Lucy Letby new evidence

[Gonnagetgoingreturnsagain]

https://www.thejusticegap.com/new-research-undermining-letbys-convictions-for-insulin-

https://www.healthcare-management.uk/police-arrest-lucy-letby-hospital

New evidence out re this case. Any views? Sorry but think first link won’t work so will reposts.

If Lucy was the sole problem, and had been successfully removed, why did the consultants feel the need for a downgrade at all? It's not as if one couldn't put in extra safeguards against serial killers, based on their experience. It is nonsensical from that perspective, and points to them knowing the problems were not with one member of staff.

It's really not looking "more likely it's a cover up" at all. Before she arrived, the baby unit was performing well. It was not for the most sick babies, the unit was designed to care for babies with medical needs from 27 weeks gestation, rather than intensive care for extremely premature or sick babies. 99% of babies should- and before Letby arrived- DID- leave well and alive. All this scapegoat/cover up speculation is ridiculous. The scapegoat argument makes no sense at all . The consultants had to fight to get their concerns addressed. There was a lot of push back from the nursing managers who protected Letby, moving her from night shifts to day shifts, encouraging her to raise a grievance when she was taken off the unit after the deaths of two healthy triplets.
After the grievance procedure cleared Letby, there was a plan to get her back on the unit. Despite being threatened with being reported to the GMC, the doctors insisted she could not be reinstated.

Most crucially: all of the babies families- both the ones she killed and the ones she tried to kill and left with life changing injuries remain absolutely convinced she did it. Unlike you or me- they knew her. Saw her. At the time grew increasingly concerned about her some tried to move babies to other hospitals to get away from her and some, luckily succeeded. They are begging for this speculation to just stop. They sat through the 10 month trial. Heard evidence you have not. Knew her at the time. Just leave it.

I expect it will be quiet until we hear the CCRC decision,

Please cite your sources that parents tried to get their children moved solely becausebof concerns about Lucy Letby.

That's my guess, unless and until more information about last week's arrests is released. Not much to comment on at the moment, and who knows how long the CCRC decision may take? There's a lot gone on there since they got the application.

Rachel Nickell’s partner and parents were convinced Colin Stagg was responsible for her murder. The opinions of those affected are not evidence and should not ever be taken as such.

Are there any guesses on how long that might take?

In your opinion

The downgrade was effected by the hospital board following the RCPCH report which found that the unit did not have the resources, staffing or expertise to be operating at Level 2. (Gaps in nursing rota, no neonatologists, only 2 consultant ward rounds per week, poor incident reporting, risk management etc). It said at least 2 additional consultants would be needed before any consideration of re-designation as at Level 2 would be considered.

Meredith Kercher’s parents still seem to believe Amanda Knox was responsible despite the fact that actual perpetrator, who was ultimately convicted, had strong forensic evidence against him. (Incidentally he is now out of prison and is due to stand trial for new charges of rape and physical assault of his girlfriend.)

To be fair to the parents in this case - they never noticed or accused LL of anything at the time. They went through the trauma of losing their babies and then the police turned up and told them they and been murdered. That is entirely on the police.

To be fair to MK’s parents they still believe Amanda Knox was involved in some way with her murder. Sex game gone wrong?

There are lots of other opinions out there including medical professionals.

Well quite. But there is no evidence anyone else was involved other than perpetrator. The inclusion of Knox and Sollicito was the invention of the Italian magistrate. ‘Sex game gone wrong’ is just a ruse of defence lawyers to defend men who have committed sexual murders.

(I’m Italian btw, people have no conception how corrupt the Italian justice system is.)

People whose loved ones have been murdered, or who've been told they were by institutions they ought to be able to trust, are not oracles. Nor should anyone expect them to be, or hold them up as such.

I agree. I think what has been done to the parents in this case by the police and judiciary in this case is unconscionable.

I’d think it likely that at least some will hold onto her guilt even once the convictions are overturned just to preserve their mental health. Can you imagine having to process the concept that 10 years of your life had been a traumatic, exhausting lie?

