To think Starmer will be gone by the end of Friday? Or will it be Monday evening?

[SingleSexSpacesInSchools]

Whoever you are voting for today, it's probably not Labour - they might loose 2,000 seats.

How long exactly will it be before he resigns?

Perhaps because having seen the increasing level of chaos that accompanied the changes of PM, Labour are also aware it's not an easy fix, for party or country? Lots of negative comment now about the churn of leader after leader. It is disruptive and it's far from clear that it would help in the longer term.

Complex, because it's still the case that too many jobs don't pay enough for people to live on. The UK is still in the mindset that the wealthy must be given more money to motivate them, whilst those who are not wealthy must have money taken away from them. The wage multiple is ridiculous. Ultimately the problem is inequality - but addressing that will take a change of mindset.

It should not be possible for someone to work full time and still need benefits. But it is - and that is not the fault of the benefit recipients.

In terms of sickness and disability benefits there are solutions, but they are not cheap, quick or easy. We've spent over decade running down the NHS - I've watched inpatient beds in mental health being closed. Now we're paying for it, with the added whammy of COVID on top. If you want people to work, they have to be well enough to work. If you want people to work when they have been out of the workplace a long time, those people will need support. My Trust runs a support programme aimed at getting people with serious mental ill health back in the workplace and sustaining that. It's highly effective but again, not cheap.

Unless we invest in getting people well, nothing will change - and leaving people without the means to feed, house and clothe themselves is a sure route to major social unrest.

The UK spent 14 years shooting itself in the foot - austerity, when other countries were doing stimulus. Then Brexit. It's a mess. Reform promises easy fixes. There are none.

Your previous powers of prediction have not served you well, Bloss, so forgive me if I don’t bet the farm on Starmer’s tenure….

Eluned Morgan lost her seat and has stepped down as welsh Labour leader.

I think that as high a scalp as this election will take TBH - I don't think Starmer will go at all.

I am no fan of the Labour Party whatsoever but as they are on a hiding to nothing if they carry on like this I would look at doing something really bold.

Do something about the small boats. Something really bold. Don’t mess around at the edges. No benefits for anyone coming to the UK with no ID. Process people on boats with the Home Office in situ. I used to work as a supplier for the Home Office. A lazy bunch who just look to move around bits of paper and make their jobs part of a cottage industry until they retire. They have no interest in speeding processing up.

Form a hit squad to look at benefits. PIP is spiralling out of control. Face to face reviews. Have a team investigating any fraud. Yes, THERE is fraud. No one wants to admit it and apparently there isn’t the resources to do so.

No more triple lock.

Mandatory tax to support your old age payable out of your benefits or pay check. Ring fence that money to be used for elderly care only.

Ban all phones in schools. Full stop.

Zero tolerance for low level crime. My friend working in retail got hit in the face by someone a few months ago. He decided to do a smash and grab and turned a corner on his way running out and my friend was just going on her break. He couldn’t get round her without assaulting her.

Make it attractive to start a new business.

Stop the rot in our high streets where shops close down and stay closed for years. Discount the rent for example. With the shop empty you aren’t getting any rent.

Sure. But Starmer is hurting Labour very badly. There comes a time when you have to push out an abysmal leader.

No this is a complete blood bath, absolute - I just thought it would be even worse

For people to look at these numbers and go - well thats not so bad - is a huge misunderstanding of how bad it is.

Do this and you take the wind ENTIRELY out of Reforms sails. Good.

What prediction have I made that proved to be wrong?

It’s better so far than the most optimistic prediction - definitely not a bloodbath.

The feedback is it’s the leader, it leaves Labour with a decision. They could easily do better without him.

As things stand, it will be a better result for Labour than they achieved under Gordon Brown in 2009 and much better than Starmer achieved last year. It will also be better than the Tories managed last year.

Blossom - if you don’t think it’s a bloodbath then I think you need to have a lie down! If they don’t change their ways pronto a lot of LP MP’s are just going to be there for one term!

Labour - pull yourselves together. Get a high profile issue and bloody fix it!

They need a a new approach. On Sky they have Liz Kendall. She says the results have been ‘truly terrible’ and this comes from a Labour MP.

Labour unrest about Starmer among Labour MPs is apparently beginning, according to the BBC.

She says LP have made unnecessary mistakes such as Winter Fuel and not showing their plan (they clearly don’t have one!).

Surely nobody is pretending it isn’t catastrophic for Labour? Oh wait…

He won’t go of his own accord. But there will be significant pressure to bring Andy Burnham in. Someone who has the vocal ability needed.
Starmer is not engaging enough. And Labour needs someone who is.
MP’s will feel the heat of these results.
Starmer will cite the war etc. And that is a valid point. But as to whether he leads into another election we shall see.
He may be biding his time waiting for Reform Councils to go belly up in competence and management.

As said upthread it’s not Starmer, it’s the policies people hate.

You want things to get worse? Sounds like you are hoping for it.

It’s Starmer. Approval of the party is much higher than his personal ratings.

There are real problems past and present but
saying every one of them can be laid solely at the feet of Conservative governments is just lazy.

Housing, social care, NHS pressure, energy costs, debt and poor infrastructure are long term structural failures. Past and present governments have contributed to this.

We must also see things from a societal level, and take into consideration the fact
that we all should contribute in order to redistribute.

Concern about tax and debt is not “wishing misfortune” on anyone, is it? Another lazy refrain. It is just asking whether the state can keep providing more than the economy can sustain.

As a left winger you have every right to bleat on about inequality and your entitled right to redistribution.

I think Labour have been a disgrace. They have been in two years and we have have u turn after u turn. They have a huge majority. Bloody well use it and make a difference.

Starmer is the best of a bad job. Labour will be booted out at the next election regardless.

I would vote for a Tory/Reform coalition. I suspect millions of other voters will too. Labour are finished.

He isn’t the best of a bad job. He’s dragged the party so far to the right that he has isolated very many constituents. He u turned whenever this was made clear to him forcefully enough.

Totally agree and it doesn’t much matter who is in charge now and what they do policy wise, they will just limp on for the rest of their term and then goodbye.

Oh well, that will improve things for ordinary people. Not.