship and a social safety net for only the most needy. That’s what many voted for yesterday - ignore it at your peril.

Otherwise, you show a fundamental lack of understanding about capital, and capitalism.

But you have a brain - that is exactly it - the problem is it’s hard to be radical on shirt buttons and constantly fire fighting international wars and a buffoon in the White House constantly changing what you are dealing with - very easy to vote Farage as nothing proven - easy to think he woukd be great when he probably is all mouth and no trousers - he’s getting slicker looking by the week! I think he would be useless and not accept scrutiny of any kind but there’s only one way for people to find out - having had a business for years you net a lot of bullshitting confident, charismatic Farage types, usually to be found flkecing a company and then vanishing - guess the public need to find this out themselves- we are leaving UK - not staying around for this arse and the fact so many working class in particular are truly taken in by this slick conman shows it’s not the place for me to stay

You are wrong on one aspect - a lot of the most needy will be the idiots voting for it - they just don’t realise it yet -played straight into the hands of people like yourself - I’m entrepreneurial too and a business, doesn’t turn you into a nasty piece of work - you know full well many not very well educated voted not realising cut this cut that, remove xyz means ‘them’

I know he is disliked but I think this is media driven rather than like Thatcher where it was driven by policies that caused huge divisions in society

Labours poor PR has not helped this and agree by the next election he needs to be replaced but a change right now I can’t see how that will be good for the county

and Labour shouldn’t react so quickly it damaged the Tories learn from that

and AR is not the right person so Labour need to hold off and plan this carefully

It's extremely ironic that most Reform voters are likely to be older, in poorer health, in lower paid jobs and more dependent on benefits than most people, and they'll soon discover that the party will absolutely screw them over. But hey, they'll get rid of the brown people!

Our benefits system is already considerably less generous than that of most other European nations.

He's meant to be making a speech today I think. Couldn't believe yesterday when he said he was leading Labour into the next election. What is wrong with those people. Nigel Farage of course is delighted. He has far more chance of winning with KS in charge. But so has next door's cat.

@Upstartled Presumably the same thing they voted in a Labour landslide victory for but which was never delivered.

Was never?! They've had two years which have followed 14 years of economic mismanagement.

You’re wrong - I am for self determination, entrepreneurship and a social safety net for only the most needy. That’s what many voted for yesterday - ignore it at your peril. Otherwise, you show a fundamental lack of understanding about capital, and capitalism. @Hallowedturf That doesn't make me wrong about you at all. That is exactly the kind of thing I would have predicted you to 'believe in'.

I understand capitalism perfectly well thank you. It hasn't delivered for the people in the 'left behind' areas and successive governments haven't done anything about it (including Blair's Labour). The sad thing is that wealthy people like you are using people in those areas to vote for a party that will do absolutely nothing for them and convinced them that 'boat people' are to blame for the position they are in.

I think the only way to defeat Reform is to actually let them be in charge for a while. They won't last, they'll actually have to do some bloody work for a start, and people will realise what a bunch of incompetent grifters they are. If they win the next election, they'll never win another one again.

Simplistic populist crap sounds appealing, but the world is a complex place, and on the international stage, Starmer is well respected and has fought the UK's corner very effectively at a time of crisis and instability. I'd far rather have that than Farage blowing rude farty noises at everyone.

The first autumn budget delivered by Reeves saw them renege on their promise not to increase taxes, and then they said they would create growth whilst hobbling businesses with legislation and further taxation - this precipitated hikes in inflation whist increasing youth unemployment. The moment they got going, it was plain that the fiscal competence they floated in the manifesto wasn't on the table.

They didn’t promise not to increase taxes, the pledge was not to increase income tax, NI or VAT. And they haven’t. It’s a real shame about NI because reversing Hunt’s unaffordable cut would have netted a very useful £10 billion.

Lammy made a really stupid comment yesterday about pilots not changing mid flight. I mean, I know what he was trying to say, but it was a crap example when that’s exactly what pilots do.

The manifesto said, "We will not raise rates of National Insurance". There was no caveat to say they were only referring to employee contributions. That is therefore a broken promise because they have increased NICs paid by employers.