Comparing this to Colin Stagg and Amanda Knox is ridiculous. The families in these cases didn't know the accused. However, in this case the dozens of babies parents got to know Letby/spent days/weeks with her, witnessed her themself, many incredibly concerned even then. The number of victims families who all are sure of her guilt as well as the fact they themselves saw her interacting with their babies, the victims, makes this entirely different.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c2435112z7do

It doesn't bear thinking about.

This is why it can be so distasteful when people do the what about the parents spiel, particularly those where one can't feel confident they'd give the same level of precedence to the parents views if they disagreed with them.

I completely agree with the mother in question that the hospital were trying to hide things and that the trust were not being clear with her. I think irrespective of what we believe as individuals we are probably all inclined to think she was correct. I also think we all have compassion for her and for the other parents and families affected.

But she cannot say Letby is guilty or not. Truthfully, the only one who really knows is Letby herself. But miscarriages of justice are not in anyone’s interest, no matter how much hatred has been invested at this point.

https://lawhealthandtech.substack.com/p/ll-part-8-the-death-of-child-d

With regard to Baby D. The mother was indeed let down, in many many ways. The BBC article suggests she felt uneasy having Lucy in the room, which could be for many unstated reasons, but I can't see a reference to asking to have Baby D removed. Are there other instances of this?

Yes I know the Italian justice system is wrong and corrupt. Still some people still think that Knox was involved somehow in the murder. How we will never know. Like you probably know the Italian police made mistakes with cross contaminating the evidence in the first place. Knox doesn’t help herself by saying stupid things now like she wants to visit Meredith’s grave, that is the last thing her family want. If she’s innocent they want her to go away and be quiet.

Of course some people think that she was involved, but that’s entirely on Mignini for targeting her and Sollecito ending in their conviction, and the misogynist media coverage of the case.

There may be people who still think Barry George killed Jill Dando for all we know.

Some people believe what they read in the papers and then don’t have the intellectual flexibility to change tack and accept they were wrong.

Correct.

That does not however prove her innocence which was stated in the post I responded to. Hence pointing out that it was that posters opinion.

@MistressoftheDarkSide

Developments that have come to light?

By whom, was there an official inquiry that released some findings? No I didn’t think so

Articles by the media cannot be relied upon as fact.

What did the police do that upset you? If it’s a serious as you imply then are they being investigated? If not why not since you claim to be basing your opinion on something so concrete (what though?, do you have insider knowledge?)

Roy Meadows - he talks about coincidence but then that is nothing compared to the coincidence in this case, time after time. Letby and her team had the opportunity to bring a statistical expert to the stand and they decided not to.

Gunning for the consultants is odd - they didn’t think she was a murderer they thought she was not caring for babies as she should be. I am very surprised at how hard they had to push to get her off the ward. If that process was easier then we could have seen what was occurring when she wasn’t on the ward. As it happens though when she wasn’t on shift nothing was occurring.

If those rotas were wrong - she could have easily shown that through her phone data/texts etc that she wasn’t in work when they said she was. But that didn’t happen?

Experts available to her team were not called for strategic reasons - I’m certain she knows those reasons. She could talk about why? Or her PR team could but strangely they have decided not to do so.

Whatever you say.

I do however take some issue with the hypocrisy of your assertion that media articles cannot be relied upon as fact when pointing to the possibility of a MOJ, yet media articles luridly reporting on tenuous pointers of guilt were gobbled up as gospel by the hang em and flog em brigade.

The rest of your comment is in nearly every area factually untrue. Plenty was happening when Lucy Letby wasn't on shift. One example was air on an X-ray that allegedly demonstrated harm caused by her. And then the narrative changed because actually the timeline was all wrong.

It's all been discussed at kength on multiple MN threads and by plenty of independent experts.

And if the consultants had issues with her practise as opposed to deliberate harm that's hardly a police matter.